One_bell's first grow (F1 Epsilon auto, RDWC)

[One_Bell]

they are photopeiriod and January 3 is when they sprouted out.

Ah nice, then you have some recoverytime untill flip. Looking forward to your updates!

Day 22 (from sowing seeds, day 19 since sprouting and 7 days after transplantingfrom aero to rdwc)

Today it is exactly a week ago I transplanted 2 of my Autoflowers into the RDWC system. It has been a though week for them. These last seven days I overfeed them dramatically. After doing some more research yesterday, I discovered that the above PPM values are for Photo's and should be divided by two for Autoflowers, oops.......

Luckily I made another mistake. The PPM values from the Bluelab are x700 values, not the more commen x500 values I think. So while feeding ridiculous PPM values, they where not as bad as the x500 ones.

Looking through old posts I found some from @Cashmeh and @fatawa. Especially this comment from @fatawa: Diald in no matter the nute line u shud get 15-30ppm(tech no drop is perfect,but to c a minimal drop helps u visualy c they r drinking nutes)if u r getting that drop yur ph fluctuation is very minimal,if it swings high n veg,or low n flower yur ppms r 2 high.Thanks guys, this made it a lot clearer for me. I have been overfeeding the whole week. Not as bad as I though because of the x700 scale but still. My pH continued the whole week to raise above 5.8 within a couple of hours but this was because of the PPM's being too high.

So for Autoflowers in Veg in RDWC, 250 PPM (x500 scale) should be a good starting point. I lowered my res to these values and already start to see the plants droopy leaves are slowly being lifted up. I hope they can still recover from this week of overfeeding and nutrient burns....


Also the insurance policy has been cleared, I did not have enough room and they started to smell a bit out of the tent. The idea to have three other Autoflowers in stock has eased it a bit for me this last week, since I did not properly understood what was wrong with the two ones I had transplanted. Next time I will still start my seedlings in the RQS soilplugs, but won't transfer the to the X-stream propegator I think. Probably best to transfer the soiplug to rdwc and skip the Aeroponics part.

 

[One_Bell]

Some pictures from today:

It looks like they start to drink and the leaves are coming up instead of hanging droopy.

Left one:

Right one:

I wonder when I should begin with LST.

 

[One_Bell]

@FloridaMike when, if haha, would you start with low stress training on these autoflowers? And what do you think of the topping?

 

[Florida_Mike]

@FloridaMike when, if haha, would you start with low stress training on these autoflowers? And what do you think of the topping?

I have no experience with auto's.

The topping looks picture perfect
(however, I prefer to "micro top",
there are some good yt vids on it).

I don't generally LST, but you can
basically start as soon as they have
long enuf shoots to manipulate.
There are masters on here who can
better help you with that. Follow
Captspaulding & Mikedin.
(I think it's divided opinions on
whether or not to top/lst autos)

Don't forget, I've been away from
this for many years & am just now
getting back into it. My methods
while proven, are quite antiquated
compared to today's tech &
methods.

 

[One_Bell]

I have no experience with auto's.

The topping looks picture perfect
(however, I prefer to "micro top",
there are some good yt vids on it).

I don't generally LST, but you can
basically start as soon as they have
long enuf shoots to manipulate.
There are masters on here who can
better help you with that. Follow
Captspaulding & Mikedin.
(I think it's divided opinions on
whether or not to top/lst autos)

Don't forget, I've been away from
this for many years & am just now
getting back into it. My methods
while proven, are quite antiquated

compared to today's tech &
methods.

Haha okay, I went ahead with it anyway, hope it looks good and will benefit the plants. @Captspaulding and @Mikedin what do you guys think of the topping and LST?

Day 23 (from sowing seeds, day 20 since sprouting and 8 days after transplantingfrom aero to rdwc)

Their height dropped a few centimeters this way but I hope it will spread out the canopy more evenly.

Also, after changing the feeding to 340ppm (x700 scale) the pH swings are way less now, only have to adjust the pH twice a day instead of every two hours. They look more healthy now, so I upped the PPFD from 300 to 350.

