Are there any benefits to oversizing an LED grow light.

[Frankster]

The other thing I think about is customizing some versatility. I was thinking of making a few of these hanger type lights, that I could put maybe along the sides, (facing inwards) or hang them down into the canopy like hanging icicles to get at the undersides better and keep that larf in check, without having to do all the current 3 phases of defoliation I currently deploy.

Fuck, I would put grow lights on the floor if I though t it would help. (joking of course) Always trying to make more bud in a small footprint. But the how is the big million dollar question. Good airflow is also very key IMO. Multiple light sources spread out have huge potential for increasing overall yield, and productivity.

I would much rather keep as all my foliage as I possibly can, if I can deliver light to the leaves somehow, and keep things swelling. In this particular instance, I just glued heatsinks onto the back of a strip, then plugged in the wires. I get about 33w of output from each of these. Or 1.375 amp@24v Say easily 6-8 of them can be driven from any one lab grade power supply. I think I have a box containing 20 or so enough to do both tents, if I work up the ambition for this experiment.

 

[Frankster]

Buy big and turn it down.

Agreed, I really think that's the most simple and reasonable way to approach this.

Then if you got anything left, do something like this; and compliment your efficient LED with targeted range of UV A+B For increased resin production.

It's not just efficient light, or more light, but having the correct ratio's of light, and how they are able to signal different grow conditions to the plant. I see huge inter noding differences, and bud density between various spectrums, and overall quality growing the same exact plants. It's all over the map. If you got lots of space, then it's of minimum concern, but if you've got small enclosed spaces, and your wanting to maximize yields, there's methods of making gains.

Amazon.com

 

[Pushrod Monkey]

Agreed, I really think that's the most simple and reasonable way to approach this.

It’s like horsepower. Far easier to ease up on the pedal when unneeded but there when you need it. I’ve never seen a post bemoaning buying a light too powerful. We’ve all seen the opposite.

 

[Ponky]

The other thing I think about is customizing some versatility. I was thinking of making a few of these hanger type lights, that I could put maybe along the sides, (facing inwards) or hang them down into the canopy like hanging icicles to get at the undersides better and keep that larf in check, without having to do all the current 3 phases of defoliation I currently deploy.

Fuck, I would put grow lights on the floor if I though t it would help. (joking of course) Always trying to make more bud in a small footprint. But the how is the big million dollar question. Good airflow is also very key IMO. Multiple light sources spread out have huge potential for increasing overall yield, and productivity.

I would much rather keep as all my foliage as I possibly can, if I can deliver light to the leaves somehow, and keep things swelling. In this particular instance, I just glued heatsinks onto the back of a strip, then plugged in the wires. I get about 33w of output from each of these. Or 1.375 amp@24v Say easily 6-8 of them can be driven from any one lab grade power supply. I think I have a box containing 20 or so enough to do both tents, if I work up the ambition for this experiment.

View attachment 1183994View attachment 1183995

You should use a thermal paste and fasteners rather than an adhesive. In case the heat melts it. Your lights would work. You could use drivers. And some cheap flet aluminum stock to make a custom array. Those are decent LEDs. I'm guessing each strip could be run with a 7 dollar meanwell drivers or paralleled and driven with fewer but larger drivers.

 

[MIGrampaUSA]

The best benefit I can think of is more uniform light distribution. The higher the light the better the distribution. That only works if you have a very powerfull light and enough vertical space.

This is the best answer I've read so far in favor of over-lighting your grow space. There are a lot of good reasons to consider over-lighting but this is the one that isn't mentioned much.

The higher you hang the light also means the less you bang your head. Don't laugh (lol), I'm sure I'm not the only one who has had that problem.

 

[Dub_City405]

I have always liked quality Electronics. So I agree with you. But I've also probably wasted alot of money buying things that I don't fully use LOL. So I thought I would get some opinions on this one.

I'm not sure about you and the rest of these folks here but.. what I am into is growing and creating beautiful buds. So I provide the best to the plants.

 

[Spock]

Under driven loses efficiency.

Yes this is true. But how much I wonder.

 

[Spock]

Buy big and turn it down.

Thanks for your input! I'm leaning towards that idea.

