Blaze's 2013 Endeavor

[Blaze]

First off thanks to caregiverken and roryfree2grow for giving me a little prod to get a thread going again this season. Ironically I got started earlier than ever before this season, but didn't take any pictures until today. Oh and to answer your previous question ken, yes, there will be light dep this year. A bigger and better light dep too, if all goes as planned. Won't get to that tonight though!

One of the main improvements over last year was that I built a dedicated 18' x 12' temporary greenhouse for clones this year to get them off to an earlier start and have larger, more established plants come late May. It has been very helpful having more space - last year everything was vegged in a 10 x 12 indoor space which was too limiting. Now we can use that space just for rooting clones and maintaining mother plants. Most of the cuts were taken early to mid March, and were all rooted by mid-late March. After that they were moved up to 4" pots filled with soil and vegged under t5's until mid April. At that point all the clones for the full term season were transplanted to 5 gallon smart pots, and all the plants for the light dep were transplanted into 1 gallon pots. In retrospect the light dep plants should have gone into 2 gallons, and given more space they are starting to get too crowded and lanky. It has been crazy hot here, like summer, which the plants love, but they are vegging faster than planned, so it is sort of good, but also sort of bad because I only have so much space.

We've been scrambling to get the light dep greenhouse totally finished and all our pots filled with soil. Finished the soil today, and the greenhouse frame is finished, but I still have to set up the fans and lights and put on the plastic. Never have I seen this type of weather this early in the year. I'll post pics once the dep greenhouse is finished which should be a day or so. I will be doing 28 thirty gallon pots in a 12' x 40' space this year. Shooting to at least double what I did last year with the light dep. An achievable goal I think, but I will not be harvesting as early as last year as the plants still need more veg time. In the future I think I need to start my dep plants 3-4 weeks ahead of my full term plants.

Ok, so pictures are mostly of the veg house. First two shots are looking in from the door, most of the full term plants are on the left, most of the dep plants are on the right. You can see in the following two pics how crowded the 1 gallon plants are getting. They have literally tripled in size in the last two weeks. Fifth shot is an exterior view of the veg house. It's built mostly with 1 1/4 inch PVC and fir 2"x6"s. Sixth shot is looking from the back of the greenhouse towards the door so you can see some of the lights and the electrical set up. I am still running 1 hour of interrupted light in the middle of the light to prevent flowering. Seventh shot is of a bunch of Guava Kushes, 8th shot is of a bunch of Mendo Pineapples, two of my favorites.

The last show shots are of food because, well, why not? Plus if you love smoking bud you probably love food too, they go hand in hand. First food pics is of Mahogany Roasted Chicken, Jarlsberg Potatoes, and sauteed kale with red onion. Second one is of Mendocino Mustard crusted rack of lamb with sauteed broccoli and bacon, and rice with cured Meyer lemon, cardamon, and ginger. I can post recipes and/or info on the dishes in the second picture (first plate is all proprietary recipes, sorry!) if anyone is interested.

 

[Mogrow]

looking good Blaze. So you vegged the clones under 18/6? and now the 1 hour light in the night keeps them from flower? Man they look good and big too.
So you're running some Mendo Pineapples, sounds yummie. My Mendo Mango is looking kick ass, may be the best looking strain i've got going for outdoors, it really held up in super adverse conditions last year.
Can't i just come over for lunch sometime, i'd fuck the receipe up////
glad the boys talked you into another thread.
peace mogrow

 

[Blaze]

looking good Blaze. So you vegged the clones under 18/6? and now the 1 hour light in the night keeps them from flower? Man they look good and big too.
So you're running some Mendo Pineapples, sounds yummie. My Mendo Mango is looking kick ass, may be the best looking strain i've got going for outdoors, it really held up in super adverse conditions last year.
Can't i just come over for lunch sometime, i'd fuck the receipe up////
glad the boys talked you into another thread.
peace mogrow

Hey Mo thanks for stopping by. I'll be happy to cook ya lunch sometime. Though you might be surprised how easy it is to make good food. A wise chef once told me the secret to cooking the most incredible tasting food is find the best ingredients you can, do as little to them as possible so their flavors shine. Some of the best food I have ever eaten or cooked was easy and simple, it's all about the technique and the quality. The only secret ingredient to good food (and good bud!) is a little love.

