Is this eary sign of cal-mag deficiencies, please help

Looks like pH is out of wack or you are locked out. Calcium is best absorbed at a higher pH. Double check but I think is is 6.0 - 6.5 for coco/hydro. I would actually do flush with your base nutrients and a cal/mag supplement at a 6.1 or 6.2 pH. Leave out the other supplements until you got just the base dialed in.

Seraphine said:

Looks like pH is out of wack or you are locked out. Calcium is best absorbed at a higher pH. Double check but I think is is 6.0 - 6.5 for coco/hydro. I would actually do flush with your base nutrients and a cal/mag supplement at a 6.1 or 6.2 pH. Leave out the other supplements until you got just the base dialed in.

Click to expand...

Thanks

I have already flushed feed just calmag at 0.2/0.4e.c only for this one to check if was lockout. And pH at 6.0
Run off was 1.0e.c and oh 6.3

I been playing a out with pH 5.8 & 6.0 since growing in coco and 6.0 does seem to be better, I'm worried going to pH 6.2 or higher

THCMonster said:

Yea so if your run off is coming out at .8 ec with just plain water then you definitely have a build up of nutrients!

What media do you grow in? (Coco, peat, dirt?)

If your growing in coco then you need to be adding cal mag all the time.

But let me know the media you grow with and i can help further

Click to expand...

Ye sorry , I'm using coco from a bag by canna coco.

That flush did contain that calmag at 150-200ppm aswell i think u got me already tho lol, but like your said 0.2/0.4 e.c in and 1.0e.c out sees quite a difference don't it,

So if I needed calmag can this cause problem's with the plants not using the nutrients in the coco and cause build up then, or have i just over fed myself and also I need calmag

If your run off is coming out at .8ec with just plain water then you definitely have a build up of nutrients, do you know the PH of the run off?

With coco you need:

1) Constant cal mag addition.
2) Run off should never be over 300ppms of what you are feeding in.
3) never give your plants just pure water as a feeding for your plant for more then 1 day (coco doesnt hold nutrients like dirt, so you will go deficient)
4) always feed with PH of 6.0-6.2
5) run off PH should be around the same PH as you feed in!

Ph 007 said:

Ye sorry , I'm using coco from a bag by canna coco.

That flush did contain that calmag at 150-200ppm aswell i think u got me already tho lol, but like your said 0.2/0.4 e.c in and 1.0e.c out sees quite a difference don't it,

So if I needed calmag can this cause problem's with the plants not using the nutrients in the coco and cause build up then, or have i just over fed myself and also I need calmag

Click to expand...

Sorry i saw... I just reply so much on here that i forget what people are growing in

And I guess

THCMonster said:

If your run off is coming out at .8ec with just plain water then you definitely have a build up of nutrients, do you know the PH of the run off?

With coco you need:

1) Constant cal mag addition.
2) Run off should never be over 300ppms of what you are feeding in.
3) never give your plants just pure water as a feeding for your plant for more then 1 day (coco doesnt hold nutrients like dirt, so you will go deficient)
4) always feed with PH of 6.0-6.2
5) run off PH should be around the same PH as you feed in!

Click to expand...

Thanks, i just screen shot that on my phone to view anytime as a guid well noted haha

I pH'ed earlier at 6.0 and then out wqw ph/6.3

THCMonster said:

Sorry i saw... I just reply so much on here that i forget what people are growing in

Click to expand...

Haha was think why the hell he keep asking me
Even worst I replied before noticing what u just said

Ph 007 said:

Ye sorry , I'm using coco from a bag by canna coco.

That flush did contain that calmag at 150-200ppm aswell i think u got me already tho lol, but like your said 0.2/0.4 e.c in and 1.0e.c out sees quite a difference don't it,

So if I needed calmag can this cause problem's with the plants not using the nutrients in the coco and cause build up then, or have i just over fed myself and also I need calmag

Click to expand...

Flush your plants with regular water, and keep flushing then until the ppms get down to 100-200. That goes for every plant!

Otherwise the build up will just continue to happen.

Once you flush them with plain water (no cal mag) down to 100ppms, then flush briefly with nutrient water, do 200ppms of cal mag, and add 500ppms of all your other base line nutrients!

