Mr.Sputnik
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Ok, I'm doing it. I'm going to start the Colorado MMJ FAQ with answers to a few questions I get asked ALL the time by people who live out of state and whom are interested in Colorado MMJ laws. Here's a PM I received:
Hi stranger, was looking at some of your post on the CO medical forum and was really impressed with your knowledge about CO law. I am looking to move to CO but have many questions. I hope you can shed some light on my questions.
First, do I have to have a medical condition to grow or is there a specific caregivers license that would allow me to grow for others?
A patient can have someone besides them self designated to grow their marijuana plants and provide them with their medicine. This person is called a caregiver. The caregiver must have a "significant responsability for the well being of a patient" as well but this has yet to be defined (but will be on Jan 27th, 2011)
You had better know how to grow as a caregiver because you won't have patients if you can't properly provide for them. You should grow strains tailored to the needs of each of your patients (if they ask) but many patients also enjoy the same medicine. I have grown medicine for patients with epilepsy, cancer, and severe pain and their medication (strain of marijuana and method of injestment) needs were very different from each other.
Caregiving can be more challenging than alot of people realize. The new Colorado MMJ economy has brought the best growers from around the country to Colorado to provide medicine for MMJ patients in this state. Colorado has always had excellent marijuana growers. The competition is more than alot of people are ready for in CO, especially in some of the mountain towns.
With that said how many plants can a caregiver grow per medical script and how many scripts can a caregiver hold?
This is the law lacking 2 noted exceptions
6 plants can be grown per patient. Of these 6 plants, only 3 may be mature. Mature is defined as "In a pickable state" and has yet to be further defined. I would simply define "mature" as a plant in the last 4 weeks of it's life cycle.*
A caregiver can hold 5 patients. A caregiver is not included as one of these 5 patients if the caregiver is a patient as well as a caregiver. The total maximum legal plant count for a caregiver is 30 (only 15 mature) plants if the caregiver is not a patient and 36 (only 18 mature) if the caregiver is a patient. **
*A patient/caregiver can raise an "affirmative defense" in court if the plant count required for a patient exceeds 6 plants. If an affirmative defense is taken, the court will reveal the medical records of the patient in order for the court to decide the legitimacy of the plant count. I would not go over the legally defined limit of 6 unless you are confident about winning a court case.
The cops aren't too keen on people growing 50 plants for personal use because the patient found a doc who charges $80 for a "standard" 6 plant recommendation and $300 for a 50 plant recommendation. A 50 plant doc rec isn't going to fly unless you have extensive medical documentation of a seriously debilitating condition. Something like cancer and epilepsy come to mind.
Some counties accept the higher count doc recs without questions asked and some you will have a court date.
**A caregiver can ask the state to approve them to caregive for more than 5 patients under "exceptional circumstances". Exceptional circumstances takes into consideration things such as the distance a patient must travel to obtain medication. If a patient lives in an area that bans commercial MMJ enterprise the patient may be forced to travel long distances to obtain medication. Patients would have to drive for more than 10 or so miles and some patients can't do this well. The state has allowed caregivers to fill the heath care access void in these areas.
What medical conditions are granted a permit?
cachexia; severe pain; severe nausea; seizures, including those that are characteristic of epilepsy; or persistent muscle spasms, including those that are characteristic of multiple sclerosis; or
Any other medical condition, or treatment for such condition, approved by the state health agency, pursuant to its rule making authority or its approval of any petition submitted by a patient or physician
I have carpel tunnel syndrome (blood flow problem to the wrist and hands) would something non terminal or non debilitating like this qualify?
If it causes you severe pain to the point where it can be debilitating then yes. Many work related injuries fall under severe pain (this is how I personally have my card, along with about 85% of the state).
As a caregiver, to whom can I sell my medical marijuana?
Simply put, to your patients who have you registered with the CDPHE as their primary caregiver.
The MMJ green rush in Colorado was formed underneath a false (illegal) premise. A caregiver has never been able to provide medicine in Colorado to anyone other than patients who have the caregiver in question listed as their primary caregiver with the CDPHE.
A secondary caregiver does not exist. A caregiver to caregiver sale is illegal. A patient to patient sale is illegal. The only MMJ sale that is protercted by AM20 is a primary caregiver to patient sale. It's been that way since 2000.
