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help! both pH and ppm rise!

  • Thread starter Thread starter tait
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help! both pH and ppm rise!

tait 131 Replies 26,351 Views
Page 2 of 7 · Replies 21–40 of 132
#21
PK1 said:
i letterly used mega crop two parts nutrients, Z7 for enzyme since im in canada, and ph my water to 5.5/5..7
no slime, root rot or any problem in rez, roots looked nice and white. maybe a bit on the higher cost but it allowed me to just focus on learning the plant
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will def look to see if this is in my local store, do you use any other form of beneficial bacteria?
 
#22
Hey all, So it seems i was unable to effect anything when remixxing my water,i set my ppm super low only adding 10ml of a & b, then 10ml of root excelurator. and the next day this is the result @pk1
Capture
 
#23
tait said:
will def look to see if this is in my local store, do you use any other form of beneficial bacteria?
Click to expand...
no i don't that it.
tait said:
Hey all, So it seems i was unable to effect anything when remixxing my water,i set my ppm super low only adding 10ml of a & b, then 10ml of root excelurator. and the next day this is the result @pk1View attachment 1199999
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unstable rez takes to much ph down
 
#27
PK1 said:
that doesn't mean the rez is going to get stabled. There are beneficial bacterias that need to be produces and you need bad bacterias to be taken care off.
enzymes take care of this.
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ah alright perfect, gonna get those Z7’s as previously mentioned
 
#29
I still have yet to understand the concept of enzymes. I run live systems only, have ran multiple. I go longer between res changes than anyone ive ever heard of in hydro, sometimes 2 months before i pump out and make a fresh batch.

Someone help me with this . .

So the nutrients I add are what the plant wants. Yet the pythium is ate by the microbes, and the microbes multiply and emit enzymes. These enzymes are actually nutrients made re-available to the plant by the bacteria. So by adding more enzymes your hopes is that they will bond with other elements in the water creating nutrients the plants cant uptake, what the bacteria couldnt do.

Seems this would make nutrients last longer like more of a self sustaining ecosystem, making unavailable available again.

To me this seems like it could have some challenges, or could be done wrong. Also if one plans to do frequent res changes, is it even need, and in situations like mine, where i can top off for 2 months without enzymes, what would it have gained me.

I need more education in the enzyme area obviously. They are proteins right? Proteins do what in a plant lol? Idk wtf the N P K does really. . I know its like the body somehow, the body uses Salts, sugars and carbs in the same fashion lol? NO? idk i read a reference somewhere a while back.
 
#30
Cashmeh said:
I still have yet to understand the concept of enzymes. I run live systems only, have ran multiple. I go longer between res changes than anyone ive ever heard of in hydro, sometimes 2 months before i pump out and make a fresh batch.

Someone help me with this . .

So the nutrients I add are what the plant wants. Yet the pythium is ate by the microbes, and the microbes multiply and emit enzymes. These enzymes are actually nutrients made re-available to the plant by the bacteria. So by adding more enzymes your hopes is that they will bond with other elements in the water creating nutrients the plants cant uptake, what the bacteria couldnt do.

Seems this would make nutrients last longer like more of a self sustaining ecosystem, making unavailable available again.

To me this seems like it could have some challenges, or could be done wrong. Also if one plans to do frequent res changes, is it even need, and in situations like mine, where i can top off for 2 months without enzymes, what would it have gained me.

I need more education in the enzyme area obviously. They are proteins right? Proteins do what in a plant lol? Idk wtf the N P K does really. . I know its like the body somehow, the body uses Salts, sugars and carbs in the same fashion lol? NO? idk i read a reference somewhere a while back.
Click to expand...
what do you mean by live system? like RDWC
 
#33
PK1 said:
so i don't get with what you mean by you are not understanding it? seems like you already know
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Well thats the part, i didnt give my opinion yet lol. Was looking for validation to see if I was on the right track. So my thing is, it just suppose to save money? So like ive researched alot of enzymes and it seems hydrozyme would be the most effective one, yet it costs so much. I cant argue why its the best one, but ive seen it hashed out. I think its because there are multiple that a plant can use. Anyways, I guess I dont see the point if it all costs so much and can cause gunk buildup right? I mean its proteins added that are suppose to bond and make nutrients. Well if ratios are wrong some of the bonds be waisted, since were not monitoring the levels like chemists. Like the nutrients are cheap enough where you can just dump them and rebatch, no need to get every last ounce left. I guess to me this would be something like when you wanted a res to last forever, but you would still need to be a chemist and test perimeters we dont.