 

[Spock]

It’s like horsepower. Far easier to ease up on the pedal when unneeded but there when you need it. I’ve never seen a post bemoaning buying a light too powerful. We’ve all seen the opposite.

Lol you got that right!

 

[Spock]

Agreed, I really think that's the most simple and reasonable way to approach this.

Then if you got anything left, do something like this; and compliment your efficient LED with targeted range of UV A+B For increased resin production.

It's not just efficient light, or more light, but having the correct ratio's of light, and how they are able to signal different grow conditions to the plant. I see huge inter noding differences, and bud density between various spectrums, and overall quality growing the same exact plants. It's all over the map. If you got lots of space, then it's of minimum concern, but if you've got small enclosed spaces, and your wanting to maximize yields, there's methods of making gains.

Amazon.com

Are UV lights dangerous to people? I thought I had read somewhere or maybe it's just some UV lights. Do you have to take any precautions?

 

[Spock]

Yea, the cheap way to go about it would be to buy something like one of the SF units that have dials in them. (all but the sf1000 has them) or something equivalent. There's certainly a lot of decent quality equipment to be had on the market, no doubt.

But yes, if your like me, and you enjoy fooling around with the stuff, custom making what you want, or need. Building is the way to go. But it's going to be more expensive, no doubt. Either find the components that you need, or a lab grade unit. Just make sure your voltage inputs for your light, and the power source line up. If your not using a lab unit, you want to have the correct drivers onboard, measured in mA output.

Something like this is sufficient: I've got (2) 10 amp units similar to this; Which runs about $70 a pop on ebay. I keep the extra for backup or a second project. Some of the units have a macro and mico dials (see my unit above) which make it easier to precisely make micro adjustments.

That looks like it would be interesting and fun to learn and tinker with. I've always liked electronics of all sorts, but darn unfortunately I work too many hours and don't have a lot of spare time. It seems like all of my hobbies have been put on the back burner in the last few years.

 

[MIGrampaUSA]

Are UV lights dangerous to people? I thought I had read somewhere or maybe it's just some UV lights. Do you have to take any precautions?

UVB gets into areas that can harm your skin. UVC is where it gets really dangerous to both human flesh and plant flesh. UVA is harmless ... and is what you find on many 660nm + UV + IR setups. If you're looking to bring out terps, look for lighting that has around 310nm wavelength.

 

[Spock]

If the power supply is outside the growing area it is cooler and better for the diodes it’s all about efficien

Agreed, I really think that's the most simple and reasonable way to approach this.

Then if you got anything left, do something like this; and compliment your efficient LED with targeted range of UV A+B For increased resin production.

It's not just efficient light, or more light, but having the correct ratio's of light, and how they are able to signal different grow conditions to the plant. I see huge inter noding differences, and bud density between various spectrums, and overall quality growing the same exact plants. It's all over the map. If you got lots of space, then it's of minimum concern, but if you've got small enclosed spaces, and your wanting to maximize yields, there's methods of making gains.

Amazon.com

How many of those agroMax lights would you use in a 5x7 space? Do you think they help that much? I'm always looking for improvement and that looks interesting.

 

[Frankster]

You should use a thermal paste and fasteners rather than an adhesive. In case the heat melts it. Your lights would work. You could use drivers. And some cheap flet aluminum stock to make a custom array. Those are decent LEDs. I'm guessing each strip could be run with a 7 dollar meanwell drivers or paralleled and driven with fewer but larger drivers.

Yea, the thermal paste actually sets like an adhesive, I've had not problems with the heatsink paste I'm using. I've got aluminum angle, and I've also got some heat sinks, and aluminum cookie sheets, so there's certainly many ways to approach it. When I put them on the pans, I was going to fasten them with self taping screws, but I went with a little superglue instead, just around the edges, to ensure the heatsink paste keeps it's hold..

I did a messy job, but it works fine.

.

.

 

[Frankster]

This is the best answer I've read so far in favor of over-lighting your grow space. There are a lot of good reasons to consider over-lighting but this is the one that isn't mentioned much.

The higher you hang the light also means the less you bang your head. Don't laugh (lol), I'm sure I'm not the only one who has had that problem.

