Council Of First Knowledge, Jedi Temple Training Facility

[Wisher619]

Well I don't think I have much choice. With a flip every 60 days, my plants veging 60 days should×4 fill out my 1K foot print right when flipped to flower. 8 plants veging 60 days after stretching in flower would have been more than £ probably could have handled...
On another note.... this runt is getting thick with good colas. I trimmed a Lil more under growth, and a couple spindly branches that were completely at the bottom with practically nothing on them... I yanked that shit. This is for me. I want good bud! So I am drying the spindly shit. Do I put it in a zip lock in the freezer after its dry till I want to make hash out of it?

if you dry it.....and you are making Ice Hash....then yeah
if you get some screens and want to make hash that way....then just keep it dry

 

[Wisher619]

That was an awesome idea. I Never Thought About The Idea That I Could Make 2 Different ARANGMENTS With Different spacing.. Closer Together For veg, And Further Apart For flower. That is perfect Wish! That remedies just about all the problems.....

and to build out the space.....2x4 framing and some obs and white paint

 

[Wisher619]

I think that runt is gonna net me 56 to 70 grams. It just has a lot more branches with bigger cola and they are thicker. More dense. And they got 2 weeks to go still. From watching the other 2 plants and their flowering cycle, I am predicting as much yield from it as the other 2 combined almost. I am not setting my heart on it, just predicting from what I see. So we will see....

might be more dense then you think

 

[Wisher619]

when comparing say 8 bulb 52watt t5 ho to say a 600w mh, what would be the comparisons? Such as lumens, par, and difference in cost of electricity?
I notice that mh bulbs seem to be not as bright as say their hps counterpart. Does that mean that they are actually using less power than 600w? it all can get a little confusing.
And while browsing i keep reading about this cmh 315w lights. are you familiar with them. They advertise 600w output for 350w of true power draw. That seems really nice. Is it bullshit, or a good light. Just trying to understand lights, par, lumens, and electricity costs.
I also notice you know a lot about led lights. And you plan to use one, or already do.. I never notice you trying to push those light on me. any reason why? Are you not happy with your light at the moment, or just figure that the expense of a good led is just something i need to worry about down the road?
Either way, you know me,,, I always have questions, and am always trying to learn more... drying rack showed up, and I found a dark cool place in the basement for it. rh a little high between 70 and 75% but temps are about 77.
Best I can do. gonna pick up a circulating fan today to keep air moving around in the room. hopefully that will help with the rh.

hope your having a good day :) Sry to hit you with questions already. Off work today and just working around the house. No hurry on the questions. I just posted some questions that i been meaning to ask you.

so.....600 vs T-5
T-5 415 watts shallow penetration
600 = 600 deeper penetration

as for CMH.....they are awesome lights....

in my experience....all the hype on this is BS
a 650 cmh is comparible to 600mh
a 350 cmh = 400w mh

companys all try to compare apples to oranges
the 350 cmh has a better spectrum and is mich more efficient than the mh
but 350w = 350w

now you can het super technical and say
350cmh is say 45% efficient
= 157w of light to the canopy...the rest = heat
the 600mh may only be 30% efficient
= 180w to the canopy the rest heat
but those 30 watts makes a difference
cost wise maybe not
but really when you cost out the electrical expense
350w really is only a fraction of a cent cheaper than 600w
hope tha answers that

as for my led
I dont think I would trade it for the world
I would however beef it up with an hps
just to pound the canopy

I dont push the LED that I have on anyone new because it is a heafty cost for a really genuine LED fixture and much more affordable to grab a HPS batwing and Ballast
hell 350-400$ gets you and entire setup
or if tou have hogh enough cealings...a gavita

my 310w led puts 155w to the canopy as it is 50% efficient
actually it is better than that because the heat that it puts out the plants can absorb and use ....as opposed to the heat that HID exutes

as for drying.....should be fine with enough air movement
it will just dry reall slow.....which is actually a really good thing.....also....the colder it gets the dryer it gets correct

hope that answers some of your questions

 

[Wisher619]

man my typing is really bad today

 

[EventHorizan]

if you dry it.....and you are making Ice Hash....then yeah
if you get some screens and want to make hash that way....then just keep it dry

Is there a different way or something? I see you said" if you dry it.....and you are making Ice Hash....then yeah"
and you are talking about the bags that set on top of each other, with diff micron screens? Cause that is all I have ever really heard of.. I am a nube :(

 

[EventHorizan]

might be more dense then you think

I sure hope so... well when its dried,, we will know then. This all is been such a good learning experience for me.