So to answer your light cycle question, the moms for the clones were vegged under 18/6 through fall and winter. Once I went to start clones I switched them over to an interrupted 14.5/4/1.5/4 cycle. On at 6:00 AM, off at 8:30 PM, on at 12:30 AM, off at 2:00 AM. The formula I use is I set the main light cycle for the length of daylight on my planting date (May 21), and the interrupted period is the difference between the length of light on the planting date and the length of light on the longest day of the year (June 21 16 hours - May 21, 14.5 hours = 1.5 hours difference). So where I am at I get 14.5 hours of light on May 21, and about 15.5-16 hours of light on June 21, depending on the location and orientation of the garden. The total amount of light in the cycle is never more than the total amount of light on June 21 (14.5 + 1.5 = 16 hours). Makes sense? This way, when the plant goes outside, the light cycle always increases, and the plant never gets more total light than on the longest day. Depending on where your garden is on planet Earth the light cycle you would want to use to emulate this will be different, it's not a one size fits all kind of thing, use the formual and the principal don't just blindly use the info. The interrupted cycle also makes the plants less hormonally inclined to flower, which is what happens when you go from an 18/6 light cycle to outside, or use a decreasing light cycle to adjust them before going outside. This is why I think I have had better luck with this type of light cycle than others, didn't have a single clone pre-flower last year, even with a bunch of different strains, so I hope I pull that off again this year.

Mendo Mango sounds interesting. I have seen some incredible Mango's out there before and sadly the cut was lost and all other Mangoes I've seen since then just pale in comparison. Do you know the source of the cut? Also does it smell and taste like Mango?

 

[Seamaiden]

SubSCRIBED! Yee haw!

 

[Blaze]

Oh, and Mo I forgot to mention that the light cycle was the same in the greenhouse as it was in the indoor room. I was running the lights from 6:00-6:30 AM and 8:00-8:30 PM in the greenhouse for the first few weeks in addition to the interrupted period. The days are long enough now though that I dropped the morning and evening light as we are getting enough light from 6:00 AM to 8:30 PM now. I realized my dep house gets less light than my main garden so I dropped the interrupted period down to 1 hour instead of 1.5 hours last week for a total of 15.5 hours of light. Also I had a shade cloth cover on the inside of the greenhouse for the first week, to ease them into the new environment. Going right from T5's to a greenhouse can sometimes cause burn.

I don't think I will be keeping my mom's under 18/6 this year, I will be doing 16/8 instead so their light cycle is messed with even less when it is time to adjust it. Plus it should cut our power bill a little bit, I don't like running more lights than I have too, they make us pay through the nose for power where I am at.

 

[NaturalTherapy]

Always inspiring!

 

[caregiverken]

Huge Like! Blaze!

I do the 16/8 inside too.:)
Now, everything is out in the GH with a one hour interruption. (its working):D

Are you having many pests outside? I have leaf hoppers and mites...But i think i have them under control with neem for now.
I am seeing lots of Ladybug larvae though...so I don't wanna hurt them!o_O

 

[soserthc1]

Best of luck with the outdoor season blaze..... i'll be checking out ...awesome start u got going ........ peace SoSer

 

[midwestdensies]

Fuck ya! Good luck with the season this year. Great insight on your dep schedule.