This is my conservative legal interpretation. I don't want to go to jail so my interpretation is conservative. If you don't like my interpretation, get a retainer with a lawyer. you might get to use your retainer, har har.
How much dry weight can a caregiver have?
2oz per patient. If you have more you fall into afirmative defense territory.
What the cops consider dry weight can vary as well. Process your trim ASAP after a grow and only keep buds and processed MMJ goods around. A cop could consider trim weight as MMJ.
If I had the legal right to grow 18 mature plants I would be using a 1000 HPS per plant growing trees. With that being said what are the cops gonna say if they come in and see 18 trees that could end up yielding 2lbs per plant?
they're gonna say "great job!". only 1k per plant? how about 8K? ok, seriously. there is no legally defined difference between a germinated seedling and a 30ft tree with 12 pounds on it. It's 1 plant until you cut it down. It's harvesting your herb where you run into issues.
what do I do with my extra medicine?
technically you're suposed to destroy it. Make a bunch of budder with it and turn it into a sculpture. Mail it to states that have a really serious MMJ health care disparity like kentucky (ok, this is an obvious joke).
It would be nice if there was a legit place that took MMJ donations to do clinical studies and experimental trials.
Are there groups that look out for those on the lower income bracket? I would hate to donate to a club under the "promise" my donations would go to those in need and it just be sold for a profit.
Well, don't give it to Tim Tipton or any one of the other scammers out there.
I have not personally heard of a legitimate outlet. There is WAY too much room for abuse and most people can't handle that. I had a good plan for MMC's to donate their trim from commercial grows to provide for the most severe 5% of patients but no one liked the idea of not making money. Oh so human, or is it?
I would be interested in knowing more about patient to patient transactions and a someone can wholesale a product such as candy with out being employed by a dispensary or kitchen more as a wholesaler.
Patient to patient transactions are not covered under AM20. They never were and they never will be. Only the patients registered primary caregiver can provide them with medicine, that's the whole point of a caregiver. A patient is covered to purchase meds from any source as long as it doesn't cross the CO state line. Only the primary caregiver of the patient in question is covered under AM20 for the sale of MMJ.
As far as wholesale MMJ sales, that's HB1284. HB1284 is illegal (none of it involves AM20) but it's tolerated because it's making the state alot of money. It gives the state the ability to regulate the living shit out of commercial MMJ. So you as a wholesaler will need to be employed by an MMC.
You are either a patient (covered under AM20), a caregiver (covered under AM20), or an MMC or employee of an MMC (NOT covered under AM20). That's it.
MMC's are not caregivers and caregivers are not MMC's
It doesn't matter if you just drive a truck with commercial MMJ in it, scrub the toilets in an MMC, or of you're in an MMC just to fix the heater. you will still have to pass the state background check and be employed by an MMC in order to get anywhere near meds.
If you work for an MMC and get charged by the fed with cultivation, posession, sale, transportation, ect you don't have a medical defense. MMC's don't have a medical defense. Think about that before you go work for or decide to open/buy an MMC. You may not have a felony now but you could easily get one when the fed decides to pucker up and hate weed again.
Is there or will there be a way for caregivers to make sure all their patients are still "under" them? I take good care of my patients, and dont suspect they would go AWOL..but would like to confirm with the CDPHE when i want to(like the cops easily can if they pull u over).
The CDPHE used to send caregivers some paperwork when a patient would change caregivers. This happened to me, it was pretty shitty to get a letter in the mail instead of your patient having the common decency to call and inform you (and then have the nerve to try and get meds from you anyway).
Regardless of that experience, it used to be a 30 day notice, basically any plants or meds you had for that patient was no longer covered after 30 days. There was an overlap period of 30 days where both new and old caregivers were covered by 1 patient.
As far as how the CDPHE is handling caregiver changes these days? They stopped sending the paperwork out so there's no good way to tell if a patient has dropped you as a caregiver and failed to inform you of the changes. Real shitty for caregivers.
The only suggestion that I can give you is to have a contract with each of your patients that stipulates the patient must notify you in writing if the patient decides to drop you as a caregiver and give you 30 days to make adjustments. That way if shit hits the fan you can make the patient (theoretically) liable for an undisclosed change of caregiver.
the CDPHE is really slacking in this respect but I have faith that the CDPHE will inevitably improve the system and start sending letters to caregivers once again.
