Ballin' On a Budget- THE RECIPE

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BillFarthing

BillFarthing

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@BillFarthing how do you feel about adding kelp?

Is PowerSi really that much better than even the silica powder that kelp4less sells?

Thoughts?

Cytokinin-dominant kelp (ascophylum nodosum) is only added at transition (flip). This will help plant structure and stacking. Other than that, it isn't really beneficial or cost effective.

Any soluble silica is going to be beneficial versus potassium silicate. Potassium silicate can affect calcium content and makes the pH drift up quickly.
 
mikeross

mikeross

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I'm running Jacks with 0.5g MKP @ week 2.5, Power Si and drip clean... that's it with great results.

I want to give the Mr.Fulvic a shot. Does this product work well in a irrigation system with .5gph emitters. My rez and lines stay very clean with my current schedule and I go a week between res changes. Can Mr.Fulvic stay stable in a res for a week and won't gum up my emitters?
 
BillFarthing

BillFarthing

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I'm running Jacks with 0.5g MKP @ week 2.5, Power Si and drip clean... that's it with great results.

I want to give the Mr.Fulvic a shot. Does this product work well in a irrigation system with .5gph emitters. My rez and lines stay very clean with my current schedule and I go a week between res changes. Can Mr.Fulvic stay stable in a res for a week and won't gum up my emitters?
Jack's has a healthy amount of Phosphorus start to finish. I'm not a fan of high P as excess needs to be simply washed out or it can make flowers burn black. Based on tissue samples, try it just in week 6 of flower with an 8-9 week cycle. The timing on the K bump works as well. Let me know how it affects your yield and flower quality. 😘

Mr. Fulvic is totally soluble with drip emitters. Just make sure your pH stays at 5.5 and doesn't drift up.
 
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pdasterly

pdasterly

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Jack's has a healthy amount of Phosphorus start to finish. I'm not a fan of high P as excess needs to be simply washed out or it can make flowers burn black. Based on tissue samples, try it just in week 6 of flower with an 8-9 week cycle. The timing on the K bump works as well. Let me know how it affects your yield and flower quality. 😘

Mr. Fulvic is totally soluble with drip emitters. Just make sure your pH stays at 5.5 and doesn't drift up.
just a quick look on amazon, mr fulvic is same as mr humic.
A friend who works in a commercial grow uses root hume from simple grow solutions, any thoughts on this?
https://www.amazon.com/Conditioner-.../dp/B01N198NMI/ref=psdc_3752891_t2_B07KGHNHH7
 
mikeross

mikeross

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Jack's has a healthy amount of Phosphorus start to finish. I'm not a fan of high P as excess needs to be simply washed out or it can make flowers burn black. Based on tissue samples, try it just in week 6 of flower with an 8-9 week cycle. The timing on the K bump works as well. Let me know how it affects your yield and flower quality. 😘

Mr. Fulvic is totally soluble with drip emitters. Just make sure your pH stays at 5.5 and doesn't drift up.

Should have been more clear... I'm actually running Jack's Hydro at 3.0g jacks, 2.5g calnit and no magnesium.

5.5ph... thats on the low side but still within range. Is there any particular reason why you like to set it that low? Thanks!
 
BillFarthing

BillFarthing

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just a quick look on amazon, mr fulvic is same as mr humic.
A friend who works in a commercial grow uses root hume from simple grow solutions, any thoughts on this?
Mr. Humic is the same liquid as Mr. Fulvic, just for sale in California and Oregon. From what I understand, CA and OR use outdated testing for use on their label and it only measures humic, not fulvic content.

Root Hume is a cheap Leonardite product. There is some humic in it (very little fulvic), and it is chemically hydroxide extracted and raises the K content. Also, they may have questionable heavy metals in it. I haven't seen a ## element scan for that product. Taking care of your lawn is not taking care of your cannabis.
https://www.amazon.com/Conditioner-.../dp/B01N198NMI/ref=psdc_3752891_t2_B07KGHNHH7
 
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BillFarthing

BillFarthing

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Should have been more clear... I'm actually running Jack's Hydro at 3.0g jacks, 2.5g calnit and no magnesium.

5.5ph... thats on the low side but still within range. Is there any particular reason why you like to set it that low? Thanks!
You know the pH is going to drift up unless you are irrigating more than once a day with soilless. It allows the nutrient solution to hit all the nutrient availabilities on the way up. There is some leeway with growing medium buffered with lime/gypsum.
 
mikeross

mikeross

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You know the pH is going to drift up unless you are irrigating more than once a day with soilless. It allows the nutrient solution to hit all the nutrient availabilities on the way up. There is some leeway with growing medium buffered with lime/gypsum.
Ah ok gotcha... I'm irrigating 6-8 times per day to trigger vegetative ques and 4 times a day for generative ques. Jacks is very stable in my res, over the course of a week there is very little drift in my reservoirs. I get what your saying though, in the medium, without resetting with multi irrigations daily the PH will shift.

I emailed Mr.Fulvic regarding shipping to Canada. Hopefully they are willing or I've got to wait for the borders to open up and pick it up stateside. I've got 2 rooms, so will do a side by side to see the difference.
 
