KG1 said:

Bio grow is reasonably balanced will do all stages on its own, then the bloom a few mil here and there just sweetens the middle npk number.

Don't pH them you can't read organic pH because it hasn't broken down yet.

Water pH irrelevant it's alkalinity or ppms too low to change anything and why try and neutralise some calcium which will only add to the buffer.

Soil is well buffered it doesn't need any pH considerations really.

It's strange that people would say to pH anything with this stuff or such low water ppms.

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Gleneagle87 said:

Thanks KG1,
Starting to kind of understand the effects of everything and how things work, was really just following schedules without understanding (still long way to go) how everything relates n reacts.
Will recap those pens

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KG1 said:

It can take some time to understand, so many tell you differently too.

Theres no real schedule for feeds,these tables offer a one time weekly feed suggestion then expect you to work the rest out and read the plants.

Bio grow is complete and balanced, people did grows just on this to see if that would work and it did. Bloom on its own isn't good enough will short nitrogen which is important all the way through flower, you can cut it a little but too much you get n deficiency.

Weed growers make this confusing, these ferts and soils are used by veg and other growers and they simply pour and feed no pH no nothing and it works. Our frustration in growing has led to rabbit holes you want to avoid, the suggestion to pH water and soil and feeds is because one time a grower messed up and swore it was ph when it wasn't then endless others looked to solved problems and picked up that it could be pH. Pretty bad all round, why we have so many drying methods when you can just hang for two weeks and get perfect results.

When you start getting it right from seedlings stage with feeds and seeing how good they are you will be on the right track, at your point solving an issue isn't that easy but you should see good growth as increase ferts especially grow.

Takes time, a few runs but when you get this soil and fertiliser dialled in you be extremely happy.

Your experiencing deficiency, toxicity will see dark green shinny clawed and leaf tip burns for comparison.

Keep soil as simple as possible and listen to no one who tells you differently.

Also enjoy the learning process and keep it as simple as possible, you want complex go hydro with soil it's pour feed walk away till next watering.

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Gleneagle87 said:

Been in that rabbit hole for the last few days so appreciate the reassurance!
A lot of the stuff I read seems to be quite contradictory (on other threads) and dosnt make much sense. Also seems like a lot of the loudest seem to be rookie growers like myself.
As you said before I stated messing around everything was going incredible.
Had swapped for the fish mix instead of bio grow with the increased nitrogen but will go for grow as it seems a bit more adapted for this stage without the bloom for this feed.
Honestly thank you for that feel less worried about it all!

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KG1 said:

When I started I found an easier way was simply to look for a thread or grower that was going against the info. Say pH, everyone says to pH soil and water and feeds then if you look you find one grower doing none of that and getting top results. Tells you the real truth.

However this grow works out try and take what worked out of it for the next.

If I start in allmix and pot up I barely need to feed till flower. There's many ways a soil grower can make life even easier.

Don't be scared to feed at a good strength but be wary when you reach a point as you can still overdo them. More experience needed, keep soil as simple as you can, you end up growing soil more than plants in the end, it becomes like what does my soil want not what does my plant want.

Most of all enjoy it, good or bad any hobby takes time and frustration to get there

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Gleneagle87 said:

Hello,
Have seven autos (Fastbuds) at start of week 8 and it’s my first time using full biobizz line at 1/4 as advised by biobizz schedule in Lightmix soil. They are in 4x4 with Lumatek 300w pro at 75% at top of tent. Temp not over 24c but can go to 23.5c and rh is 65% after waterings but drops to 60% after a day.
Have had probably the best grow since starting (first organic) until I watered them with tap water only and since then no matter what I do the fan leaves keep dying to the point where one is bald and some are starting to have sugar leaves affected. Oh and Fimmed week 2/3 but no issues with it.
My tap water comes out between 7.6/8 and around 100ppm or on the 0.2 Ec side. I bottle the water and add Neutralize by ecothrive for the chlorine.
Now as there seems to be two opinions on whether or not to ph with biobizz I started off without and had great results until I added the water only in week 5. And I always wait for very light pots to water. A full feed mix at 1/4 dosage for all comes out at 6.8ph usually. (Pots where saturated with the biobizz propagation mix at 1/4 and only watered once or twice in weeks 2 and 3 then 1/4 dose of biobizz veg with fishmix instead of grow in week4) Hours after watering leaves went pale. Ppm and ec is unusable for organic I think but ph was between 6.8ph to 7.2ph so figured it was due to not phing and maybe a Calmag def. Tried dropping ph on for those needing feeding and phd (tried to bring to 6.8)and Calmag water for the ones needing water but nothing helped and they are still dying off. Thought my meters where off as a couple of the Bluelab pens I had are all over the place but thought I could rely on a Bluelab multimeter as it had newish one year old water probe but bought an apera20 and 60 just in case and they both put the ph at several points above the Bluelab and match each other so just more confusion there as they all calibrate fine and match relative solutions.
Sorry for the length just wanted to try and not miss anything.
Please Help and thank you for your time.
This feels like therapy

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AlanJohnson said:

Awe mate that's unlucky, I'm in the UK and where I'm located we get soft water at PH7, whenever I add my Canna Terra nutes it takes it to 6/6.5 every time, I still check but I use the PH5 to PH9 test strips as their more sensitive.

When I have added something that's knock the PH out of range I just use citric acid or Vit c to bring it down and bi carb of soda to base it up..............I'm sure there are people reading this that know why I have Citric, Vit C and Bi Carb on hand

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KG1 said:

Water systems here are great all round the country but we're not trying to produce a pure product just a safe one.

You'll notice harder water or more ppm where the catchment area for the rain is on soft rock that readily gives up minerals. Here where I am we get soft water because of all the hard rock which barely weathers over a million years, those on chalk landscapes almost always have harder water.

But this isn't hydro, the soil can hold elements even in different forms as it joins some, these can then later be accessed by the plant. It's all the chemistry which make pH irrelevant, your trying to defeat something composed of millions of ppm with a mere splash of citric acid isn't going to do anything. In fact many ph products aren't desirable for soil and their overuse could just break your buffers down too fast.

Water has a calcium buffer, that carbonate does fancy chemistry with acids. The guy above needs to pH his feed then come back in a day to witness the water buffer it back up.

We can defeat a water buffer easily by reaching the ionisation constant or point all carbonates are used by the acid. This point is about 4.3, slowly pH your water down to pH 4.3 and the second it drops fast past this you've used all your buffer up.

Contrary to belief good soil is in the same range as hydro 5.5-6.5 and rarely will the total volume be one set figure.

Soil tests show the power of the buffer and the amount left rather than give only a pH which can be largely meaningless without all the other info.

A million reasons to keep pH products away from anything soil related, soil manufacturers know exactly how to buffer soil.

If you want to get into the basics of pH and buffers start by reading up about 'strong and weak acids and alkalis' and 'alkalinity Vs pH' but do not pH soil or any soil products ever. Were more the type to shit in a shell, bury it in the garden for a year then dig it up and marvel at the amazing fertilizer we just created for free

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Gleneagle87 said:

Guess am not one of those people unless it flushes your system but thanks for the info! Not sure why the ppm here is low but ph seems relatively high. Haha you might be the only area Thames water actually treats properly or wherever you are.
Going to try without phing with the organic since it buffers. As I understand it (no pro as you can tell) the intake range for synth is higher than organic though or biobizz at least but my issue I think was focusing on the ph in and out rather than letting it buffer inside…

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KG1 said:

Water systems here are great all round the country but we're not trying to produce a pure product just a safe one.

You'll notice harder water or more ppm where the catchment area for the rain is on soft rock that readily gives up minerals. Here where I am we get soft water because of all the hard rock which barely weathers over a million years, those on chalk landscapes almost always have harder water.