How does one go about getting a care givers permit?
You need to be a Colorado resident. Currently there is not a time limit on residency for caregivers so you could move to CO, get a license, and have your paperwork sent in to the CDPHE in the same day if you so desire. Colorado does not care if you have criminal charges, you can still be a caregiver. All you need to do is have a CO MMJ patient fill out the proper paperwork. The CDPHE has been prompt in submitting forms and making changes to the registry, usually about 2 weeks. Make a copy of the paperwork that lists you as the caregiver and send it in certified mail. Once you get the delivery confirmation receipt in the mail you're good to go. You could start right after the patient fills out the paperwork but I would personally wait until confirmation of delivery. Currently a caregiver can have a max of 5 patients not including themself, 6 including their self.
How long does it take to get a medical permit and a caregivers permit?
To get the actual paperwork with the red card in the mail after you have gotten your Dr. rec and properly filled out the paperwork it has been taking about 3 weeks.
My caregiver change paperwork was rejected, why?
My friend just got a rejection in the mail a few days ago and we couldn't figure it out. He called and apparently the CDPHE needs to receive your notarized caregiver change paperwork within 10 days of the notary date. Notarize and mail the paperwork on a Monday.
I would send any and all paperwork to the CDPHE certified mail to avoid problems/BS.
Are there any parts of CO that do not allow caregiver grows?
That is illegal if that's the case, but there is no where in CO that has banned caregivers. There are some zoning restrictions about caregiver residential grows in some cities such as Denver and Ft. Collins but other then that keep it discrete and use a damn carbon filter and you'll be just fine
Have any towns banned medical growing at the caregiver level?
No, just some zoning restrictions about residential grows but that's it.
Is the renewal process the same as the original as far as getting the red card?
The renewal process is the same process as getting a new card. The only difference is a check box on the form that says "new" or "renewal".
Anyone know how far in advance you should start the renewal process?
From the date of my Dr. appointment to the day I got my card it was about 20 days. A month in advance to renew your card is a safe plan of action to avoid a possible date gap between your cards.
Hi stranger, was looking at some of your post on the CO medical forum and was really impressed with your knowledge about CO law. I am looking to move to CO but have many questions. I hope you can shed some light on my questions.
First, do I have to have a medical condition to grow or is there a specific caregivers license that would allow me to grow for others?
A patient can have someone besides them self designated to grow their marijuana plants and provide them with their medicine. This person is called a caregiver. The caregiver must have a "significant responsability for the well being of a patient" as well but this has yet to be defined (but will be on Jan 27th, 2011)
You had better know how to grow as a caregiver because you won't have patients if you can't properly provide for them. You should grow strains tailored to the needs of each of your patients (if they ask) but many patients also enjoy the same medicine. I have grown medicine for patients with epilepsy, cancer, and severe pain and their medication (strain of marijuana and method of injestment) needs were very different from each other.
Caregiving can be more challenging than alot of people realize. The new Colorado MMJ economy has brought the best growers from around the country to Colorado to provide medicine for MMJ patients in this state. Colorado has always had excellent marijuana growers. The competition is more than alot of people are ready for in CO, especially in some of the mountain towns.
With that said how many plants can a caregiver grow per medical script and how many scripts can a caregiver hold?
This is the law lacking 2 noted exceptions
6 plants can be grown per patient. Of these 6 plants, only 3 may be mature. Mature is defined as "In a pickable state" and has yet to be further defined. I would simply define "mature" as a plant in the last 4 weeks of it's life cycle.*
A caregiver can hold 5 patients. A caregiver is not included as one of these 5 patients if the caregiver is a patient as well as a caregiver. The total maximum legal plant count for a caregiver is 30 (only 15 mature) plants if the caregiver is not a patient and 36 (only 18 mature) if the caregiver is a patient. **
*A patient/caregiver can raise an "affirmative defense" in court if the plant count required for a patient exceeds 6 plants. If an affirmative defense is taken, the court will reveal the medical records of the patient in order for the court to decide the legitimacy of the plant count. I would not go over the legally defined limit of 6 unless you are confident about winning a court case.
