When to stop training/ Nutes

[RoadKillSkunkHunt]

The salts are the key to flavor problems. I’ve gone a different nute route when we deal with nitrogen and am really liking what I’m getting out of trying to burn them a little with mega crop. You can but if you mix it right I’ve not burned even with spills.
I do feed more often and my girls like Mother Nature and not into being closet couch taters. So rain may be flushing them to an extent in the fabric pots

Not correct. If you grow a healthy plant to complete maturity and then dry/cure in the proper environment you cannot tell in a taste test which plants were grown organically and which were not. This has been proven by science a number of times. I used to grow organically but not anymore. My yields are through the roof using nutrient salts.

If you prefer organics, that is fine. Nothing wrong with that. But its the whole process, proper nutrition, timing of the harvest, and then the dry and cure that makes or breaks the taste of the bud.

 

[dreamnfox]

Not correct. If you grow a healthy plant to complete maturity and then dry/cure in the proper environment you cannot tell in a taste test which plants were grown organically and which were not. This has been proven by science a number of times. I used to grow organically but not anymore. My yields are through the roof using nutrient salts.

If you prefer organics, that is fine. Nothing wrong with that. But its the whole process, proper nutrition, timing of the harvest, and then the dry and cure that makes or breaks the taste of the bud.

100% this, I am an organic grower but I know plenty of salt growers with just as tasty flower. I have been able to get big yields with organics with the addition on CO2 and getting the environment dialed in

 

[MJmadscientist]

Yes, I’m realizing that now thank you

Autos will frustrate you. My problem starting out in my opinion was too much nutes and too much water.
When I left them alone other than my nute mix in the bottom 1/3 of the pot and I waited till there was good internodal growth the results were much better. The best one I have had I left it alone for like 4 weeks other than some foliar sprays with some stimulants.

 

[MJmadscientist]

Not correct. If you grow a healthy plant to complete maturity and then dry/cure in the proper environment you cannot tell in a taste test which plants were grown organically and which were not. This has been proven by science a number of times. I used to grow organically but not anymore. My yields are through the roof using nutrient salts.

If you prefer organics, that is fine. Nothing wrong with that. But its the whole process, proper nutrition, timing of the harvest, and then the dry and cure that makes or breaks the taste of the bud.

You can make them taste harsh. Not necessarily the norm but certain compounds and some foliar sprats linger in my opinion. All that said cure is more important. Don’t dry em out too much either. It loses a lot of flavor and pungency before you ever jar it.

What’s your thoughts on too much late nitrogen? I’ve had a lot of nitrogen at the end and it seemed to add to gassing off at the end. It makes it more grassy smelling early cure then fades as the cure ages.

 

[RoadKillSkunkHunt]

You can make them taste harsh. Not necessarily the norm but certain compounds and some foliar sprats linger in my opinion. All that said cure is more important. Don’t dry em out too much either. It loses a lot of flavor and pungency before you ever jar it.

What’s your thoughts on too much late nitrogen? I’ve had a lot of nitrogen at the end and it seemed to add to gassing off at the end. It makes it more grassy smelling early cure then fades as the cure ages.

I don't use foliar sprays. There's really no need for them indoors if you keep your plants healthy and don't have pest issues.

You can also make buds taste harsh or undesirable using organics. It's just as easy. The final taste of your flower, regardless of whether or not you use organics or salts is in how well it was grown, and how well it was cured.

 

[MJmadscientist]

I don't use foliar sprays. There's really no need for them indoors if you keep your plants healthy and don't have pest issues.

You can also make buds taste harsh or undesirable using organics. It's just as easy. The final taste of your flower, regardless of whether or not you use organics or salts is in how well it was grown, and how well it was cured.

Im not knocking you at all. I actually agree with you. I’m just unfortunately outdoors for the most part which comes with some extra curveballs.
I also was throwing that out there about foliar for those who try or believe in it. I do actually believe in foliar but it a niche practice I use.
I will go indoors to start early, nurse a girl back to health OR use the light to clone/keep a mother plant over winter. Things of that nature.
Buuuut we workin on that baller tent! Lol.



As far as organically vs salts. I’m a mix. Several of my nutes are organic certified. I use water soluble sea-k, my potting mix I make usually gets a recharge of Dr earth in the bottom, big on proper myco and bacteria like great white, then my amino acids so on and so on.

I do resort to salts though. I started with salts 20 years ago which makes me very comfortable with using them.

Organics/biostimulants are sort of like the icing on the cake. You get sort of a life hack out of their usage. These compounds in things like kelp/seaweed, alfalfa, several roots, and many plant materials “stem/leaf/root” from specific species all have hormones/compounds that give the plant MORE than what that pheno/species can “this works in the vegetable garden too”
This is similar to grafting root stock for other plants-trees mainly. The rootstock is faster growing and usually more resistant than the plant that the took the graft from.

 

[MJmadscientist]

haha nice!

Flushing’s effectiveness really does depend a lot on your growing method.

• In organic grows: The soil microbiome helps break down and buffer nutrients naturally, so flushing is often unnecessary.
• In chemical or synthetic nutrient grows: Flushing can help remove excess salts and residues that might build up, improving the final taste and quality.

