Alternatives to HPS that live up to their hype?

[Shamus]

no


lol


unless your talking bout plasma

 

[CheeseDawg91]

yeah so far plasma's are the alternative ive heard of doing real well in bloom but very expensive. Been advised by at least one person to veg with lec and then add a plasma or hps when it comes time to flower. Do u use plasma shamus? I dont think i have ever seens a grow under plasma yet on here or irl.
Ive pretty much decided not to bother trying anything besides hps for flower as the tech in led, lec, induction doesnt seem to live up to the potential or hype as of yet without supplemental lighting from hps. Would you recommend a specific plasma light comparable to 1000w hps?

 

[Dojoking]

yeah so far plasma's are the alternative ive heard of doing real well in bloom but very expensive. Been advised by at least one person to veg with lec and then add a plasma or hps when it comes time to flower. Do u use plasma shamus? I dont think i have ever seens a grow under plasma yet on here or irl.
Ive pretty much decided not to bother trying anything besides hps for flower as the tech in led, lec, induction doesnt seem to live up to the potential or hype as of yet without supplemental lighting from hps. Would you recommend a specific plasma light comparable to 1000w hps?

I have been reading quite a bit about plasma lighting lately and the only current plasma horticulture lamp I know of that might perform well during flowering is the Rocket Plasma or Alphalite ( www.rocketplasma.com www.Alphalite.com ) both of which are only 230 watts. The color temperature for the Rocket Plasma/Alphalite is suppose to be around 3000k ( http://www.rocketplasma.com/rocketspecs/ ) and the lowest color temperature Gavita has I believe is around 5600k for the 41.02 emitter ( ). I can't seem to find a color temp for the 41.01 emitter at the moment. All of the plasmas can be used through flower but. You will probably get better flowering results with the Rocket Plasma/Alphalite plasma lamps simply because of the lower color temperature bulbs. Even Gavita acknowledges that their plasmas are best used to supplement HPS or for vegetative stages.

"So in conclusion:
- We recommend the 01 version as most efficient to complement HPS light during the generative phase and suitable for short vegetative cycles
- The 02 version is also suitable for a combination with HPS, but has a better quality than the 01 for vegetative development, so it is best utilized in a pure vegetative environment or for sunlight simulations
- Use one Gavita Pro 300 LEP in combination with a maximum of 1200W HPS lighting for a better color spectrum which results in healthier plants, higher quality and a better yielding crop"
http://www.gavita-holland.com/helpdesk/download_attachment.php?kb_att=1

The Rocket Plasma bulb needs to be replaced after 4500-5000 hours but. That isn't because the bulb stops working. Its because the red spectrum dissipates after that time period. The bulb will still work. It just loses its ability to put out the mostly red spectrum it had from the start and it can be replaced with new one. If I end up getting one I just might use my old bulbs for the vegetative phase.

Topanga supplies Rocket Plasma/Alphalite - http://www.topangatech.com/

Luxim supplies Gavita and most of the other plasma grow lights - http://www.luxim.com/products/grow-lighting

If it were me making a choice right now I would probably choose the Rocket Plasma. Simply because the company is more active online and I have seen multiple instances with the Rocket Plasma in grower's hands. The Alphalite website is the only legitimate information I have seen on it . I will admit that I do like the Alphalite website more than the Rocket Plasma website though.

Not sure how thcfarmer.com feels about posting links to grow threads in other forums. So please edit this post mods if you don't approve.

"Rocket Plasma" grow thread -

Another "Rocket Plasma" grow thread -

 

[Dojoking]

Here is the Rocket Plasma spectrum which should be the same as the Alphalite spectrum. Also a link to rocket plasma photos tagged on instagram http://iconosquare.com/tag/rocketplasma

 

[CheeseDawg91]

dojoking thanks for the links and info on those lights. In your opinion is it worth 1000 dollars for a supplemental lighting/veg light? I have heard very good things about lec, plasma led, and induction for veg, but everyone says you need to add at least a 600w hps during flowering with any of those systems to get those good yields. Based on that it seems cost effective and plenty productive to use 1 600w mh for veg and 2 600 hps for flowering. . Possible a mh and hps as someone here mentioned would be interesting to try. An alternative i may try might be 1 230w lec for veg and then 1 230w lec to supp a 600w hps for flowering. I personally had good experiences with a 250w hydrofarm cfl and then 400w hps for flower, but double as good experience vegging with the 400w mh and flower with 400w hps in a small closet. Neither of those put off heat too bad, they were hot to touch but they didnt heatup the room to the point of being inhospitable. I usually didnt use any cooling besides keeping the room somewhere around 65-75 degrees with fans or ac during the worst points of summer in a basement. What would the benefits of supplementing an already energy hogging hid system? For the price I couldnt see it being that much better than just using more hid watts. It seems the mixing of light spectrum is the explanation but im wondering why that matters so much if people get good results with a normal veg or bloom colored hid. Like for instance someone uses a 1000w hps to flower in a certain area, what would the changes be when they add one of these supplemental lighting systems to the same area and same hps compared to either not adding any additional lighting or adding the same amount of watts in addition traditional lighting (hid, fluoro)? Has anyone seen a similar experiment type side by side grow where someone sees the yield and "quality" difference with this? If people are getting good yields, the texture they like, proper smell and taste and the maximum thc potential or at least close to it what would constitute an increase in quality with supplemental lighting? I could think maybe for some reason it could bring out more vibrant colors or something? Im interested in hearing thoughts on this and seeing the results people got with supplemental lights with their hid compared to just the new light or just a hid ect., basically all variables.