The cops aren't too keen on people growing 50 plants for personal use because the patient found a doc who charges $80 for a "standard" 6 plant recommendation and $300 for a 50 plant recommendation. A 50 plant doc rec isn't going to fly unless you have extensive medical documentation of a seriously debilitating condition. Something like cancer and epilepsy come to mind.
Some counties accept the higher count doc recs without questions asked and some you will have a court date.
**A caregiver can ask the state to approve them to caregive for more than 5 patients under "exceptional circumstances". Exceptional circumstances takes into consideration things such as the distance a patient must travel to obtain medication. If a patient lives in an area that bans commercial MMJ enterprise the patient may be forced to travel long distances to obtain medication. Patients would have to drive for more than 10 or so miles and some patients can't do this well. The state has allowed caregivers to fill the heath care access void in these areas.
What medical conditions are granted a permit?
cachexia; severe pain; severe nausea; seizures, including those that are characteristic of epilepsy; or persistent muscle spasms, including those that are characteristic of multiple sclerosis; or
Any other medical condition, or treatment for such condition, approved by the state health agency, pursuant to its rule making authority or its approval of any petition submitted by a patient or physician
I have carpel tunnel syndrome (blood flow problem to the wrist and hands) would something non terminal or non debilitating like this qualify?
If it causes you severe pain to the point where it can be debilitating then yes. Many work related injuries fall under severe pain (this is how I personally have my card, along with about 85% of the state).
As a caregiver, to whom can I sell my medical marijuana?
Simply put, to your patients who have you registered with the CDPHE as their primary caregiver.
The MMJ green rush in Colorado was formed underneath a false (illegal) premise. A caregiver has never been able to provide medicine in Colorado to anyone other than patients who have the caregiver in question listed as their primary caregiver with the CDPHE.
A secondary caregiver does not exist. A caregiver to caregiver sale is illegal. A patient to patient sale is illegal. The only MMJ sale that is protercted by AM20 is a primary caregiver to patient sale. It's been that way since 2000.
This is my conservative legal interpretation. I don't want to go to jail so my interpretation is conservative. If you don't like my interpretation, get a retainer with a lawyer. you might get to use your retainer, har har.
How much dry weight can a caregiver have?
2oz per patient. If you have more you fall into afirmative defense territory.
What the cops consider dry weight can vary as well. Process your trim ASAP after a grow and only keep buds and processed MMJ goods around. A cop could consider trim weight as MMJ.
If I had the legal right to grow 18 mature plants I would be using a 1000 HPS per plant growing trees. With that being said what are the cops gonna say if they come in and see 18 trees that could end up yielding 2lbs per plant?
they're gonna say "great job!". only 1k per plant? how about 8K? ok, seriously. there is no legally defined difference between a germinated seedling and a 30ft tree with 12 pounds on it. It's 1 plant until you cut it down. It's harvesting your herb where you run into issues.
what do I do with my extra medicine?
technically you're suposed to destroy it. Make a bunch of budder with it and turn it into a sculpture. Mail it to states that have a really serious MMJ health care disparity like kentucky (ok, this is an obvious joke).
It would be nice if there was a legit place that took MMJ donations to do clinical studies and experimental trials.
Are there groups that look out for those on the lower income bracket? I would hate to donate to a club under the "promise" my donations would go to those in need and it just be sold for a profit.
Well, don't give it to Tim Tipton or any one of the other scammers out there.
I have not personally heard of a legitimate outlet. There is WAY too much room for abuse and most people can't handle that. I had a good plan for MMC's to donate their trim from commercial grows to provide for the most severe 5% of patients but no one liked the idea of not making money. Oh so human, or is it?
I would be interested in knowing more about patient to patient transactions and a someone can wholesale a product such as candy with out being employed by a dispensary or kitchen more as a wholesaler.
Patient to patient transactions are not covered under AM20. They never were and they never will be. Only the patients registered primary caregiver can provide them with medicine, that's the whole point of a caregiver. A patient is covered to purchase meds from any source as long as it doesn't cross the CO state line. Only the primary caregiver of the patient in question is covered under AM20 for the sale of MMJ.