But this isn't hydro, the soil can hold elements even in different forms as it joins some, these can then later be accessed by the plant. It's all the chemistry which make pH irrelevant, your trying to defeat something composed of millions of ppm with a mere splash of citric acid isn't going to do anything. In fact many ph products aren't desirable for soil and their overuse could just break your buffers down too fast.

Water has a calcium buffer, that carbonate does fancy chemistry with acids. The guy above needs to pH his feed then come back in a day to witness the water buffer it back up.

We can defeat a water buffer easily by reaching the ionisation constant or point all carbonates are used by the acid. This point is about 4.3, slowly pH your water down to pH 4.3 and the second it drops fast past this you've used all your buffer up.

Contrary to belief good soil is in the same range as hydro 5.5-6.5 and rarely will the total volume be one set figure.

Soil tests show the power of the buffer and the amount left rather than give only a pH which can be largely meaningless without all the other info.

A million reasons to keep pH products away from anything soil related, soil manufacturers know exactly how to buffer soil.

If you want to get into the basics of pH and buffers start by reading up about 'strong and weak acids and alkalis' and 'alkalinity Vs pH' but do not pH soil or any soil products ever. Were more the type to shit in a shell, bury it in the garden for a year then dig it up and marvel at the amazing fertilizer we just created for free

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Randyy said:

Howdy

I just read through the thread and I am wondering why you think 1/4 nutrient solution is the way to go? Also, are you not following the BioBizz nutrient schedule? I found it odd that it was suggested to you to only use Grow only or Bloom only, as that is not the recommendation from BioBizz?!

I usually start my feed at 50% nutrient strength and then increase it slowly, until I hit 100% around the beginning of flower. Works like a charm!

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AlanJohnson said:

I'm Manchester dude, this area dud to the peak District is known for it's good water, although I don't drink it as it has a bitter after taste on my tongue.

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Gleneagle87 said:

Your lucky then, lived here for 10years now have never risked drinking the tap water just from the amount of chlorines they put in. Some days you get a serious acrid chlorine smell just standing above the sink… think the Peak District is where the uk stores its nuclear waste might make them go the extra mile. Never had issues drinking tap water in the uk generally then again probably has the best infrastructure for it in the eu area just not great at cleaning waste then again none of them are.

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Randyy said:

Howdy

I just read through the thread and I am wondering why you think 1/4 nutrient solution is the way to go? Also, are you not following the BioBizz nutrient schedule? I found it odd that it was suggested to you to only use Grow only or Bloom only, as that is not the recommendation from BioBizz?!

I usually start my feed at 50% nutrient strength and then increase it slowly, until I hit 100% around the beginning of flower. Works like a charm!

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KG1 said:

If you mean me my advice was that grow on its own is complete and balanced enough for all stages without any other additions.

I'm not saying to do that but it helps others understand that we can flower pretty good on an even NPK but a quarter strength of the chart is really weak agreed.

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Greenadian said:

@Randyy this is what I found on a quick search at the time. Im am not super familiar with Biobizz but have been around the block a few times. Have learned this companies love to sell you a 10 product line up when really 1, 2 or 3 would be just fine!!
There would be no point to add the Bloom with little nitrogen to help boost nitrogen to green up his plants

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Gleneagle87 said:

The 1/4 dosage was just guess work really. When I started with AN nutes I was recommended to start on 1/8 dose for autoflowers due to what I understood was lower requirements from them and the high chance of burn when starting off. More recently had been starting at 1/6 and moving up but generally never went over 1/4 all grow and only had minor issues but never reached a good level of control. Thought I’d try organic this time so figured as it seemed less concentrated but still on autos that I’d try 1/4. Think the general advice for autoflowers is to quarter the dose of photos.
Won’t go into the recommendations too much as I don’t want to put words into anyone’s mouth and believe Greenadian has already answered but the idea was to sort out the deficiency first before returning to schedule so that they all start working together properly. Had used fix mix for veg for added nitrogen but not sure if it would work like grow for the entirety.
Take everything I say with a pinch of salt though as am not a very knowledgeable and may be wrong in my interpretations…

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