So i guess my question is why do people suggest enzymes if they dont combat issues. I dont run them again, not saying I wont one day. Im sure if I hear lots of different reasons why people use them then yea. . but atm im just dont like adding things I dont have to.
 
#34
Cashmeh said:
Well thats the part, i didnt give my opinion yet lol. Was looking for validation to see if I was on the right track. So my thing is, it just suppose to save money? So like ive researched alot of enzymes and it seems hydrozyme would be the most effective one, yet it costs so much. I cant argue why its the best one, but ive seen it hashed out. I think its because there are multiple that a plant can use. Anyways, I guess I dont see the point if it all costs so much and can cause gunk buildup right? I mean its proteins added that are suppose to bond and make nutrients. Well if ratios are wrong some of the bonds be waisted, since were not monitoring the levels like chemists. Like the nutrients are cheap enough where you can just dump them and rebatch, no need to get every last ounce left. I guess to me this would be something like when you wanted a res to last forever, but you would still need to be a chemist and test perimeters we dont.

So i guess my question is why do people suggest enzymes if they dont combat issues. I dont run them again, not saying I wont one day. Im sure if I hear lots of different reasons why people use them then yea. . but atm im just dont like adding things I dont have to.
Click to expand...
so in my incredibly limited experience with enzymes (i quit using Hygrozyme as I'm 95% sure it was contributing to stem rot), the reason you use them in conjunction with say hydroguard or comparable is because the enzymes and bacteria form a synergistic relationship. The enzymes help break down dead organic material and the bacteria do the rest of the cleanup work. A nice side effect of that is higher nutrient availability so theoretically you could feed lower EC since more nutrients will be available to the plants.

That being said, I'm no longer a believer in any of the claims Hygrozyme makes. Two gallons I bought at roughly $170/gallon at the local hydro shop ended up smelling fermented, and I was having significant health issues with my plants, even when using Hygrozyme with 34% h2o2, which Hygrozyme is supposed to be compatible with. As soon as I eliminated that additive, my issues went away. Nothing else changed, and I had one less thing to add to the res. Sure, I'm out $340 on useless garbage, but it is what it is. There are a lot of contradicting arguments for and against enzyme use anyways, and if I were running a live system I'd find another alternative considering you're playing a very temperamental game in a live system. h2o2 is 100% my preferred cleansing agent now and I won't run anything else.

YMMV.
 
#35
Cashmeh said:
I still have yet to understand the concept of enzymes. I run live systems only, have ran multiple. I go longer between res changes than anyone ive ever heard of in hydro, sometimes 2 months before i pump out and make a fresh batch.

Someone help me with this . .

So the nutrients I add are what the plant wants. Yet the pythium is ate by the microbes, and the microbes multiply and emit enzymes. These enzymes are actually nutrients made re-available to the plant by the bacteria. So by adding more enzymes your hopes is that they will bond with other elements in the water creating nutrients the plants cant uptake, what the bacteria couldnt do.

Seems this would make nutrients last longer like more of a self sustaining ecosystem, making unavailable available again.

To me this seems like it could have some challenges, or could be done wrong. Also if one plans to do frequent res changes, is it even need, and in situations like mine, where i can top off for 2 months without enzymes, what would it have gained me.

I need more education in the enzyme area obviously. They are proteins right? Proteins do what in a plant lol? Idk wtf the N P K does really. . I know its like the body somehow, the body uses Salts, sugars and carbs in the same fashion lol? NO? idk i read a reference somewhere a while back.
Click to expand...
Enzymes can have a direct effect on cation exchange rates and that determines how fast your plant can eat, how much is available...
 
#37
Cashmeh said:
See, that what im talking about, words ive never heard lol. . ill youtube that. Is it sad most what I have learned is by using this forum and youtube lol. . .
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Cation exchange capacity (CEC) is the total capacity of a soil to hold exchangeable cations. CEC is an inherent soil characteristic and is difficult to alter significantly. It influences the soil's ability to hold onto essential nutrients and provides a buffer against soil acidification

so basically, how many "keyholes" a (medium,ie coco, soil, sand) has and how many "keys" (nutes) can fill those holes, that the plant can access.

in very simple terms.
 