When you feed that through, tomorrow water your plants again with the same 200ppm of cal mag and 500ppm of other nutrients to give a total of 700ppms, check the run off! If the run off is above 1000ppms then you need to bring down the nutrients you are feeding in, if the run off is under 900-1000 ppms then you need to feed more nutrients.

What I mean by that is, when I water my plants I give them 1200ppms, the next day when I feed them 1200ppm again the run off comes out at 1400-1500ppm.

If it came out higher then I would drop my PPMs that i feed in by 100-200 ppms

This is the commerical facility i work in and
These are my personal grow!

All of which are grown with coco!

THCMonster said:

Flush your plants with regular water, and keep flushing then until the ppms get down to 100-200. That goes for every plant!

Otherwise the build up will just continue to happen.

Once you flush them with plain water (no cal mag) down to 100ppms, then flush briefly with nutrient water, do 200ppms of cal mag, and add 500ppms of all your other base line nutrients!

When you feed that through, tomorrow water your plants again with the same 200ppm of cal mag and 500ppm of other nutrients to give a total of 700ppms, check the run off! If the run off is above 1000ppms then you need to bring down the nutrients you are feeding in, if the run off is under 900-1000 ppms then you need to feed more nutrients.

What I mean by that is, when I water my plants I give them 1200ppms, the next day when I feed them 1200ppm again the run off comes out at 1400-1500ppm.

If it came out higher then I would drop my PPMs that i feed in by 100-200 ppms

Click to expand...

I have not long watered , you think it's safe so do what your said now then again TMZ ?

THCMonster said:

View attachment 939291

This is the commerical facility i work in andView attachment 939294View attachment 939293View attachment 939292
These are my personal grow!

All of which are grown with coco!

Click to expand...

That's a cracking grown their , look amazing , them buds huge :)
Bet your laughed when u seen mine at week 5 lol

What feed do you use and when do you add pk boost ? And any other boost I'd any

What room temps / what watering style
and what ph 6.0+6.2 you use is it?

Brick or bagged cocco ?



Haha sorry with all the questions I need to know after seeing them ,

Do you use co2 ? Them buds looks crazy fat , do you flush between feeds If so what with what strength


Now noticed you said work and your personal one, both amazing fair play, but them at work are massive aint they

Coco bricks, i use organics at my house but Canna coco nutrients at the facility among other nutrients.

I run co2 at my house but not at the facility because we exhaust during flower.

I shoot for PH 6.0-6.2 all the way through

My feeding schedule before running organics consisted of:

Monosilicic Acid Power Si- 150- 200ppms
Cal-mag+ - 150-200ppm
Baseline nutrients- 200-600ppm
Pk 13/14- 200-400ppm

I start off at 1000ppm of those combos in beginning of flower, i start adding my pk boost at week 4, which bring my feed to 1200ppm, every week i bring it up 100ppm of pk until week 6-7 depending on if my plants can take it, then i hit them hard for the last week with 500ppm of extra PK booster. (Only if your plants can take that much ppm)

Thats how you know if you have a heavy feeding strain or not.

If you give 400ppms of pk booster in coco and your plants start to slightly burn then dont go that high!

But it should be at least a good 200-400 ppm that most strains can handle! And the last week you should be able to hit them hard!

I actually use to get slightly more weight with synthetics, the only reason i switched to organic is because its WAY lower cost, only costs me $300-400 for 4 harvests now whereas before it cost me $1000-$1500 per harvest! Lol

I didnt laugh at your stuff! My first plant i ever grew i only got a little under a half off of! So i dont judge anyones stuff!

Everyone has to start somewhere! So dont get discouraged! The reason i posted those pics wasnt to brag on what i do, it was to show you that, that is what you can get once you dial coco and your feeds in!

Ive been growing with coco for 7+ years now, im not an expert but i have seen almost everything you can imagine just to be where im at now!

You live and you learn! But as long as u are actually learning from your mistakes then you'll be fine!

Once you dial it all in it will become 2nd nature to you and you will be rocking out grows left and right without any effort at all!