 

[Mikedin]

Haha okay, I went ahead with it anyway, hope it looks good and will benefit the plants. @Captspaulding and @Mikedin what do you guys think of the topping and LST?

Day 23 (from sowing seeds, day 20 since sprouting and 8 days after transplantingfrom aero to rdwc)

View attachment 2361471

View attachment 2361472

View attachment 2361473

Their height dropped a few centimeters this way but I hope it will spread out the canopy more evenly.

Also, after changing the feeding to 340ppm (x700 scale) the pH swings are way less now, only have to adjust the pH twice a day instead of every two hours. They look more healthy now, so I upped the PPFD from 300 to 350.

I love topping, i usually go 5th node,I don’t do much LST anymore but I do usually scrog!

They look great!

 

[One_Bell]

I love topping, i usually go 5th node,I don’t do much LST anymore but I do usually scrog!

They look great!

Should I have waited for one node more then? Or how do you count?

Day 25 (from sowing seeds, day 22 since sprouting and 10 days after transplantingfrom aero to rdwc). I might do a reservoir change these days.

Still debating, reading upon and counting the Advanced Nutrients vs the GH/Terra Aquatica. I am favoring the latter because of the costs. Might pull the trigger on the full set.

Today I took the plants out again and tried to lower the lst-wire a bit for more light penetration. The one on the right seems to be a bit quicker now then the left one.

Left:

Right:

What do you think?

 

[One_Bell]

Day 27 (from sowing seeds, day 24 since sprouting and 12 days after transplantingfrom aero to rdwc). I have not done a reservoir yet but lowered the EC to 0,4 since I noticed they are not really drinking much. However, topping and some LST does already show some effect on both plants.

Left:

Right:

As far as I'm concerned they look pretty healthy to me. Over the last few days I slowly increased the light from 350PPFD to 480PPFD today. No signs of light burn yet but I keep an eye on it.

For the feeding I started uses these two charts today, it really guides me with is going on and what to do:

credit to Percysgrowroom.

 

[One_Bell]

@THC_AeroGrower @FloridaMike what would you do at this point? Just keep let them grow for a few days before tying them up again? Or do I need to top it again or starting to defoliate some leaves already?

 

[Florida_Mike]

Day 27 (from sowing seeds, day 24 since sprouting and 12 days after transplantingfrom aero to rdwc). I have not done a reservoir yet but lowered the EC to 0,4 since I noticed they are not really drinking much. However, topping and some LST does already show some effect on both plants.

Left:
View attachment 2363326
View attachment 2363327
View attachment 2363328

Right:

View attachment 2363329
View attachment 2363330
View attachment 2363331

As far as I'm concerned they look pretty healthy to me. Over the last few days I slowly increased the light from 350PPFD to 480PPFD today. No signs of light burn yet but I keep an eye on it.

For the feeding I started uses these two charts today, it really guides me with is going on and what to do:

credit to Percysgrowroom.

Looking good bro! The roots look excellent. The roots should double almost
every day or two, once that starts happening, the plants will really take off

 

[One_Bell]

Looking good bro! The roots look excellent. The roots should double almost
every day or two, once that starts happening, the plants will really take off

Thanks Mike! Really appreciate your opinion. Since these are autoflowers I hope I did not stunt them to bad with the transition in to hot nutes for a couple of days. Since the beginning of the week I saw a lot of improvement and the plants certainly become more bushier. I wonder when to ty them down again.

Today it was also the first day I raised the led lights, 36cm according to Mars Hydro.

 

[Florida_Mike]

@THC_AeroGrower @FloridaMike what would you do at this point? Just keep let them grow for a few days before tying them up again? Or do I need to top it again or starting to defoliate some leaves already?

I've never grown auto's, so I'm not much help on the topping and training.
As for defoliating, I'd take any lower damaged or shabby looking leaves and
any that are directly blocking or covering any new tops coming up below them.

 

[Florida_Mike]

Thanks Mike! Really appreciate your opinion. Since these are autoflowers I hope I did not stunt them to bad with the transition in to hot nutes for a couple of days. Since the beginning of the week I saw a lot of improvement and the plants certainly become more bushier. I wonder when to ty them down again.

Today it was also the first day I raised the led lights, 36cm according to Mars Hydro.

