Stop Chronic Overfeeding, and some tips with canna coco

  • Thread starter DowNwithDirT
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DowNwithDirT

DowNwithDirT

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LESS IS MORE.....

I have been a chronic overfeeder for around 3 yrs now. In over half a dozen systems, coco,soil, ebb n flo, deep water, shallow water, in or out.......

Enough with the past.....here what I do for certain know.

*Additives are not needed, other than a bloom booster, and zone/h202 to keep things clean

*Rhizo as a foliar, and once @ transplant at 2ml/gal

*Canna wants you to pour your money down the drain.

*Plants over/underfed have very similar traits.

*r/o water works but you must add calmag, and preferably a higher cal product like....

*Calimagic....to replace calmag+ for the win!

*LESS IS MORE>......... .5 scale for those caring.
***200 ppm of a + b for veg...is plenty....
***400 ppm of a + b for flower is plenty.

***Calimagic/a+b ratio***
150 ppm/200 ppm = 350
100 ppm/3ooppm = 400
50 ppm/ 400 ppm= 450

* 5.8 ph*

* when transplanting....no charge, no double dose, and no flush....just absolutely water to 3o% run off.

I havent had this good of results in almost 4 years.

plants can take extreme amount of abuse, overfeeding and mistreatment
Two runs ago I was feeding around 1200 ppm's and the plants took it without much signs of dislike....

Currently @ wk 4 with 10 strains all being fed the same soup.
@ 500 ppm total max solution.

hope this helps someone....I'll try to get some pics up soon.
 
Carl Sagan

Carl Sagan

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I can confirm that most of whatcher sayin' works

Ever use the grow guide on canna site? The feedings are BEASTLY, and sure to hurt your plant if you simply dump what they say to use into your res.

It's more important to look at that grow guide as what you want to ACCUMULATE in the bottom of your pots of coco for your root mass.

For all intents and purposes, coco is hydro, but not when it comes to eating one's feedings. Your 30% runoff figure was right on, and ensures that you shouldnt have much salt buildup. I use 4-6mL/gal max in veg and 8-9mL/gallon max in flower. Frequent, light feedings to ensure a full strength mix in the bottom of your root mass/pot.
 
southstreets

southstreets

1,480
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I did notice following cannas chart that at 11-12 ml per gal the tips started burning a lil bit.. And they want it pushed to 15 ml per gal? Lol... What you guys think of the boost?
 
S

Shamanfarmer

68
18
I was running 400-500 ppm in flower, kept having deficiency problems, on the advice of some farmers here i increased my ppm to 600-800 at the start of flower and things have turned around drastically. I'm growing in 3-5 gallon smart pots filled with 100% coco. I agree with you that over feeding is a very common problem, but every situation is different. There are an infinite number of variables that effect indoor gardens so it's impossible to say what the appropriate nutrient concentration will be for every situation.
 
DowNwithDirT

DowNwithDirT

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CannaBoost is over priced and not worth but in a few doses throughout flower.....

I like using boosters like moab, super natural bud blaster, monster grow bloom......etc....something around 0-50-30

I'll use them all around the same dosage......1 teaspoon per 15 gal's after wk 3.

As someone stated there are endless variables that contribute to a grow....but for what its worth this works.......and I'll explain why..

As shaman farmer said he was having problems when at 400-500 ppm...with no cal mag...you will have issues...

when you hit 700ppm of canna base nutrients you have reached sufficient levels of calcium and no longer need any added...hence why you think you solved the problem...which essentially you did but you could have stayed at that level and supplemented very little calcium......

This is based on slightly rough math but is very close to correct......in my experiece...

3ml/gal =.4 ec=200ppm with around 44 ppm of calcium
4.5ml/gal =.6 ec=300ppm with around 66 ppm of calcium
6.2ml/gal =.8 ec=400ppm with around 88 ppm of calcium
7.7ml/gal= 1 ec =500ppm with around 112 ppm of calcium
9.2ml/gal=1.2 ec=600ppm with around 135 ppm of calcium.........

you need around 150 ppm of calcium alone.....so even if when I'm at 200 ppm if I only added 100ppm of calimagic, only 75 is calcium so I would still be short......

Fatmans diy nute mixing is a good place to start...or anywhere really if you can figure out the math.
 
leadsled

leadsled

GrowRU
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Chronic overfeeder. ROFL! Have you tried boost?

Be warned, Those levels with canna alone, will not be enough for heavy feeding strains. You got it solved with the cal/mg. That is why I was always turned off by there base.

For other reading and making the switch: If your switching to canna from another brand good to keep that in mind as well. Same ec in canna is not the same as other brands as well.
 
DowNwithDirT

DowNwithDirT

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263
Chronic overfeeder. ROFL! Have you tried boost?

Be warned, Those levels with canna will not be enough for heavy feeding strains.