I respectfully disagree. In fact, I couldn't disagree more. Farther might be better when you've got a sun, but with efficiency, closer is better. Do the math.


The most efficient lights, require many low powered light sources (spread out across the target area) but close up, with some overlap. The major efficiency drop in lighting is always, always, the distance involved.

When you take that same high power energy source, divide it up, then spread it out over an area, and move it up close, your efficiency is exponentially more efficient. It's just a matter of how far this process can be taken, and the specifics needs of the application.

Something like the SF7000 moved up close on the canopy, are simply among the most efficient light configurations available today. Hands down. Sure, we could split hairs, and talk about different manufactures, but this config below is cutting edge technology. It's engineered amazingly well.

 

[MIGrampaUSA]

I respectfully disagree. In fact, I couldn't disagree more. Farther might be better when you've got a sun, but with efficiency, closer is better. Do the math.


The most efficient lights, require many low powered light sources (spread out across the target area) but close up, with some overlap. The major efficiency drop in lighting is always, always, the distance involved.

When you take that same high power energy source, divide it up, then spread it out over an area, and move it up close, your efficiency is exponentially more efficient. It's just a matter of how far this process can be taken, and the specifics needs of the application.
View attachment 1184370View attachment 1184371


Something like the SF7000 moved up close on the canopy, are simply among the most efficient light configurations available today. Hands down. Sure, we could split hairs, and talk about different manufactures, but this config below is cutting edge technology. It's engineered amazingly well.
View attachment 1184373

I'm not sure you saw all the posts. We're starting with an over-powered light. If you're doing that, you absolutely need to give more space. Otherwise, the intensity would burn your plants.

 

[Frankster]

The problem with figuring out the math's

I'm not sure you saw all the posts. We're starting with an over-powered light. If you're doing that, you absolutely need to give more space. Otherwise, the intensity would burn your plants.

Yea, certainly with overpowered light, your correct. But my point being, a single source of light, vs an array of lights; and array is always going to beat a single light source, cause you can move it up, and your getting overshadows from multiple different angles, and overlap, this creates far superior penetration of the canopy.

Resulting in overall thicker buds, and lower stuff that's not larf filled, creating more uniformity downwards.

 

[Frankster]

Like say, if your got 100 samsung 301H and your running them full power, you can get perhaps 16-18 inches to the tops, but if you add 50 diodes, and power them down, spread that light out further, you can take the same power, with 150 diodes, and move it up to say 9-12 inches, in a overall bigger footprint, and plus, your going to have higher efficiency.

Plus, the photons lost during those 4 inches (which is substantial)

 

[MIGrampaUSA]

The problem with figuring out the math's

Yea, certainly with overpowered light, your correct. But my point being, a single source of light, vs an array of lights; and array is always going to beat a single light source, cause you can move it up, and your getting overshadows from multiple different angles, and overlap, this creates far superior penetration of the canopy.

Resulting in overall thicker buds, and lower stuff that's not larf filled, creating more uniformity downwards.

Yep, that is why one would use this approach. Depending on which tent I'm using, I have one over-lit with quantum boards and the other using bar lights. I prefer the bar light if you're using the whole space. I prefer the quantum boards if I want more focused lighting and I'm not concerned about lighting the whole tent.

Like say, if your got 100 samsung 301H and your running them full power, you can get perhaps 16-18 inches to the tops, but if you add 50 diodes, and power them down, spread that light out further, you can take the same power, with 150 diodes, and move it up to say 9-12 inches, in a overall bigger footprint, and plus, your going to have higher efficiency.

Plus, the photons lost during those 4 inches (which is substantial)

But this one works equally as well.

I prefer higher intensity with greater distance from the plant, allowing the plant to grow into the light.

 

[Frankster]

That's the same principles behind why (5) 400w HPS will outperform (2) 1000w HPS. You can move the lights up closer (lower intensity) and you can spread them out farther, plus your receiving more overlap and better overall penetration, from the added light angles.

Lights can be raised as the plants are growing, and once the stretch occurs, your not going to see much "growing into the light". That happens for 2 weeks after flip, then the plants are pretty much fixed. Moving a light is no problem for me, if I'm getting a benefit.