#38
tobh said:
so in my incredibly limited experience with enzymes (i quit using Hygrozyme as I'm 95% sure it was contributing to stem rot), the reason you use them in conjunction with say hydroguard or comparable is because the enzymes and bacteria form a synergistic relationship. The enzymes help break down dead organic material and the bacteria do the rest of the cleanup work. A nice side effect of that is higher nutrient availability so theoretically you could feed lower EC since more nutrients will be available to the plants.

That being said, I'm no longer a believer in any of the claims Hygrozyme makes. Two gallons I bought at roughly $170/gallon at the local hydro shop ended up smelling fermented, and I was having significant health issues with my plants, even when using Hygrozyme with 34% h2o2, which Hygrozyme is supposed to be compatible with. As soon as I eliminated that additive, my issues went away. Nothing else changed, and I had one less thing to add to the res. Sure, I'm out $340 on useless garbage, but it is what it is. There are a lot of contradicting arguments for and against enzyme use anyways, and if I were running a live system I'd find another alternative considering you're playing a very temperamental game in a live system. h2o2 is 100% my preferred cleansing agent now and I won't run anything else.

YMMV.
Click to expand...
Yea its too expensive for me. The amount of trio/calmag I can get is ridiculous for that price. I get it in soil, but unless its cheap and im trying to make this batch last a year, say I had 1000 gallons res, or even 500. Sure id be testing perimeters, adding enzymes, seeing how long it would then take for one level to drop. Im sure it makes levels last longer, but idk which ones. I just monitor ppms and leaf damage/color, and ph levels.

So i guess it brings me back to the basics. The goal when adding enzymes is to save money right?
Observationist said:
Cation exchange capacity (CEC) is the total capacity of a soil to hold exchangeable cations. CEC is an inherent soil characteristic and is difficult to alter significantly. It influences the soil's ability to hold onto essential nutrients and provides a buffer against soil acidification

so basically, how many "keyholes" a (medium,ie coco, soil, sand) has and how many "keys" (nutes) can fill those holes, that the plant can access.

in very simple terms.
Click to expand...
Like a puzzle, "only when the right type of enzyme finds the right substrate, does a biochemical reaction occur." To me it just seems like too much research would need to be done. I bet the guys who make hygrozyme can save money on nutrients, but once they sell it, its like fuck that.

Amino acids, proteins, rootzone absorption,. . .wtf is that shit. . I say thats for year 2 hydro growers. In my head i see that shit forming gunk, well lets say they also have slight root rot, or just some bad nutrients all together. . which there are plenty of.


Ill say it again, flora trio, calmag, and hydroguard. .simple. If any nutrient issues, equal ratios and you legit cant grow bad as long as you defeat pythium. I wonder what enzymes pythium likes.
 
#39
Cashmeh said:
Yea its too expensive for me. The amount of trio/calmag I can get is ridiculous for that price. I get it in soil, but unless its cheap and im trying to make this batch last a year, say I had 1000 gallons res, or even 500. Sure id be testing perimeters, adding enzymes, seeing how long it would then take for one level to drop. Im sure it makes levels last longer, but idk which ones. I just monitor ppms and leaf damage/color, and ph levels.

So i guess it brings me back to the basics. The goal when adding enzymes is to save money right?

Like a puzzle, "only when the right type of enzyme finds the right substrate, does a biochemical reaction occur." To me it just seems like too much research would need to be done. I bet the guys who make hygrozyme can save money on nutrients, but once they sell it, its like fuck that.

Amino acids, proteins, rootzone absorption,. . .wtf is that shit. . I say thats for year 2 hydro growers. In my head i see that shit forming gunk, well lets say they also have slight root rot, or just some bad nutrients all together. . which there are plenty of.


Ill say it again, flora trio, calmag, and hydroguard. .simple. If any nutrient issues, equal ratios and you legit cant grow bad as long as you defeat pythium. I wonder what enzymes pythium likes.
Click to expand...
how often do you encounter root rot with those three products and what medium do you use them in, and is it dwc, aeroponic?
what are your techniques for defeating pythium??
 
#40
Enzymes when used correctly will feed your grow while keeping it healthy.
We very rarely ever have any kind of issue with our grows. We grow organic with MBEs. (Microbes, Bacteria, Enzymes)
 
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