Also temps are 78-82 in veg but humidity is 60%+

And flower is 82+ degrees with 40-45% humidity, but those temps are only because of CO2

Ph 007 said:

I have not long watered , you think it's safe so do what your said now then again TMZ ?

Click to expand...

It is safe to flush with coco at any point, whether u just watered or not, its almost impossible to over water plants in coco

I would do the flush like i said, but once the ppms are at least 100ppm, then feed them with the mentioned 700ppm nutrient combo.

THCMonster said:

It is safe to flush with coco at any point, whether u just watered or not, its almost impossible to over water plants in coco

I would do the flush like i said, but once the ppms are at least 100ppm, then feed them with the mentioned 700ppm nutrient combo.

Click to expand...

Im gonna do that tomorrow now.
I just checked them from earlier they do look a tad better already purking up just a bit more.

Im gonna follow your instructions and see bow it workout for me, I'll shall post some pics and a update in few days hopefully want be saying they looking worst lol.

Thanks for the help

You're close to figuring things out... with coco it's all about finding a routine/schedule/program that works for you in your own situation. Your plants need 5-700ppm right now, how many ml/gal of your Canna Nutrients are you adding?

You can flush anytime in coco as stated above.. you definitely need to do that first thing
But I NEVER use plain water in coco. Ever. I flush with 2ml/gal of Calimagic (i'd recommend getting this one specifically) and 3-4 ml/gal of Canna A and Canna B. The flushing solution should be about 300ppm. Again, you never ever want to use plain water in Coco. Ever. That will eliminate a lot of your headaches right there.

Run that solution through your pots and keep removing the excess water. Or just put them in your bathtub or something and flush the living shit out of them.... do 2 or 3 flushes at least. Once you get runoff, wait about 15 minutes then add more mild nutrient solution.. then wait 15 more minutes and do it again. You're trying to absorb all the old salts in there, hence the mild nutrient solution. Then once it's re-absorbed all your old nutrients, you want to flush that shit out of your pot.

After you've flushed the shit out of them with the diluted nutrient solution, you'll want to refresh your pots with full strength nutrients.

I use the full line of Canna nutrients and have for years.. here is what i feed everything from clones to 2-3 month old ladies...
GH Armor Si ... 1.25 ml/gal
Calimagic ... 2ml/gal
Canna A ... 6ml/gal
Canna B ... 6ml/gal
Rhizotonic ... 8ml/gal
Cannazym ... 10ml/gal
and then pH to 5.9... or 6.0 if you prefer. Anywhere between 5.8-6.2 should be good. I usually set my reservoir pH to 5.8 then it slowly drifts up to 6.1 over the next few days.

For mothers/old veg plants I keep everything the same, but up A + B to 8ml/gal instead of 6


How many ml/gal of A +B are you using?
You can ignore the "buffered" EC readings of your medium. Literally just ignore it. Only pay attention to your feeds and the pH of your nutrient solutions. Runoff readings are inaccurate.. just don't do them. Learn to read the plants. The only way to get an accurate "runoff pH" is to do a slurry test.

And always flush regularly in coco. I keep my feedings relatively low.. so i only flush once a week. Most people say ~20% runoff daily.. but that's overkill. Be safe and meet somewhere in the middle between daily and weekly. But when i do flush, i get more like 30-40% runoff to make sure everything is still balanced out. Then once they're fully flushed I run full-strength nutrients through them until I get runoff one last time. Then they're fully flushed and re-stocked with good nutrients at the proper pH

One last thing - your plants are small and no way they need feedings 2x per day. Maybe 1x per day, or even every other day until they get bigger. You might be overwatering them.. the dry cycle is important after transplant to establish a good root system. That might be why you have a hard time after transplanting clones into coco. Let that shit dry out between feedings the first time or two after transplanting. Just a little trick for ya that helps a ton with root development, which in turn helps the whole plant

02trueblue said:

You're close to figuring things out... with coco it's all about finding a routine/schedule/program that works for you in your own situation. Your plants need 5-700ppm right now, how many ml/gal of your Canna Nutrients are you adding?