 

[irishboiii]

https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/hempy-led-grow-dp-power-plant.64214/page-17#post-1291793

Heres a link to my journal with Vipar B2X4 600w (360w actual draw) LED. Its my first grow and I just flipped to 12/12 today. They are 5 weeks old from seed and growth has been explosive as can be seen in the last few pics.

Looking forward to seeing the buds come!

 

[irishboiii]

The Vipar B2X4 is pretty cheap too compared to other LED's

 

[Dojoking]

dojoking thanks for the links and info on those lights. In your opinion is it worth 1000 dollars for a supplemental lighting/veg light? I have heard very good things about lec, plasma led, and induction for veg, but everyone says you need to add at least a 600w hps during flowering with any of those systems to get those good yields. Based on that it seems cost effective and plenty productive to use 1 600w mh for veg and 2 600 hps for flowering. . Possible a mh and hps as someone here mentioned would be interesting to try. An alternative i may try might be 1 230w lec for veg and then 1 230w lec to supp a 600w hps for flowering. I personally had good experiences with a 250w hydrofarm cfl and then 400w hps for flower, but double as good experience vegging with the 400w mh and flower with 400w hps in a small closet. Neither of those put off heat too bad, they were hot to touch but they didnt heatup the room to the point of being inhospitable. I usually didnt use any cooling besides keeping the room somewhere around 65-75 degrees with fans or ac during the worst points of summer in a basement. What would the benefits of supplementing an already energy hogging hid system? For the price I couldnt see it being that much better than just using more hid watts. It seems the mixing of light spectrum is the explanation but im wondering why that matters so much if people get good results with a normal veg or bloom colored hid. Like for instance someone uses a 1000w hps to flower in a certain area, what would the changes be when they add one of these supplemental lighting systems to the same area and same hps compared to either not adding any additional lighting or adding the same amount of watts in addition traditional lighting (hid, fluoro)? Has anyone seen a similar experiment type side by side grow where someone sees the yield and "quality" difference with this? If people are getting good yields, the texture they like, proper smell and taste and the maximum thc potential or at least close to it what would constitute an increase in quality with supplemental lighting? I could think maybe for some reason it could bring out more vibrant colors or something? Im interested in hearing thoughts on this and seeing the results people got with supplemental lights with their hid compared to just the new light or just a hid ect., basically all variables.

Personally, I have no interest or personal experience in using plasma for supplementing hps so I can't comment on whether it is worth it or not. I only grow for myself so I don't need a lot of wattage. If I decide to use plasma I would be using the Rocket Plasma/Alphalite by itself which are only 230-235 watts. The Gavita plasma lamps are the ones that are suggested for supplementing HPS and Gavita recommends that themselves. I have seen some grows documented in forums from when the Gavita plasma lights 1st came out and they were used to supplement HPS. Ahhh, I found it... Check it out - https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/gavita-pro-600-lep-300-plasma-test.41238/ The Gavita plasma bulbs last 30,000-50,000 hours depending on which emitter/spectrum you choose. So some of your money would be recouped in not buying bulbs compared to HID.

Also, you might want to check out this Gavita pdf that I mentioned in my 1st post if you haven't already.
"Plasma spectrum for use in combination with HPS lighting for the generative phase"

"Research indicates a requirement for 7% blue light spectrum as a good balance with the HPS light for quality plant development. The highest measurable increase in quality of added blue light was found within the 0-10% more blue light. Above that level blue light still increases the quality and yield of the crop, but it doesn’t increase as much as within the 0-10% range. Below that level plants can suffer from the imbalance in the spectrum, as in a deterioration of their photosynthetic system, more compact growth, vulnerability for disease and fungi and a less efficient morphogenesis."

http://www.gavita-holland.com/helpdesk/download_attachment.php?kb_att=1

In my opinion the Rocket Plasma/Alphalite are more for people growing small scale and personal use because of the low 230 watts and higher than HID price but. That could all change if they decide to start using Topanga's 470 watt emitters ( http://topangatech.com/products/ ) and the technology gets a little cheaper.