 

[Mogrow]

Hey Mo thanks for stopping by. I'll be happy to cook ya lunch sometime. Though you might be surprised how easy it is to make good food. A wise chef once told me the secret to cooking the most incredible tasting food is find the best ingredients you can, do as little to them as possible so their flavors shine. Some of the best food I have ever eaten or cooked was easy and simple, it's all about the technique and the quality. The only secret ingredient to good food (and good bud!) is a little love.

So to answer your light cycle question, the moms for the clones were vegged under 18/6 through fall and winter. Once I went to start clones I switched them over to an interrupted 14.5/4/1.5/4 cycle. On at 6:00 AM, off at 8:30 PM, on at 12:30 AM, off at 2:00 AM. The formula I use is I set the main light cycle for the length of daylight on my planting date (May 21), and the interrupted period is the difference between the length of light on the planting date and the length of light on the longest day of the year (June 21 16 hours - May 21, 14.5 hours = 1.5 hours difference). So where I am at I get 14.5 hours of light on May 21, and about 15.5-16 hours of light on June 21, depending on the location and orientation of the garden. The total amount of light in the cycle is never more than the total amount of light on June 21 (14.5 + 1.5 = 16 hours). Makes sense? This way, when the plant goes outside, the light cycle always increases, and the plant never gets more total light than on the longest day. Depending on where your garden is on planet Earth the light cycle you would want to use to emulate this will be different, it's not a one size fits all kind of thing, use the formual and the principal don't just blindly use the info. The interrupted cycle also makes the plants less hormonally inclined to flower, which is what happens when you go from an 18/6 light cycle to outside, or use a decreasing light cycle to adjust them before going outside. This is why I think I have had better luck with this type of light cycle than others, didn't have a single clone pre-flower last year, even with a bunch of different strains, so I hope I pull that off again this year.

Mendo Mango sounds interesting. I have seen some incredible Mango's out there before and sadly the cut was lost and all other Mangoes I've seen since then just pale in comparison. Do you know the source of the cut? Also does it smell and taste like Mango?

Blaze/// thanks for explaining how to take your clones outside, last year mine revegged and just wasn't the same, kinda lost their momentum, and then they lost their lives due to the water hole drying up.
the mango is from soma, its called somango. now the medo part is a cut only strain according to the grower i got them from. he's a central cali dude. can't remember the taste, just that they lived through a horrible drought and heat wave and looked good, kinda small but the buds were nice. here's a pic.

 

[Blaze]

Are you having many pests outside? I have leaf hoppers and mites...But i think i have them under control with neem for now.
I am seeing lots of Ladybug larvae though...so I don't wanna hurt them!o_O

So far I have had no major pest issues. There is no such thing as a pest-free year though so I am always on the look-out. I did have some mites and powdery mildew show up inside my veg room after bringing in some clones from Humboldt but they were dealt with swiftly and have not shown up again (yet!). I will be spraying next week as a preventative measure to make sure though, especially since a broad mite infestation seems to be sweeping the area. Though I employ almost entirely organic measures for my grow, I will use chemical pesticides in my room and early in the year to ensure I start out with pest-free plants. Once they are out in the garden I switch over to organic pest control measures for the rest of the season. I have found it to be far more effective to eliminate mites and mildew early on with a few applications of pesticides rather than fight a losing battle all season.

Like I said I am all about the organics but sometimes IMO they can do more harm than good in the long run if not used correctly. For example a basic principal of integrated pest management (IPM) to to switch up your pest control methods regularly and use as little as possible. If you are constantly spraying neem oil, for example, all season long to fight off a mite infestation, all you end up doing is breeding neem resistant mites. It is absolutely critical that you use a 'different mode of action' to kill your pests and not use the same products over and over again. It is better in the long run to spray once or twice with a pesticide, properly kill of the pest population, and then follow up with the organics as a preventative IMO. If you build up resistance to your organic pest controls in your pest population you can end up in a situation where ONLY a chemical pesticide will knock them back which is exactly what has happened with mites and mildew in most areas of California. Also the organic sprays are not always your best option, even when looking at the environmental consequences. What is going to be better, spraying an organic broad spectrum insecticide that kills everything, including your beneficial insects, or spraying a non-organic miticide that is very specific in what it kills and will leave most of the beneficial insects unharmed? I know a lot of people probably would not agree with me on this, but I do think pesticides have their place, even in organic agriculture, so long as they are used carefully, properly, responsibly, and as little as possible. Unfortunately not a lot of growers and farmers seem to use them responsibly which is where we run into problems....