For other reading and making the switch: If your switching to canna from another brand good to keep that in mind as well. Same ec in canna is not the same as other brands as well.

I highly disagree, and bet half your "heavy feeding strains" are actually just more tolerant of overfeeding...
I used to think og was a heavy feeder....ha what a joke. But go ahead and keep using more than 8.5-9 ml's per gallon.....

I don't care either way if you believe me or not...If you read my posts, I've done it both ways, hit em with 2.4 ec or with less than 1 ec. Guess which one is going to taste better, look better, and yield more....hmmm.


ps....Calmag + is crap, and getting your calcium levels right open up the availability of all other nutrients.
I have been researching this for 6 months across 9 lights....with over 18 strains.....
Starting low and working up. Starting high and working to a base line.
 
leadsled

leadsled

GrowRU
2,145
263
Why would you state to use rhizotonic, boosting your roots. Then why would you go and burn your roots with h202?

Seems counter productive, coco is excellent protection for your roots.

I don't feel that is a cost effective approach or good advice.

Excellent advice and thanks for sharing. IF you have reasoning behind the approach please explain. Rhizotonic is an expensive product and seems like you could save more by taking it out. That is, if your set on using zone/h202 products..
 
DowNwithDirT

DowNwithDirT

1,468
263
only gh Calimagic for me these days.

at week 4 I am using around 1ml/gal. Which comes out to around 70-80 ppm. I'll start decreasing it at the end of wk 5 beginning of week 6.

This Calcium information is purely based on a Canna schedule, using calimagic. As I stated, once you hit around 700ppm you no longer need calmag additives.

Anyone can do the math for any nutrient!
 
true grit

true grit

6,269
313
Can I come in and add? muahahah....

Calmag is not needed with RO....I only use calplex and never exceed 5ml/g in bloom...and I cut it out by wk6. I also never precharge coco and use it straight- no cut.

No need for run off....that leads to other issues. Again as you mentioned Drip Clean for the win if using chems in coco, but I never have run off...not even when flushing. If there is no salt build up, there is no need for run off. Learning how much your plants drink a day leads to even less over feeding, less use of nutrients, and more rapid root growth due to proper wet/dry cycles.

Agreed, no extra additives are necessarily needed...only necessesities i find are, humics/fulvics/aminos and kelp. I add a PK boost and play with sulfur levels as I choose. Unless working a bio field even carbs aren't needed as much (yes ive done side by sides) and gatorade works fine when needed (thanks Obs!).

and my secret coco tip for the day....pH to 6.0...just sayin ;)

and lastly....organic coco for the super win and ease, fuckin ronco style- "set it and forget it."
 
leadsled

leadsled

GrowRU
2,145
263
I highly disagree, and bet half your "heavy feeding strains" are actually just more tolerant of overfeeding...
I used to think og was a heavy feeder....ha what a joke. But go ahead and keep using more than 8.5-9 ml's per gallon.....

I don't care either way if you believe me or not...If you read my posts, I've done it both ways, hit em with 2.4 ec or with less than 1 ec. Guess which one is going to taste better, look better, and yield more....hmmm.


ps....Calmag + is crap, and getting your calcium levels right open up the availability of all other nutrients.
I have been researching this for 6 months across 9 lights....with over 18 strains.....
Starting low and working up. Starting high and working to a base line.

I never stated any of what you stated is NOT true. Everyone has a different room strain, mix of coco , enviroment etc. I used the words MAY, because everyone MAY have difference results.

Good for you. What works well for you may not work well for someone else. Is the experience of others that understand overfeeding.

Cmon, No way one grower can grown every strain out there and take into consideration all the factors. I am no way attacking your statements, just sharing....
 
DowNwithDirT

DowNwithDirT

1,468
263
Why would you state to use rhizotonic, boosting your roots. Then why would you go and burn your roots with h202?

Seems counter productive, coco is excellent protection for your roots.

I don't feel that is a cost effective approach or good advice.

Excellent advice and thanks for sharing. IF you have reasoning behind the approach please explain. Rhizotonic is an expensive product and seems like you could save more by taking it out. That is, if your set on using zone/h202 products..


Who said anything about h202 burning roots. Rhizo is used once @ transplant and is othewise used as a foliar on occasion.

H202 is an oxidizer that works excellent in hydro, coco, and dwc. Used at anywhere from 1ml/gal to 4ml/gal, with cost being very low.

Rhizo has not shown any problems with h202...at all. Cannazyme and h202 however will ruin everything.

zone is another alternative that works great, and I acutally prefer this over h202, but will use both on occasion.

Your trying to keep the coco fairly well saturated at all times, and I have most def encountered some root problems in the past....I use these all as preventatives and to keep my roots shiny and bright. And again best root health and plant health in 4 or more yrs...after using soil, dwc, undercurrent, coco, ebb n flow etc....
 

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