Be careful going by manufacturer's recommendations. Without a par meter,
go by what the plants are saying.

Leaves sticking out flat or slightly raised are just right.
Leaves that are "praying" want more light, either lower the light, or increase the power (or both)
Leaves that are pointing down as if to cover themselves, or are "taco-ing" are getting too much light.
Pictured is my mamma plant under 40w cheap led, she is praying, wanting more light.

 

[THC_AeroGrower]

@THC_AeroGrower @FloridaMike what would you do at this point? Just keep let them grow for a few days before tying them up again? Or do I need to top it again or starting to defoliate some leaves already?

Everything looks good! I don't top my autos, so not much I can offer there. That's a bold choice, especially for a first grow. Good luck!

I second what @FloridaMike said about listening to the plants when it comes to the light position and intensity.

I do some LST but I find when to tie, where, and how, are all somewhat dictated by what your goal is. As you know, with autoflowers you want to keep stress minimal because of their short, fixed schedule. If your goal is to spread lateral branches wide for better light penetration, wait until the new growth after topping starts to stretch upward, then gently tie those branches down to keep the canopy even. Then Check every few days to see if the branches are shading lower growth or getting too close together. If so, it’s time to adjust. Just be gradual with your ties to avoid stressing the plant. Don't pull too hard or adjust to sharply. You can end up hurting the branches, especially on autos.

If it were me, I'd be less worried about the hot nutes and more concerned with watching the healing from the topping. For your next auto grow, you might skip topping and focus on LST alone. It’s usually easier on the autos AND the grower .

 

[One_Bell]

Be careful going by manufacturer's recommendations. Without a par meter,
go by what the plants are saying.

Leaves sticking out flat or slightly raised are just right.
Leaves that are "praying" want more light, either lower the light, or increase the power (or both)
Leaves that are pointing down as if to cover themselves, or are "taco-ing" are getting too much light.
Pictured is my mamma plant under 40w cheap led, she is praying, wanting more light.

Everything looks good! I don't top my autos, so not much I can offer there. That's a bold choice, especially for a first grow. Good luck!

I second what @FloridaMike said about listening to the plants when it comes to the light position and intensity.

I do some LST but I find when to tie, where, and how, are all somewhat dictated by what your goal is. As you know, with autoflowers you want to keep stress minimal because of their short, fixed schedule. If your goal is to spread lateral branches wide for better light penetration, wait until the new growth after topping starts to stretch upward, then gently tie those branches down to keep the canopy even. Then Check every few days to see if the branches are shading lower growth or getting too close together. If so, it’s time to adjust. Just be gradual with your ties to avoid stressing the plant. Don't pull too hard or adjust to sharply. You can end up hurting the branches, especially on autos.

If it were me, I'd be less worried about the hot nutes and more concerned with watching the healing from the topping. For your next auto grow, you might skip topping and focus on LST alone. It’s usually easier on the autos AND the grower .

Thanks guys. Funny enough I thought when I was preparing to take the tops off, this is quite a bold mov for a first grow haha. I do use a PPFD meter and especially now I use it everyday to increase the light a bit after adjusting it. I also started to use a VPD-gun so I can measure the leafetemperature and leave vpd more correctly. I did raise the PPFD to a little over 500 after adjusting the light and measure from the top of the canopy.

Something that stood out to me was not having to lower the pH for 26(!) hours after lowering the EC to 0.4. Before I needed to lower it every three to four hours, now only 0.1pH increase over 26 hours, really loving it haha:

Day 28 (from sowing seeds, day 25 since sprouting and 13 days after transplantingfrom aero to rdwc).

Both plants were 16 cm this afternoon. I will let them grow a bit before remove the old leaves and try to lower te branches a bit again.
Left:

As you can see above, the plant seems to miss a part at 6 o'clock. I tied one branch down a little bit too much and the stem snapped... Be carefull when performing LST lol!

