Cloning during flower DIY bubble cloner

[Spliffy.Twojoints]

I keep my t-5 light on 24-0 until they are well rooted on my clones and then 18-6.

That seems to be to general consensus, I think I’ve seen one person doing 20/4 from the start. Just curious if the dark hours will speed things up or not, so eventually I’ll play with those hours.

 

[Spliffy.Twojoints]

We are now 18 days in and I am completely sold on bubble cloning instead of peat pucks or soil etc and humidity domes.

To recap, there are four strains, one was in veg and the other three were over 4 weeks in flower. I lost one cutting in the first couple days because of a dead spot in the reservoir.

Since then almost every cutting has developed roots with the exception of two cuttings of the same plant from the flower room. I took four cuttings of each plant and the other two have roots, so it’s either location in the cloner or just a cultivar that is tougher to clone. I can’t say one way or the other yet because I have never cloned this plant before, but if it’s location in the cloner the issue will recur with the next round of cuttings.

Some of the clones have far less developed roots than the others so I will keep them in the cloner a while longer. I think four weeks will be the cut off as far as waiting for the last two to get roots.

Aside from the high success rate, the best thing about this cloner is the set it and forget it freedom it allows. I have gone a couple days without even going in the room and didn’t have to worry for a moment about moulds or mildew developing, or plants suffocating, or plants drying out, or any of the other issues that comes with cloning in domes.

I’m an old timer who can get set in his ways so I’m extra happy that I tried something new and so game changing, but at the same time bittersweet because I didn’t try this 20 years ago.

 

[Galgrows]

That's fantastic real happy for you.

 

[LoveGrowingIt]

That seems to be to general consensus, I think I’ve seen one person doing 20/4 from the start. Just curious if the dark hours will speed things up or not, so eventually I’ll play with those hours.

Lacking roots, I suspect extended photosynthesis from keeping the light on longer would be beneficial.

 

[Spliffy.Twojoints]

That's fantastic real happy for you.

Thanks, much appreciated!
I’ve been trying to go as organic as possible while staying on this side of vegan . Maybe one day I’ll try the vegan thing too, I hear it produces the tastiest buds!

 

[Spliffy.Twojoints]

Lacking roots, I suspect extended photosynthesis from keeping the light on longer would be beneficial.

I agree, but I also wonder about recovery time when the lights are off. I’ve read things about different processes taking place during night and day, although I’m not sure how much of that is bro science.

I have noticed that some of my plants look like they’re “sleeping” during lights off, meaning the leaves are drooping almost as if they want a drink, but then perk up when the lights come on again.

When I test those theories, it won’t be super conclusive because I’m only capable of cloning 24 plants at once, but I might use flowering cuttings as well as veg cuttings again just to be somewhat consistent.

 

[LoveGrowingIt]

I’ve read things about different processes taking place during night and day, although I’m not sure how much of that is bro science.

There must be different processes because photosynthesis only occurs during the day.

I have noticed that some of my plants look like they’re “sleeping” during lights off, meaning the leaves are drooping almost as if they want a drink, but then perk up when the lights come on again.

At night, the leaves don't need to orient themselves toward the light because photosynthesis is not happening.

When I test those theories

What is there to test? What are the theories? Most plant biology is established science.

These plants make sugars from photosynthesis and store some of the sugars in the roots so that their metabolism can continue when photosynthesis is not occurring, i.e., when there is no light. Regarding cloning, it might be interesting to consider the best way to stimulate the creation of new roots by manipulating light and dark duration. For example, would a complete lack of darkness inhibit or stimulate root growth?

 

[Greenadian]

Thanks, much appreciated!
I’ve been trying to go as organic as possible while staying on this side of vegan . Maybe one day I’ll try the vegan thing too, I hear it produces the tastiest buds!

My friends cousin's sisters boyfriend grows vegan cannabis....he swears it tastes like chicken. True story. Ya really

 

[Spliffy.Twojoints]

What is there to test? What are the theories? Most plant biology is established science.

As I mentioned, testing theories or ideas to answer questions about the amount of light and dark during cloning and how it affects the plants. Questions like yours:

Regarding cloning, it might be interesting to consider the best way to stimulate the creation of new roots by manipulating light and dark duration. For example, would a complete lack of darkness inhibit or stimulate root growth?

Your own example proves that there are things to explore here and not everything is established, especially with cannabis because it’s been such a no-no for so long around the world. That means a lot of bro science has been passed around as fact. There was a time when many people growing thought birth control pills were the best thing for their plants.
This is further evidenced today by all the controversial things we do such as defoliating, there’s a huge amount of people for it and a huge amount of people against it, but where is the science?

As far as clones, most people said trimming the leaves will stimulate the root growth and remove focus from blah blah blah blah. Turns out, the most critical study I’ve heard showed as much as a 30% decrease in rooting when leaves are trimmed. Try to tell that to someone who insists on trimming the leaves every time. I trim my leaves when I have to but only for space, not to stimulate the roots.