As far as wholesale MMJ sales, that's HB1284. HB1284 is illegal (none of it involves AM20) but it's tolerated because it's making the state alot of money. It gives the state the ability to regulate the living shit out of commercial MMJ. So you as a wholesaler will need to be employed by an MMC.
You are either a patient (covered under AM20), a caregiver (covered under AM20), or an MMC or employee of an MMC (NOT covered under AM20). That's it.
MMC's are not caregivers and caregivers are not MMC's
It doesn't matter if you just drive a truck with commercial MMJ in it, scrub the toilets in an MMC, or of you're in an MMC just to fix the heater. you will still have to pass the state background check and be employed by an MMC in order to get anywhere near meds.
If you work for an MMC and get charged by the fed with cultivation, posession, sale, transportation, ect you don't have a medical defense. MMC's don't have a medical defense. Think about that before you go work for or decide to open/buy an MMC. You may not have a felony now but you could easily get one when the fed decides to pucker up and hate weed again.
Is there or will there be a way for caregivers to make sure all their patients are still "under" them? I take good care of my patients, and dont suspect they would go AWOL..but would like to confirm with the CDPHE when i want to(like the cops easily can if they pull u over).
The CDPHE used to send caregivers some paperwork when a patient would change caregivers. This happened to me, it was pretty shitty to get a letter in the mail instead of your patient having the common decency to call and inform you (and then have the nerve to try and get meds from you anyway).
Regardless of that experience, it used to be a 30 day notice, basically any plants or meds you had for that patient was no longer covered after 30 days. There was an overlap period of 30 days where both new and old caregivers were covered by 1 patient.
As far as how the CDPHE is handling caregiver changes these days? They stopped sending the paperwork out so there's no good way to tell if a patient has dropped you as a caregiver and failed to inform you of the changes. Real shitty for caregivers.
The only suggestion that I can give you is to have a contract with each of your patients that stipulates the patient must notify you in writing if the patient decides to drop you as a caregiver and give you 30 days to make adjustments. That way if shit hits the fan you can make the patient (theoretically) liable for an undisclosed change of caregiver.
the CDPHE is really slacking in this respect but I have faith that the CDPHE will inevitably improve the system and start sending letters to caregivers once again.
How does one go about getting a care givers permit?
You need to be a Colorado resident. Currently there is not a time limit on residency for caregivers so you could move to CO, get a license, and have your paperwork sent in to the CDPHE in the same day if you so desire. Colorado does not care if you have criminal charges, you can still be a caregiver. All you need to do is have a CO MMJ patient fill out the proper paperwork. The CDPHE has been prompt in submitting forms and making changes to the registry, usually about 2 weeks. Make a copy of the paperwork that lists you as the caregiver and send it in certified mail. Once you get the delivery confirmation receipt in the mail you're good to go. You could start right after the patient fills out the paperwork but I would personally wait until confirmation of delivery. Currently a caregiver can have a max of 5 patients not including themself, 6 including their self.
How long does it take to get a medical permit and a caregivers permit?
To get the actual paperwork with the red card in the mail after you have gotten your Dr. rec and properly filled out the paperwork it has been taking about 3 weeks.
My caregiver change paperwork was rejected, why?
My friend just got a rejection in the mail a few days ago and we couldn't figure it out. He called and apparently the CDPHE needs to receive your notarized caregiver change paperwork within 10 days of the notary date. Notarize and mail the paperwork on a Monday.
I would send any and all paperwork to the CDPHE certified mail to avoid problems/BS.
Are there any parts of CO that do not allow caregiver grows?
That is illegal if that's the case, but there is no where in CO that has banned caregivers. There are some zoning restrictions about caregiver residential grows in some cities such as Denver and Ft. Collins but other then that keep it discrete and use a damn carbon filter and you'll be just fine
Have any towns banned medical growing at the caregiver level?
No, just some zoning restrictions about residential grows but that's it.
Is the renewal process the same as the original as far as getting the red card?
The renewal process is the same process as getting a new card. The only difference is a check box on the form that says "new" or "renewal".
Anyone know how far in advance you should start the renewal process?
From the date of my Dr. appointment to the day I got my card it was about 20 days. A month in advance to renew your card is a safe plan of action to avoid a possible date gap between your cards.