You can flush anytime in coco as stated above.. you definitely need to do that first thing
But I NEVER use plain water in coco. Ever. I flush with 2ml/gal of Calimagic (i'd recommend getting this one specifically) and 3-4 ml/gal of Canna A and Canna B. The flushing solution should be about 300ppm. Again, you never ever want to use plain water in Coco. Ever. That will eliminate a lot of your headaches right there.

Run that solution through your pots and keep removing the excess water. Or just put them in your bathtub or something and flush the living shit out of them.... do 2 or 3 flushes at least. Once you get runoff, wait about 15 minutes then add more mild nutrient solution.. then wait 15 more minutes and do it again. You're trying to absorb all the old salts in there, hence the mild nutrient solution. Then once it's re-absorbed all your old nutrients, you want to flush that shit out of your pot.

After you've flushed the shit out of them with the diluted nutrient solution, you'll want to refresh your pots with full strength nutrients.

I use the full line of Canna nutrients and have for years.. here is what i feed everything from clones to 2-3 month old ladies...
GH Armor Si ... 1.25 ml/gal
Calimagic ... 2ml/gal
Canna A ... 6ml/gal
Canna B ... 6ml/gal
Rhizotonic ... 8ml/gal
Cannazym ... 10ml/gal
and then pH to 5.9... or 6.0 if you prefer. Anywhere between 5.8-6.2 should be good. I usually set my reservoir pH to 5.8 then it slowly drifts up to 6.1 over the next few days.

For mothers/old veg plants I keep everything the same, but up A + B to 8ml/gal instead of 6


How many ml/gal of A +B are you using?
You can ignore the "buffered" EC readings of your medium. Literally just ignore it. Only pay attention to your feeds and the pH of your nutrient solutions. Runoff readings are inaccurate.. just don't do them. Learn to read the plants. The only way to get an accurate "runoff pH" is to do a slurry test.

And always flush regularly in coco. I keep my feedings relatively low.. so i only flush once a week. Most people say ~20% runoff daily.. but that's overkill. Be safe and meet somewhere in the middle between daily and weekly. But when i do flush, i get more like 30-40% runoff to make sure everything is still balanced out. Then once they're fully flushed I run full-strength nutrients through them until I get runoff one last time. Then they're fully flushed and re-stocked with good nutrients at the proper pH

Click to expand...

Thanks for this I shall looks through of properly tomorrow,
I not sure what ml a litre of what I'm using I know in use 2.5ml cannyzm I didn't use to add it at start, I use to just give a&b then add Cannyzm 1st week flower, this time with thse I added cannyzm at 2.5ml a litre that 0.2e.c
Then I'd add a&b at 0.6e.c with no calmag.

I might cut the cannzym TMZ and so what you both said flush with calmag then feed with calmag and feed but I'm gonna just give a&b not the cannyzm I noticed u use 10ml a litre of it, not sure if its really needed? Or would the a&b be to low on p&k. I added cannyzm this time round at start to see if that made any difference but still got same problem yellowing so on. So hopefully in calmag, I know my water is soft water, but also canna contains a bit calmag I think but maybe not enough think they expect you to have a water e.c of 0.4 before adding their feeds

Iv grown in soil for years, I then
went to coco few months ago
i use to use the nutrients below for years iv use them in soil and worked well, they are universal so good for soft water,

but in change to canna coco nutrients line then with coco and its all be fun and games lol

her is my old nutrients below, I only learned more this year about npk and figured out my ole nutrients are to high in npk so that why I changed to coco. If my old nutrients are fine then I got feeling I want get problems and went need calmag.


My first grow in coco was with my old nutrients below bottom fee feed flush feed flush, and I had 2 plants
7 oz dry a plant, since going to canna and top feeding I hit 3-4 a plant that with problems from the start so not to bad


You guys think these night NPK levels in my old feed are fine they dam high I'm lurning..

okay okay first things first... the basics are very important to success in coco

You really need to PRECISELY measure your nutrients. I use a pipette until i figure out the exact measurement markers in my larger beakers. You should know exactly how much of each nutrient is going into each gallon/liter.