Another example I can give is to do with bubble cloners. There are many people who insist you must use a cloning gel or powder and keep the water over 75°F. I used no gels or powders and my water temperature is closer to 70°F.

As far as lights out, the plant isn’t just constantly feeding on stored sugars in the roots, it gives back to the soil in an exchange of nutrients and other chemicals that only happens at night.
I have no idea what that means for a cutting trying to throw roots, but it suggests that plants would greatly benefit from a dark cycle as that’s what they’ve adapted to since the first plants evolved so many millions (billions?) of years ago.

I’m not pretending to be a scientist (obviously! and I’m fully aware that observing a couple rounds of clones at home is not true scientific testing in a controlled environment.
I’m also not pretending to know everything about cannabis, as this thread demonstrates my learning curve with my first time bubble cloning.
I’m not trying to be a dick either, it just seemed like your comments were suggesting that all questions have been answered and we know everything there is to know about cloning, when none of us really do.

I suppose all I can hope to do is find what works best for my plants in my room. Maybe one day soon scientists will test all these theories under controlled conditions and give us proper and accurate information so we can all make the most of our plants.

 

[LoveGrowingIt]

Your own example proves that there are things to explore

I posed the question to direct the conversation to the topic instead of criticizing how others find their own solutions. "Bro science" isn't necessarily bad or good. It's mostly a method of communication and exploration. Often, the best we can do is identify those amongst us with whom we share approaches to growing. Those who seek a single right answer are on a fool's quest. There isn't one. That said, here are a few short responses (and a few long ones) from my perspective.

defoliating

I let the plants defoliate themselves.

trimming the leaves [to] stimulate the root growth

I don't do that.

bubble cloners

I don't use that method. I don't need many clones.

lights out

As it applies to rooting clones, this is the point at which I became interested in this thread.

I’m not pretending to be a scientist

Nor am I.

I’m also not pretending to know everything about cannabis

Same as above.

I’m not trying to be a dick...

I didn't take it that way. No worries.

... it just seemed like your comments were suggesting that all questions have been answered and we know everything there is to know about cloning, when none of us really do.

Those were rhetorical questions, that is, questions asked to make a point rather than to get an answer. That point being many answers exist even if finding the answers may be difficult, thus, in those cases, further experimentation is akin to reinventing the wheel. You showed that to be true, for example, in your above explanation of sugars and roots. You get it.

I must point out, though, that I wrote "Most plant biology is established science." I did not use the word "all".

I suppose all I can hope to do is find what works best for my plants in my room.

True. Someone gave me that exact advice when I began growing. We need to develop our own growing styles by finding what works best for us, as individuals. Then relax and enjoy the products of our labors. Growing is half the fun.

Maybe one day soon scientists will test all these theories under controlled conditions and give us proper and accurate information so we can all make the most of our plants.

In scientific method, theories are not tested. Hypotheses are tested. Google "scientific method" for some fun late-night reading.

Consider that "controlled conditions" will be necessary for "proper and accurate information" to be applicable, but most of us don't grow our plants in (scientifically) controlled conditions. That's the problem, isn't it?

 

[Spliffy.Twojoints]

I think you missed the point, and I didn’t mean to imply that you think you’re an expert, I was just making it clear that I’m not.

Consider that "controlled conditions" will be necessary for "proper and accurate information" to be applicable, but most of us don't grow our plants in (scientifically) controlled conditions. That's the problem, isn't it?

No, the information gathered from the lab is still applicable even if we’re not growing in a lab.

For instance, crops are tested in the lab under exacting conditions to develop the best genetics possible and to be able to identify and prove what works best for that particular crop. Farmers are not expected to grow those crops in a laboratory, I believe they grow them in large open areas called “fields”, maybe you've heard of them?
So, we can find out the best things for the plants in the lab and then utilize that information in the real world, maybe tweaking to accommodate all those real world variables.

My main point was there’s lots of things posted as facts, such as whether we should defoliate or not. I wasn’t assuming you do it or if it’s good or bad, I was just giving an example of information passed off as fact that's actually based more on opinion and/or limited experience.
I found some people insisting that without a dome the cuttings wouldn’t make it on a bubbler, others said the water needed to be replaced every two days and I would have to add nutrients, chlorine etc.
Those things were stated as fact but not true. Maybe they would’ve rooted quicker with a dome and replaced water etc, I’ll just let someone else test that THEORY

In scientific method, theories are not tested. Hypotheses are tested. Google "scientific method" for some fun late-night reading.

Well, you say you’re not pretending to be a scientist, but I’m not sure I believe you

Those were rhetorical questions, that is, questions asked to make a point rather than to get an answer.

How enlightening, thanks for edumacating me.

I’m open to opinions that are different from mine and a good debate can often be informative. However, I don’t appreciate when people try to talk down to me, and I’m not so stupid that I can’t recognize it, so please just leave the superiority complex at home and let’s all focus on the joy we get from growing and learning all about these awesome plants.