Also be sure to make your environment as unfavorable as possible for pests. Pesticides, even organic ones like neem, and even biological ones like Sonata, should be your last line of defense, not your first. Make sure your plants are healthy and that the strains you grow are not pest prone - genetic selection is your first line of defense. Water stress, or not having your watering dialed in, encourages mites like nothing else. They will specifically seek out water stressed plants and attack them. You would be surprised how many people this fucks up. It seems simple, but it is often over-looked. Ensuring you having lots of air movement is also critical in keeping mites and mildew at bay - your greenhouse or indoor room should feel 'windy' when you walk into it - if it doesn't, you do not have enough air movement. Even keeping the dust down around your garden helps prevent mite infestation.

 

[Blaze]

Blaze/// thanks for explaining how to take your clones outside, last year mine revegged and just wasn't the same, kinda lost their momentum, and then they lost their lives due to the water hole drying up.

Oh yeah, it kills their momentum big time when it happens. Even just a little re-veg can really affect your yield, you will loose weeks of precious veg time because of it. It can affect quality too - in my experience plants than re-veg never quite stack right or fill in properly, the buds always seem to come out more fluffy and airy than they should. I would rather have a properly adjusted 4" tall clones than a 3' tall plant that has re-vegged because I know at the end of the season that little 4" clone is going to do better than the large 3' re-veg plant. I have tossed what probably many would consider a perfectly fine plant in the compost heap because of this, I will not plant anything that shows signs of re-veg if I can at all help it. I have also noticed that the larger the plant is when it goes outside, the more prone it is to re-veg. I am a little nervous about having bigger plants this year because of that, but so far so good, no signs of flowering. The true test will be in 2 weeks though when I cut out all additional light and just let them go al natural.

 

[Seamaiden]

One product that mites will never build resistance to is JMS Stylet oil. It's a physical barrier. I personally think it should be in everyone' s shed.

 

[caregiverken]

They don't call this the information super highway for nothing.;)
Thanks Blaze! (i better turn on some fans)

What is going to be better, spraying an organic broad spectrum insecticide that kills everything, including your beneficial insects, or spraying a non-organic miticide that is very specific in what it kills and will leave most of the beneficial insects unharmed?

The 2nd one!!:) Got a name of a product for me? ..lol ;)

I have learned the hard way about reveg (more than once) So, I completly agree with you..
Reveg. Totally wrecks a plant

 

[caregiverken]

One product that mites will never build resistance to is JMS Stylet oil. It's a physical barrier. I personally think it should be in everyone' s shed.

What does that do to the ladybugs Sea? Where is a good place to buy it?

 

[Seamaiden]

Nothing as far as I know. I got mine at Peaceful Valley, but it's just as easy to buy direct from the manufacturer.

 

[Blaze]

The Stylet oil is a good one, I use it as well. It is a great general purpose spray as it will kill insects and arachnids plus it acts as a preventative for mold, mildew and other fungus. It kills via physical contact by disrupting respiration; or in other words in suffocates the pests. It can kill ladybugs, bees and other beneficial insects if they come into direct contact with it. Try to limit your application to only the target insects. It also can be phytotoxic (reacts to light) and should only be applied in the very early morning or evening when the plants are out of direct sun. I always apply mine in the evening for safety's sake. It is also REALLY important you thoroughly clean your sprayer after using it because the residue is also phytotoxic. I made the mistake one time of not cleaning my sprayer, used it again the next day and burned some plants because of it.

