Brown Leaves 4 Weeks Into Flower.

[Tylergrower]

Hi guys I am absolutely panicking here, I've been plagued with problems for months and I'm starting to think it has been these gnats all along, it seems I have a severe fungus gnat infestation that is about to put the last nail in my coffin. I am growing in coco coir in fabric pots. Recently I noticed my top leaves showing what I thought was a deficiency however it seems much more likely it is disease or severe fungus gnat issue, root rot or both. If the only cause of root rot in coco is sitting in there own runoff I don't think it could be that as all of my plants are experiencing this and only some ended up sitting close to their own runoff (broken waste system, water overflowed into grow tent, don't know how long its been like that but I've cleaned up now) I had leaves on top of the sand layer I placed on top of my coco to prevent gnats from laying. Don't know how well this worked. I started with gnat infested reused coco on this grow and I will never do this again, fresh coco every time from now on, extra cleanliness from now on and I will never make this mistake again. Have a look at the leaves, I've googled fungus gnat damage and it looks similar, but it could be root rot or something else, the damage began about 1 week ago at the canopy I started noticing it come on gradually and thought it was a deficiency but it looks worse I don't know, if this continues for 3.5 more weeks I think they will die by the looks of things. It also could be root rot as the environment under my canopy has not been very clean due to the big spill of my waste system that I missed for who knows how long, it could have been weeks of swamp conditions, I have 3.5 weeks left of flowering and I need to save what I can from this crop, will multiple applications of nematodes stop this progressing, H2O2 flush? Am I completely doomed if this isn't stopped in its tracks? I guess I need to know for sure what it is before deciding the fix as im not enyitepy sure its the gnats. Could be pyth or root rot or somethig else. If I don't fix this I am in big trouble, please guys, if you have any ideas let me know, if you need more pics or info let me know. Thanks for your help.

PS. Pics down below. Ignore date and time as my cameras date is not set correctly.

 

[Tylergrower]

Pics

 

[chemistry]

How many PPM's are you feeding?

 

[MidwestToker]

Just how bad is the fungus gnat problem?
root pathogen problems in coir looks like these plants.

 

[Tylergrower]

How many PPM's are you feeding?

I have been feeding at what I think is quite a strong mix of 6ml-9ml of Micro-Bloom with a bit of calmag. I've been raising my EC from 0.6 tap water to 1.6 with those nutes. I've since layed off to 0.9EC and that's with dropping the approximately 0.1-0.2EC of calmag I was putting in. Could this be nutrient burn that needs flushing rather than just laying off the nutes. Are you suggesting its not disease/gnats but rather a feed issue? Thanks for your response.

 

[Tylergrower]

Just how bad is the fungus gnat problem?
root pathogen problems in coir looks like these plants.View attachment 778663 View attachment 778664 View attachment 778665

The fungus gnat problem is bad in my opinion but then I've never had a fungus gnat issue, it could also be root rot because gnats carry disease? I applied nematodes once several weeks ago and it seems there numbers have dropped, I also applied sand to the tops of the coco to stop them from laying, roots grew into the sand and I get the feeling that's where the rot could be or where they are getting easy access to roots to eat. I also have small nubs coming out of the base of the stem that were white but have turned brown (root rot?). I've read gnats can eat roots and stop nuts uptake? A week ago I thought it was nute burn but I'm not sure.

 

[chemistry]

I have been feeding at what I think is quite a strong mix of 6ml-9ml of Micro-Bloom with a bit of calmag. I've been raising my EC from 0.6 tap water to 1.6 with those nutes. I've since layed off to 0.9EC and that's with dropping the approximately 0.1-0.2EC of calmag I was putting in. Could this be nutrient burn that needs flushing rather than just laying off the nutes. Are you suggesting its not disease/gnats but rather a feed issue? Thanks for your response.

It's some thing you've done quite recently, have you just upped your PPM? If you flush it, flush it with your new PPM nuits mix, if you flush with water, then you have to flush the water out to get your nuits back in your media.

 

[chemistry]

The fungus gnat problem is bad in my opinion but then I've never had a fungus gnat issue, it could also be root rot because gnats carry disease? I applied nematodes once several weeks ago and it seems there numbers have dropped, I also applied sand to the tops of the coco to stop them from laying, roots grew into the sand and I get the feeling that's where the rot could be or where they are getting easy access to roots to eat. I also have small nubs coming out of the base of the stem that were white but have turned brown (root rot?). I've read gnats can eat roots and stop nuts uptake? A week ago I thought it was nute burn but I'm not sure.

Do you use the yellow sticky cards? Lay them flat on your media, sticky side up, if they're to big, cut them in half, if you set them to high the little fuckers fly under them, and only peel off one side at a time. lol

 

[Tylergrower]

It's some thing you've done quite recently, have you just upped your PPM? If you flush it, flush it with your new PPM nuits mix, if you flush with water, then you have to flush the water out to get your nuits back in your media.

I've just done a bit of googling and it is without a doubt a phosphorus deficiency, hence why its getting worse as flowering is progressing, and hence why they turned dark when I switched to flower. It is definitely a Phosphorus deficiency. Why I have a Phosphorus deficiency is the question now lol. I have been feeding lower than I normally would have in the past and I don't know why I started doing that. Also my night temps are a bit low. This makes so much sense. Any tips? I've obviously got to bump the nutes up overall which with my bloom in there it will bump my P up. I've got to get my night temps up and also not over water according to growweedeasy websites page for Phosphor deficiency. Will the leaves stop fucking up straight away if I bump that Phosphorus up? How bad will my yields be affected by what I've done so far if I fix this now? Thanks again by the way because without mentioning that I might not have realised. I wasn't even considering it being a nutes issue.