So, saying “flushing is bullshit” is probably too extreme

I would say that yes and no. Organic and soil microbes there is research there that backs claims. Chemical if you’re talking soil/potting mix there is microbe life there and you can add it. They will break them down just the same. Science has proven that and it’s shown that the salts don’t necessarily kill out microbe life. They in-fact benefit them. Chemically food is food to them. Nitrates are nitrates, phosphates are phosphates, potassium is potassium.
It all comes in many different forms whether it’s from nature or it’s synthesized.

If anyone is interested in the research I can see about posting some links. It was quite the eye opener and anxiety reliever….I would stress about killing soil microbes that I worked hard to incorporate but would need to supplement- thinking I was ruining my efforts. Surprisingly some of these studies were done at state universities in not the most pot friendly states.

I think Roadkillskunk could probably chime in and explain some more as well.
We discussed organics thinking I was an organic fan. I commented below clarifying that I’m a mix of organic and salts.
We BOTH however have the same view on cure.
Scientifically cure is a complex process. I don’t fully understand it so don’t get me lying. However at the very basic level compounds inside the buds and plant fluids break down in a controlled environment. This destroys a lot of bad tastes associated with complaints. “Looking for something to blame so salts it was”
That said. I’ve had stuff that tastes harsh as smoking straight cardboard. It smelled of sweet freshly baled hay. I’ve had others that smelled good but they too were harsh. I’ve also had perfection.
What did I do wrong? I messed up on the cure. More specifically I was in a hurry. I dried them out too fast which basically halted any hopes of creating this magical curing environment.
So no matter how long I jarred, how much I waited, how many times I’d add moisture back into….my efforts were destined to be about as fruitful as trying to build a snowman in the Saharan desert.

 

[RoadKillSkunkHunt]

Im not knocking you at all. I actually agree with you. I’m just unfortunately outdoors for the most part which comes with some extra curveballs.
I also was throwing that out there about foliar for those who try or believe in it. I do actually believe in foliar but it a niche practice I use.
I will go indoors to start early, nurse a girl back to health OR use the light to clone/keep a mother plant over winter. Things of that nature.
Buuuut we workin on that baller tent! Lol.



As far as organically vs salts. I’m a mix. Several of my nutes are organic certified. I use water soluble sea-k, my potting mix I make usually gets a recharge of Dr earth in the bottom, big on proper myco and bacteria like great white, then my amino acids so on and so on.

I do resort to salts though. I started with salts 20 years ago which makes me very comfortable with using them.

Organics/biostimulants are sort of like the icing on the cake. You get sort of a life hack out of their usage. These compounds in things like kelp/seaweed, alfalfa, several roots, and many plant materials “stem/leaf/root” from specific species all have hormones/compounds that give the plant MORE than what that pheno/species can “this works in the vegetable garden too”
This is similar to grafting root stock for other plants-trees mainly. The rootstock is faster growing and usually more resistant than the plant that the took the graft from.

This is the first summer in 5 years that I don't have an outdoor grow. I have an abundance of cannabis on hand at the moment so I dedicated the greenhouse this summer to Roma tomatoes and bell peppers. lol. We'll be freezing a lot of produce this fall!

At any rate, I keep my methods pretty simple/straight forward. I start my seeds in "rapid rooter" pods. Once roots show at the bottom of the pod, they go into small pots. Once they are large enough for their final pot, I'll transplant them into Ocean Forest with about 10% extra perlite. My nutrients are GH Flora trio series and I feed my plants by the feed chart, altering plain water every other feeding. I use epsom salts during veg. I add cal-mag at about 2 weeks after switching the lights to 12/12. At that time, I discontinue with the epsom salts. After stretch, I use a product call "candy man" as a potassium boost to my main feed routine (GH Flora). I pick when the plants show about 10-20% amber on the trichomes. I try to keep things as simple as possible. I've been using this routine for about 4 years now. Prior to that, my go-to nutrients were the Terp Teas by Roots Organic. I use Recharge a couple of times during the grow. Water only but not a flush for the last watering or so before chop.

I use "Recharge," but other than that I don't add a bunch of specialty products like some growers do. I keep my plant's vegetation dry through out the grow, although there's a time you might need to use a foliar spray. I'm not against them. I have yet to have a need for one indoors. That pretty much sums up my grow.

 

[MJmadscientist]

I have several plants growing outside right now that are all flowers that are only 5 inches tall that have a bud on the top. They flower way too fast I believe sometimes you do not end up with more than 10 grams at the most what can I do to get more buds?

Man all I can tell you is check out the autoflower talk. We have discussed it a lot and I too messed up a lot. Autos are little stubborn children with a personality disorder.
They want what they want and they want it right now. Don’t you dare give it to them early. There too good for the great value brand…. They said the wanted the real shit mfr’! Lol.

In all seriousness though. Be mindful of your water starting out- fabric pots help-good airy potting mix helps.
Then don’t feed them for like 4-5 weeks. They really don’t like it in my experience. They are spiteful little bastards like that.
Don’t feed or train till you start getting good intermodal growth.

I’m sure someone else can chime in. Some of the members have a real dick slinging contest on growing massive autos. You know who you are.
Help him out if nobody has already. I’m getting dialed in with autos. That’s why I made this post. I need help on the tail end of things to max my yield