 

[Blaze]

They don't call this the information super highway for nothing.;)
Thanks Blaze! (i better turn on some fans)


The 2nd one!!:) Got a name of a product for me? ..lol ;)

I have learned the hard way about reveg (more than once) So, I completly agree with you..
Reveg. Totally wrecks a plant

Much of what I use requires a pesticide license to purchase and cannot be bought over the counter at a hydro store or farm supply place. I will provide the info regardless. It is not that hard to get a license, or you can always see if any friends or neighbors in your area have one and purchase it though them. Keep in mind they require diligence and care to use properly and as I stated before, IMO it is best to use them BEFORE your plants go outside in order to limit the chemicals being applied in your garden. You also need a full chemical suite and a full face 3M mask with organic vapor cartridges for protection.

Tetasan, Akari, Hexygon DF, Kontos are mostly what I have used over the past two years. I just got a new one, Sorocco, which is what I used to deal with the mites I got from Humboldt. The Hexygon and Akari are what I used last season, so they are now out of rotation for a year or two. If you read the info on these products, many recommend only being used a few times per year, or in some cases only once per year. Ideally if you should wait a year or two before reusing a product if it has been applied more than a few times during the season. Also broad spectrum insecticides do a very poor job of controlling mite populations and can even make the infestation worse by encouraging the mites reproductive cycle. Carbaryl and pyrethin based sprays should be avoided for this reason . I know at least locally at lot of the hydro stores recommend using pyrethin based products like Pyganics for mites which really irks me as all they are doing is making our local mite population even more aggressive and resistant.

UC Davis has some excellent info on management of mites, check it out:

http://www.ipm.ucdavis.edu/PMG/PESTNOTES/pn7405.html

Take a look at some of the other products listed for control of two spotted and pacific spider mites to get an idea of what else can be used:

http://www.ipm.ucdavis.edu/PMG/r280400311.html

http://www.ipm.ucdavis.edu/PMG/r302400111.html

 

[Seamaiden]

The Stylet oil is a good one, I use it as well. It is a great general purpose spray as it will kill insects and arachnids plus it acts as a preventative for mold, mildew and other fungus. It kills via physical contact by disrupting respiration; or in other words in suffocates the pests. It can kill ladybugs, bees and other beneficial insects if they come into direct contact with it. Try to limit your application to only the target insects. It also can be phytotoxic (reacts to light) and should only be applied in the very early morning or evening when the plants are out of direct sun. I always apply mine in the evening for safety's sake. It is also REALLY important you thoroughly clean your sprayer after using it because the residue is also phytotoxic. I made the mistake one time of not cleaning my sprayer, used it again the next day and burned some plants because of it.

Interesting. I haven't found it to be phytotoxic unless the plants are sick/stressed, and the only occasion was the root aphids. I use it as an adjuvant according to directions and have never had a problem outside.

 

[Blaze]

OK, time for an update. First 4 pics are of my seedlings, took these shots 4-5 days ago. They were started almost 7 weeks ago (6 weeks old in these shots) and have been vegging outside under full sunlight this whole time. The first females and males started to show about a week ago and I am find more every day. It usually seems to take 6-8 weeks for most to show sex. The goal is to have most of them sexed and planted within 1-2 weeks. Most of the plants are Guava Kush F2's and Heart Attack Kush seedlings. I will also be testing out some Blueberry Pie F2's and Moonlight F2's I made last season as well.

The 5th picture is of a volunteer that sprouted in one of my beds. I always seem to have a few that pop up every season. It's in the bed I grew the Sour Diesel last season so I think for once I might keep it to see what it is, I like Diesel crosses. Last two pics are of the clones vegging in the greenhouse. I will be shooting to plant them in 10 days. I've been really happy how much faster they have been growing in a greenhouse under natural sunlight than they were indoors. At the rate they are going I should be a full month ahead of last year in terms of size.

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