 

[Wisher619]

Is there a different way or something? I see you said" if you dry it.....and you are making Ice Hash....then yeah"
and you are talking about the bags that set on top of each other, with diff micron screens? Cause that is all I have ever really heard of.. I am a nube :(

yeah
the other way is with micron screens
capturing dry head (kief) and making that into hash

 

[EventHorizan]

so.....600 vs T-5
T-5 415 watts shallow penetration
600 = 600 deeper penetration

as for CMH.....they are awesome lights....

in my experience....all the hype on this is BS
a 650 cmh is comparible to 600mh
a 350 cmh = 400w mh

companys all try to compare apples to oranges
the 350 cmh has a better spectrum and is mich more efficient than the mh
but 350w = 350w

now you can het super technical and say
350cmh is say 45% efficient
= 157w of light to the canopy...the rest = heat
the 600mh may only be 30% efficient
= 180w to the canopy the rest heat
but those 30 watts makes a difference
cost wise maybe not
but really when you cost out the electrical expense
350w really is only a fraction of a cent cheaper than 600w
hope tha answers that

as for my led
I dont think I would trade it for the world
I would however beef it up with an hps
just to pound the canopy

I dont push the LED that I have on anyone new because it is a heafty cost for a really genuine LED fixture and much more affordable to grab a HPS batwing and Ballast
hell 350-400$ gets you and entire setup
or if tou have hogh enough cealings...a gavita

my 310w led puts 155w to the canopy as it is 50% efficient
actually it is better than that because the heat that it puts out the plants can absorb and use ....as opposed to the heat that HID exutes

as for drying.....should be fine with enough air movement
it will just dry reall slow.....which is actually a really good thing.....also....the colder it gets the dryer it gets correct

hope that answers some of your questions

Yes that deff did answer a lot of my questions... so really besides spectrum, efficiency between usable light and what is lost to heat is kinda what separates lights, bulbs, and fixtures.

 

[Wisher619]

Yes that deff did answer a lot of my questions... so really besides spectrum, efficiency between usable light and what is lost to heat is kinda what separates lights, bulbs, and fixtures.

yeah...
T-5 is great but dosent penetrate
hps is great but produces alot of heat
MH is good but the blue wavelengths arent as usefull to plants in flower

LED is good but expensive to get led that actually work well

 

[Wisher619]

yeah
the other way is with micron screens
capturing dry head (kief) and making that into hash

its called dry sifting......
pretty potent
you can take the dry sift and pack it down and then squish it and turn it into Rosin

 

[EventHorizan]

I think that runt is gonna net me 56 to 70 grams. It just has a lot more branches with bigger cola and they are thicker. More dense. And they got 2 weeks to go still. From watching the other 2 plants and their flowering cycle, I am predicting as much yield from it as the other 2 combined almost. I am not setting my heart on it, just predicting from what I see. So we will see....

@incogneato I seen that you seen this post and it got me to thinking about you. I know you are in soil, and that will be a good experience for you. But In the future, you might think of a setup like 4 bucket with net pot lids that are somewhat deep, with grow bags filled with chow mix. Still have the comforts of a soil like median but the power of true hydro. The buckets i would set on crates like this, with the net pot lid and grow bag. What i would do different than what I have above, is!!!!! all 4 buckets have a inlet hose 4 inches up from the bottom, and a drain 4 inches from the top. 3 times a day, you flood the buckets on a timer, and each time it does, it replaces that 4 inches in the bottom,,,, which you will have an air stone in.. all being recirculated to a 15 gallon res made out of a tote. Cheap, easy, and I promise you, 10x veg growth, and frostier buds.... imo.... remember I am rather new... And Wish is very intuitive when it comes to coco/chow mix... Coco is a soil growers dream come true. imo....

 

[EventHorizan]

its called dry sifting......
pretty potent
you can take the dry sift and pack it down and then squish it and turn it into Rosin

maybe I did read something about that...

 

[EventHorizan]

@incogneato I seen that you seen this post and it got me to thinking about you. I know you are in soil, and that will be a good experience for you. But In the future, you might think of a setup like 4 bucket with net pot lids that are somewhat deep, with grow bags filled with chow mix. Still have the comforts of a soil like median but the power of true hydro. The buckets i would set on crates like this, with the net pot lid and grow bag. What i would do different than what I have above, is!!!!! all 4 buckets have a inlet hose 4 inches up from the bottom, and a drain 4 inches from the top. 3 times a day, you flood the buckets on a timer, and each time it does, it replaces that 4 inches in the bottom,,,, which you will have an air stone in.. all being recirculated to a 15 gallon res made out of a tote. Cheap, easy, and I promise you, 10x veg growth, and frostier buds.... imo.... remember I am rather new... And Wish is very intuitive when it comes to coco/chow mix... Coco is a soil growers dream come true. imo....

Even tho, you could change out the buckets for a flood table, 4x4, and still use the chow mix in sq pots are grow bags.. You wouldn't get the power of dwc this way, but flood and drain is hydro too, and has awesome growth potential... Flood tables are just a lil easy to work with. But they are too big for my tastes.. I like buckets,, ask me in 4 months how I feel, i might have a different answer..