 

[Dutchcity]

If your ec is only 1.6 and starting is .6 that’s a delta of 1 ec. That will not burn your plants. I’ve flushed coir on multiple runs with ec values of 7-10 ec coming out of bottom of pots. Now if you have a nutrient deficiency or excess / lockout that is where ec is usually irrelevant because your ratios are off and ec still looks fine. I’d say you have some sort of pathogen in your coir because I actually had the same synpotms on one of my plants awhile back and I know my ratios were good. I would start Your next run with h202 flush to sanitize the coir and load up every 7-10 days with beneficial microbes, does t matter if it’s coneventional feed

 

[Dutchcity]

I was using adequate phosphorus on my plants, all the same strain from clones, and one showed the same symptoms you have posted here. Stated an h202 flush on all plants and started using bacillus subitllis + teragrow by biosafe for beneficial microbs.

Send a wTer sample into Wallace labs in Cali and get your water tested for ppm levels and look at levels/ ratios to be sure.

 

[Dutchcity]

And yes, your ec is a little low, so conceivablely it could be phosphorus

 

[Dutchcity]

Hahah was looking at Midwesttokers photos. Yeah that’s DEFINETLY pathogen. Tylergrower, yes you have a phosphorus deficiency indicative of the brown splotchy ness on your leaf tissue. Sorry for the confusion gents. I would be running 2.3-4 ec in flower with your starting water of .6 ec

 

[Tylergrower]

Hahah was looking at Midwesttokers photos. Yeah that’s DEFINETLY pathogen. Tylergrower, yes you have a phosphorus deficiency indicative of the brown splotchy ness on your leaf tissue. Sorry for the confusion gents. I would be running 2.3-4 ec in flower with your starting water of .6 ec

Thanks so much for your reply. After looking at what a Phosphorus deficiency is online it seems all my plants have been showing clear signs of a Phosphorus deficiency for about 2 weeks now, maybe longer, dark green leaves, red shoots, and this leaf damage is exactly like I've seen online after having googled it. I thought I was adding too much nutrient and getting Nitrogen toxicity, dark green leaves but no, that's a symptom of P deficiency! My runoff from yesterday is at 0.8EC. So I should go for an EC of 2.3? I've never fed at that high of an EC I've always gone for 1.4 from my 0.6 water. Maybe if I go for 2.3 for a few days to bump the P up and then after that go for 1.4 which I've usually done well at, in fact I've usually gotten slight tip burn at 1.4 which makes me wary of going really high like you say. From what you can see from my pictures and the fact I've got 3.5 weeks left of flower do you think my yields will be hugely affected. I know its just a wait and see situation but I'm dead worried now. Although its good to have figured this out before everything is destroyed. Also should I remove affected fan leaves? There are quite a few as you can see in the pics.

 

[Dutchcity]

Many damaged levels in your photos. Maybe pull off the crispy ones? Idk. But the leaves that still have green area but are splotchy in sections I would just leave on. They are stil photosynthesizing. Well you P is off so as I see it you will have to up your part B, or use phosphorus acid to acidify and get some free P there. I’ve never come across P lock out, so your probably good there. Your ec in my opinion should go up to 2.0 to start. Just test it on a plant and see. What nutes are u using again?

 

[Tylergrower]

Many damaged levels in your photos. Maybe pull off the crispy ones? Idk. But the leaves that still have green area but are splotchy in sections I would just leave on. They are stil photosynthesizing. Well you P is off so as I see it you will have to up your part B, or use phosphorus acid to acidify and get some free P there. I’ve never come across P lock out, so your probably good there. Your ec in my opinion should go up to 2.0 to start. Just test it on a plant and see. What nutes are u using again?

Using GH nutrients micro and bloom at a 6-9 ratio. I fed at 1.7 last night, I think I'll add more nutes until I get 2.0EC for next feed. I don't know if its stopped it or not they change so slowly. I think I'll have to take some pictures and compare to see if its still progressing over the next few days. I can't believe I lowered my nutes instead of upping them. That's why they so drastically changed over the last few days I think.

 

[MidwestToker]

Hahah was looking at Midwesttokers photos. Yeah that’s DEFINETLY pathogen. Tylergrower, yes you have a phosphorus deficiency indicative of the brown splotchy ness on your leaf tissue. Sorry for the confusion gents. I would be running 2.3-4 ec in flower with your starting water of .6 ec

Just from my experience with growing these plants for 40+ years is that they don't require nearly as much nutrients as most growers try to give them. It's more about the balance of the ratios!

 

[chemistry]

Using GH nutrients micro and bloom at a 6-9 ratio. I fed at 1.7 last night, I think I'll add more nutes until I get 2.0EC for next feed. I don't know if its stopped it or not they change so slowly. I think I'll have to take some pictures and compare to see if its still progressing over the next few days. I can't believe I lowered my nutes instead of upping them. That's why they so drastically changed over the last few days I think.

How many PPM's are your feeding? Stick some pix up from today.

 

[Tylergrower]

I've had some trouble with my phone provider banning me from using g this site so I've had trouble getting on here to post lol. It has practically stopped getting worse entirely. However I'm a bit concerned now with how thin my buds are with only 2.5 weeks to go and also I'm getting orange pistils on some of my buds which seems a bit early. I hope the density and quality haven't been affected too much or else ill be heartbroken. The amount of time I put into these is way too much than usual. The next batch will be loads better with all that I've learned. Anyway what do you think of these at 5 weeks they seem a bit thin but maybe I'm a bit paranoid. :( I'll upload pics in post below

 

[Tylergrower]

Pics. Had trouble on my crappy phone so there may be a couple more below in a sec.