 

[Dojoking]

Also, I just posted this in another thread but. I think it is just as relevant here.

HPS lost the gram per watt battle in this LED vs HPS comparison.

 

[CheeseDawg91]

thanks again dojoking. The pdf i looked at seems very informative but its kind of mind boggling to me still what benefits someone gets by adding these lights to lights that are already sufficient for either veg or bloom. I have very little understanding of plant science and light spectrum besides the basic info for veg and flower: red (2700k?=late summer/fall/flower/bloom and the blue(5500k?)=spring/early summer/vegetative phase/photo period. Without understanding lighting specs better and some of the actual science and sensory mechanisms behind how the plant responds to different light I feel like its best to stick with mh and hps, theyre tried and true.
I also grow for only myself i just smoke kind of a fuck load (3.5-7g a day? dabs, hash, edibles ect.) Raw hemp king size cones with pack like 2 or more g each. I have been interested in trying some new lighting since realizing that my apartment is small and i usually dont use much electric and 1000w and fixings will draw at least 3 times the power im using monthly as of now. I was thinking with the supplemental lighting and a small hps I could make that a little less and the tradeoff would be 2 or 3 times the startup costs of a new hid light system. I wanna at least learn enough about some of them to choose one or to know enough to wait for the tech to develop more and prices to drop before trying them out. My main impression is that once someone gets into the plasma, led and other alternative lighting there is a lot of talk about spectrum and other lighting and electrical stuff that gets above my head and I dont think I have a basic enough understanding of to even talk about, only to take notes from people who do know something. I know i like hid and can currently yield approx .5g per watt of what I consider medical grade herb. A goal of mine is to get my room/tent dialed in and achieve closer to 1g per watt of still medical grade tasty herb.

 

[CheeseDawg91]

wow! see now that youtube video is exactly what is making me want to look into these lights. Almost everyone says to avoid them and I agree until I see a video like that which makes me want to try that exact light. I wonder how the quality compares between hps and led, in the video the difference looked minimal but the hps looked a bit nicer. Flavor, taste, and high are the big 3 imop and the only difference I noticed is a little bit of color variation. The guys mentions a more pungent smell from the darker led nugs. It would be cool if the same guy had a smoke test vid of the two.

 

[CheeseDawg91]

lol wait it seems that was yours? or a vid you found and posted? maybe you can do a smoke report if it was yours and you dont already have a smoke report already

 

[Dojoking]

wow! see now that youtube video is exactly what is making me want to look into these lights. Almost everyone says to avoid them and I agree until I see a video like that which makes me want to try that exact light. I wonder how the quality compares between hps and led, in the video the difference looked minimal but the hps looked a bit nicer. Flavor, taste, and high are the big 3 imop and the only difference I noticed is a little bit of color variation. The guys mentions a more pungent smell from the darker led nugs. It would be cool if the same guy had a smoke test vid of the two.

Nah, its not my video. Its a grower's from another forum but. He did just send the led nugs and hps nugs off to a lab to be tested so we should know the results soon.

 

[CheeseDawg91]

damn, regardless its exactly the type of video/info i was hoping for. Please update me if you see a video come up when those results come in?

 

[CheeseDawg91]

irish boii, nice grow man itll be cool to see how it turns out with that led. Ill stay tuned. Good luck!

 

[Dojoking]

damn, regardless its exactly the type of video/info i was hoping for. Please update me if you see a video come up when those results come in?

Do a google search with the terms "at600", "greengenes707", and "hps" in the search query and you will find the grow thread. I will post in here if I remember by the time the results come out.

 

[irishboiii]

irish boii, nice grow man itll be cool to see how it turns out with that led. Ill stay tuned. Good luck!

Thanks man, Im shooting for 180g which will be 0.5g per watt. Glad to have you on board.

 

[CheeseDawg91]

thanks dojoking, i will do that. irishboii that seems like a reasonable goal, i hope you achieve it

 

[Dojoking]

thanks dojoking, i will do that. irishboii that seems like a reasonable goal, i hope you achieve it

I was just talking about Rocket Plasma possibly using Topanga's 470 watt emitter in this thread yesterday and look what they announced today at the Maximum Yield Expo and on instagram. If you want a spectrum similar to what the combination of a gavita plasma and hps hid bulb will get you. Then this is what you need. Screw the hps all together in my opinion. One fixture assures that the spectrum is hitting all of your plants. Using two or three different fixtures to mix a spectrum is not an efficient method of getting the right spectrum imo. I will probably pick up one or two of these.

 

[Coir]

I have the original Rocket fixture and the plants do love the light it emits. The only problem I have faced with it is that it covers such a small area. Maybe the new fixture will solve that issue.