 

[EventHorizan]

yeah...
T-5 is great but dosent penetrate
hps is great but produces alot of heat
MH is good but the blue wavelengths arent as usefull to plants in flower

LED is good but expensive to get led that actually work well

which led you got?
300 Watt Cree CXB3590?

 

[Wisher619]

Even tho, you could change out the buckets for a flood table, 4x4, and still use the chow mix in sq pots are grow bags.. You wouldn't get the power of dwc this way, but flood and drain is hydro too, and has awesome growth potential... Flood tables are just a lil easy to work with. But they are too big for my tastes.. I like buckets,, ask me in 4 months how I feel, i might have a different answer..

In my opinion I dont think DWC is better or have stronger or faster growth than any other Hydro setup

I think it is more automated but the downfall is disease and pathogen....if infected....the whole hive dies

the proven fatest and most powerful would be aeroponics or NFT

I have never seen any system out compete the other in growth or faster flowering times

the absolute simplist system for hydro with great growth for beginners would be a wick system

you put a nylon wick in the bottom of the coco and set the wick in a res
the end
super easy
advanced hydro is pretty dificult for the average grower really to start out on

 

[EventHorizan]

In my opinion I dont think DWC is better or have stronger or faster growth than any other Hydro setup

I think it is more automated but the downfall is disease and pathogen....if infected....the whole hive dies

the proven fatest and most powerful would be aeroponics or NFT

I have never seen any system out compete the other in growth or faster flowering times

the absolute simplist system for hydro with great growth for beginners would be a wick system

you put a nylon wick in the bottom of the coco and set the wick in a res
the end
super easy
advanced hydro is pretty dificult for the average grower really to start out on

Right,,, I guess if i had to pick something again, it would be a flood table again, if I was new. Personally a flood table, and 1 res is pretty simple to maintain. As for a wick system, seems more like a self watering system for ease of use.
My greatest asset, is my biggest downfall... I am a problem solver, so I always over complicate things to learn in the end, simple is best.. I am sure one day I will prob come back around full circle to coco again. But this time, I will put as many 1/2 gallon sq pots as i can get on the 4x4 table and flower almost immediately. that would be the only way I went back to a table.

Ya aeroponics for some reason hasn't caught my fancy, eventho my seedlings haven't been able to touch the water, but you can see a fine mist on the bottom of the net cups,, " so in a way thats aeroponics lol :)

 

[EventHorizan]

In my opinion I dont think DWC is better or have stronger or faster growth than any other Hydro setup

Well what has me feeling that it has better growth + thicker buds is the difference between these plants, between the table, and the dwc. There is a huge difference. And it was stunted the first 2 weeks. Can you imagine if that wouldn't of happened? I prob lost 15 % yield because of that and yet it will still be the top dog by a huge margin. Now we could say that the top drip has a lot to do with that. I watched a comparison between a table (f+d) and a table with just top feed. Top feed out performed it, esp from the start. F+d did start to make up some ground towards the finish, but final yield was like a 3rd more with top feed.

 

[Wisher619]

Right,,, I guess if i had to pick something again, it would be a flood table again, if I was new. Personally a flood table, and 1 res is pretty simple to maintain. As for a wick system, seems more like a self watering system for ease of use.
My greatest asset, is my biggest downfall... I am a problem solver, so I always over complicate things to learn in the end, simple is best.. I am sure one day I will prob come back around full circle to coco again. But this time, I will put as many 1/2 gallon sq pots as i can get on the 4x4 table and flower almost immediately. that would be the only way I went back to a table.

Ya aeroponics for some reason hasn't caught my fancy, eventho my seedlings haven't been able to touch the water, but you can see a fine mist on the bottom of the net cups,, " so in a way thats aeroponics lol :)

with a table you dont have to use coco
you can use Hydroton/perlite/stones/lavarock/peat/ vermiculite....etc......just depends on the # of waterings per day......coco has the best buffer by far

a wick system is kinda like self waterng
usually the medium is inert and the solution is nutrient
one of the first passive hydro systems


NFT I think by far it the best system to run.....
used successfuly around the world with many crops....

 

[Wisher619]

Well what has me feeling that it has better growth + thicker buds is the difference between these plants, between the table, and the dwc. There is a huge difference. And it was stunted the first 2 weeks. Can you imagine if that wouldn't of happened? I prob lost 15 % yield because of that and yet it will still be the top dog by a huge margin. Now we could say that the top drip has a lot to do with that. I watched a comparison between a table (f+d) and a table with just top feed. Top feed out performed it, esp from the start. F+d did start to make up some ground towards the finish, but final yield was like a 3rd more with top feed.

yeah I watched that video as well

see if you had clones and you rooted them at the same time
you could make that comparison
but they are all seeds
even from the same strain
you get completely different traits

in the video the dude used RW which is never supposed to be used in a flood and drain
the directions state top feed only
definitely a major factor for such a small yield IMO
compared to the top drip