BillFarthing

BillFarthing

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Ah ok gotcha... I'm irrigating 6-8 times per day to trigger vegetative ques and 4 times a day for generative ques. Jacks is very stable in my res, over the course of a week there is very little drift in my reservoirs. I get what your saying though, in the medium, without resetting with multi irrigations daily the PH will shift.

I emailed Mr.Fulvic regarding shipping to Canada. Hopefully they are willing or I've got to wait for the borders to open up and pick it up stateside. I've got 2 rooms, so will do a side by side to see the difference.
If you order through their website, I think they have a referral promo code for a discount. (Not available on Amazon?) When you contact them, be sure to ask.
 
Thegreywizard

Thegreywizard

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Cytokinin-dominant kelp (ascophylum nodosum) is only added at transition (flip). This will help plant structure and stacking. Other than that, it isn't really beneficial or cost effective.

Any soluble silica is going to be beneficial versus potassium silicate. Potassium silicate can affect calcium content and makes the pH drift up quickly.
I assume most/every kelp sold in the nutrient industry is a cytokinin-dominant kelp?

So there isn't a different kind of kelp that can be use in veg?

I bought 2 pounds of kelp from kelp4less for $30 when it was on sale last week... to me the cost is minimal for this product.

It wouldn't be beneficial at all to run in veg?

Kelp4less says this about their kelp:

"Contains naturally occurring plant hormones and provides a balance of major and minor nutrients, enzymes, amino acids, humic acids and other organic substances. Over 80 identified elements in all."

They go on to suggest it for veg and flower but then also state this:

All stages of plant development. Use Kelp powder to improve specific growth states. For example, to promote buds, apply kelp when plants are beginning to bud.

So that statement seems to favor using during flip.

But couldn't I just run kelp all the way from cloner, veg & to flower?

To me the cost is negligible if there's any added benefit during clone or vegging.
 
Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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I assume most/every kelp sold in the nutrient industry is a cytokinin-dominant kelp?

So there isn't a different kind of kelp that can be use in veg?

I bought 2 pounds of kelp from kelp4less for $30 when it was on sale last week... to me the cost is minimal for this product.

It wouldn't be beneficial at all to run in veg?

Kelp4less says this about their kelp:

"Contains naturally occurring plant hormones and provides a balance of major and minor nutrients, enzymes, amino acids, humic acids and other organic substances. Over 80 identified elements in all."

They go on to suggest it for veg and flower but then also state this:

All stages of plant development. Use Kelp powder to improve specific growth states. For example, to promote buds, apply kelp when plants are beginning to bud.

So that statement seems to favor using during flip.

But couldn't I just run kelp all the way from cloner, veg & to flower?

To me the cost is negligible if there's any added benefit during clone or vegging.
Assuming the nutrient industry is honest and not just slapping the name kelp on to make a buck.... id say nope I wouldn't assume every nutrient/kelp used is at all cytokinin dominant from an industry that's disgustingly ripping off growers in almost every area they can come up with.
 
Thegreywizard

Thegreywizard

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lol! Yes I was going to kind of add that to a post that all nutrient companies just want to sell you more more more!

But kelp4less seems to at least be a lot more honeset with their products and the prices are EXTREMELY cheap compared to everything else out there.

So does anyone know what other dried kelp options are out there that aren't cytokinin dominant?
 
BillFarthing

BillFarthing

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But kelp4less seems to at least be a lot more honeset with their products and the prices are EXTREMELY cheap compared to everything else out there.

So does anyone know what other dried kelp options are out there that aren't cytokinin dominant?
There's a reason kelp4less is less expensive- their products are cheap quality. Just watch out for sodium stress with bargain kelp products.

Ecklonia Maxima (Kelpak) from Africa is auxin dominant kelp for rooting and veg. My roots don't have any problem growing well with fulvic acid as a biostimulant. There is also some overlap on micronutrients with fulvic. FWIW.
 
Thegreywizard

Thegreywizard

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There's a reason kelp4less is less expensive- their products are cheap quality. Just watch out for sodium stress with bargain kelp products.

Ecklonia Maxima (Kelpak) from Africa is auxin dominant kelp for rooting and veg. My roots don't have any problem growing well with fulvic acid as a biostimulant. There is also some overlap on micronutrients with fulvic. FWIW.
Ok great info!

I can't seem to find kelpak for sale anywhere, even though they have a website:


I found a sales email and phone number I'll reach out to tomorrow.

But do you know where it can be bought online?

Is it expensive?

Would it be too much to run Kelpak and fulvic powder together in DWC?

I'll save the kelp4less dry kelp for when I flip to flower as you suggest.
 
BillFarthing

BillFarthing

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I found a sales email and phone number I'll reach out to tomorrow.

But do you know where it can be bought online?

Is it expensive?

They are probably B2B wholesale. I would ask for their retailer product websites. It's probably not available directly online.

It is most likely a bit more expensive than ascophylum nodosum, as it isn't as ubiquitous. I only use cytokinin dominant kelp at transition, but it is the best choice if you feel you must use kelp for rooting/in veg.
 
radmobile

radmobile

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Should have been more clear... I'm actually running Jack's Hydro at 3.0g jacks, 2.5g calnit and no magnesium.

5.5ph... thats on the low side but still within range. Is there any particular reason why you like to set it that low? Thanks!
How am I looking???
71CA7E29 EC43 4C1C B283 9D78903C66C5
 

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