Always always always add your CalMag first, before you add A + B. Then add your additives
When mixing your nutrient solution, do it in this order. This is important stuff
1) Calmag
2) Canna A - this is your basic solution, it will raise your pH
3) Canna B - this is your acidic solution, it will lower your pH back down
4) Rhizotonic
5) Cannazym
6) set pH to 6.0
***after you add one type of nutrient wait at least a few minutes before adding the next one
** after setting the pH, wait at least 30 minutes before feeding the plant

^^doing this alone will cut out a lot of headaches for you, too

Concerning the Cannazym... it's not absolutely necessary in Veg, but it does make a difference. I like the added PK from it - Canna A + B could have better NPK ratios alone. You definitely want to add Cannazym in in flower.

Rhizotonic has 0 NPK value.. it's mostly just kelp. Some humics and thigns too. But it makes the plants WAY happier and greens them up nicely.

Ph 007 said:

Iv grown in soil for years, I then
went to coco few months ago
i use to use the nutrients below for years iv use them in soil and worked well, they are universal so good for soft water,

but in change to canna coco nutrients line then with coco and its all be fun and games lol

her is my old nutrients below, I only learned more this year about npk and figured out my ole nutrients are to high in npk so that why I changed to coco. If my old nutrients are fine then I got feeling I want get problems and went need calmag.


My first grow in coco was with my old nutrients below bottom fee feed flush feed flush, and I had 2 plants
7 oz dry a plant, since going to canna and top feeding I hit 3-4 a plant that with problems from the start so not to bad


You guys think these night NPK levels in my old feed are fine they dam high I'm lurning..

View attachment 939309View attachment 939310

Click to expand...

I would stick with the stuff from Canna. If it was me, I would not use those nutrients.

The reason you've been having so many headaches with coco is because you have to follow a very precise system. Canna stuff isn't cheap, but you get what you pay for. You just have to follow the system. Cannna has a very good feeding chart.. just use it at 1/2 to 3/4 strength

Get your ppm's figured out and keep the pH in the right zone and your problems should start to disappear.

02trueblue said:

okay okay first things first... the basics are very important to success in coco

You really need to PRECISELY measure your nutrients. I use a pipette until i figure out the exact measurement markers in my larger beakers. You should know exactly how much of each nutrient is going into each gallon/liter.

Always always always add your CalMag first, before you add A + B. Then add your additives
When mixing your nutrient solution, do it in this order. This is important stuff
1) Calmag
2) Canna A - this is your basic solution, it will raise your pH
3) Canna B - this is your acidic solution, it will lower your pH back down
4) Rhizotonic
5) Cannazym
6) set pH to 6.0
***after you add one type of nutrient wait at least a few minutes before adding the next one
** after setting the pH, wait at least 30 minutes before feeding the plant

^^doing this alone will cut out a lot of headaches for you, too

Concerning the Cannazym... it's not absolutely necessary in Veg, but it does make a difference. I like the added PK from it - Canna A + B could have better NPK ratios alone. You definitely want to add Cannazym in in flower.

Rhizotonic has to NPK value.. it's mostly just kelp. Some humics and thigns too. But it makes the plants WAY happier and greens them up nicely.

Click to expand...

I do keep track all written down , i m always mixing diffence size mixes some 10litre some 1litre mix for so not sure of it alp off tip of my head,

I use to add rhiztonic at beginning but makes my ph go to to much so asd that later on I also use it as oh up when needed, I do sometimes ass different root make that don't make my pH go up.
I think I'm adding 2ml a&b and 2.5 ml cannyzm a litre = 0.8e.c I think

I also do most you said above wait few mins for pH to adjust I mid my solution about with a jug between adding feed and pH so on


Iv also got 4 I flower 5th week in, being tip drip fed on rhizo drain to wqst system fed twice a day to run off no rhiztonic well not till last few days, and a water butt thats always filled with 40-50 litres if feed , its at 1.6 at moment , never given them calmag, just a&b & cannyzm at 2.5ml a litre , the cannyzm was only added at flowed, they where on pk off now.
These look nice and good they did look like my once I'm now having problems with, last few grows always look bad at start , iv teier all sorts top feed bottom feed feed flush high feed low feed different fed calmag no calmag, I was over watering , but got feeling that was from maybe lock out getting better. But always the starts its a fight, sometime they die,
Been hell lastvfew months lol, getting better can't quite pinpoint where in going wrong