Right:

I measure the plants length everyday now, crazy to see how fast they grow. And I really love RDWC now

 

[One_Bell]

I made up my mind and bit the bullit regarding nutrients, I went with the Terra Aquatica/ General Hydroponics line for hydro:

Terra Aquatica (T.A) ~ GHE Terra Aquatica - Seaweed1 Liter

Terra Aquatica (T.A) ~ GHE Terra Aquatica - Urtimax1 Liter

Terra Aquatica (T.A) ~ GHE Terra Aquatica - Fulvic1 Liter

Terra Aquatica (T.A) ~ GHE Terra Aquatica - TriPart Bloom1 Liter

Terra Aquatica (T.A) ~ GHE Terra Aquatica - TriPart Grow1 Liter

Terra Aquatica (T.A) ~ GHE Terra Aquatica - TriPart MicroHard Water | Soft Water: Soft Water, Volume: 1 Liter

Terra Aquatica (T.A) ~ GHE Terra Aquatica - Silicate1 KG

Terra Aquatica (T.A) ~ GHE Terra Aquatica - Bloom Booster1 Liter

Terra Aquatica (T.A) ~ GHE Terra Aquatica - Final Part1 Liter

Terra Aquatica (T.A) ~ GHE Terra Aquatica - Protect30 ML

Terra Aquatica (T.A) ~ GHE Terra Aquatica - FlashClean1 Liter

Terra Aquatica (T.A) ~ GHE Terra Aquatica - PermaBloom1 Liter

I wil following this schedule probably:

Still a shitload of bottles, but to calm my FOMO I think I got everything covered nutrient-wise with this. Still more then 1/3 less expensive then AN (and everything in 1L bottles, go figure)...

The only thing from the above I did not order was Terra Aquatica TrikoLogic, I don't it would still have effect and from what I read you cannot dissolve it in the nutrient solution like Great White but it needs something to grow on, so maybe sprinkle it on the netcup?

I calculated the difference between the full coinaisseur line of Advanced Nutrients compared to AT/GH and choose the latter. When they arrive I will do a res-change.

In the meantime I am still debating what to order from Plant Revolution. Great White showed me great results. However, Orca should be better in hydro since the liquid form. Despite being more suitable for hydro it carries less compared to Great White. There is also King Crab, which is quite expensive. I can obtain one bottle of 100ML for 50 euro's, or 946ML for 110 euro's. The there is also Mycochum to feed it, but less expensive. With an active system of 37 liters I think that everything has died in the 946ML King Crab before I see the end of it. I e-mailed Plant Revolution to inform me about the shelflife, unfortunately no reply after a few days...
I did read you can freeze colonies like these but I am not sure... In the meantime just using Great White and Voodoo Juice from AN.

 

[One_Bell]

Day 30 (from sowing seeds, day 27 since sprouting and 15 days after transplantingfrom aero to rdwc).

The plants seem to thrive with the new nutrient regime. Roots getting bigger by the day, they grew 4 cm in height and I will need to defoliate some leaves soon.

Left:

Right:

They seem to uptake more nutrients now and I topped off the reservoir yesterday and today. I brought the EC up to 0.6 now with a ppm of 400. PPFD is just a little bit above 600. Tomorrow I will try to LST some more when taking off some leaves.

 

[Florida_Mike]

I told you this would happen once
they got some legs underneath them.
Trust me; it's going to get better &
better still as they get more roots
under them. It's exponential and
compounding. The more roots the
faster they grow, plain and simple.
This is the beauty of RDWC &
hydroponics in general

Beautiful roots btw!

 

[One_Bell]

I told you this would happen once
they got some legs underneath them.
Trust me; it's going to get better &
better still as they get more roots
under them. It's exponential and
compounding. The more roots the
faster they grow, plain and simple.
This is the beauty of RDWC &
hydroponics in general

Beautiful roots btw!

Thanks Mike, I really feeling they are taking off now. I also notice this when looking at EC and PPM values. I follow the chart posted a few post above from PerceysGrowRoom and pH has been so stable ever since. I feel like I can control how much they eat with the chart, exactly knowing what to do. I absolutely love RDWC, once you got it dailed in hahaha grow grow grow

~something else I noticed, the leaves on these plants look much thicker then most on growdairies. Could this because of RDWC or my overfeeding in the beginning?

 

[Mikedin]

Lookin nice!