Chitin + Tea

[john martin]

Anyone know if applying chitin product, like Tanlin, with a tea, would kill the benies?

 

[Seamaiden]

I see no reason why it would be harmful to beneficial microbes unless it's got some sort of carrier that is harmful.

 

[john martin]

@Myco mentioned in the Chitosan thread here ( https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/chitosan-anybody-have-a-good-source.71213/#post-1418799 ) someone else's post here ( ) that has me concerned:

"Warning about concentrated doses of chitinase
I have a friend who grows worms. She threw some extra chitin "brew" in one of her worm piles to feed them. The thing she didn't think about was that worms also have chitin in their skin. The brew killed the entire worm population just like it can kill fungi and bugs.

In other words, be careful and only use active chitin brews during an outbreak. It is likely that using chitinase brews can kill beneficial organisms as well as pests. To correct this, once the brew has had time to do its thing and break down (a few days to a week) it is best to re-introduce beneficial organisms to the plant and soil. Spray your plant and soil with a compost/manure tea or simply sprinkle some compost over the dirt and water those good guys into the soil."

 

[john martin]

I'm wondering if it might be a good idea to apply the Chitin products / brews on separate days from Cap's teas.

 

[john martin]

Also @Kygiacomo comments in the BFX thread ( https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/has-anyone-used-bud-factor-x-in-veg.72113/#post-1452248 ):

(Antimicrobial)

"Also here is another great read on Chitosan. its got so many plant benefits that its really insane to grow without it outdoors at least, there are many ways as well to grow with it, insect frass,crustacean meals,powders,bud factor x, etc. And the best thing about it is it organic
Conclusion
After various recent research findings, chitosan has applications in numerous fields, as described in many review articles. This naturally occurring molecule with interesting antimicrobial and eliciting properties has been getting more attention in recent years. This molecule can be used in a number of ways to reduce plant disease levels and prevent the development and spread of diseases, thus preserving crop yield and quality. The potent effect of chitosan on plant diseases control is from its antimicrobial properties and plant innate immunity elicited activity. The antimicrobial activity is influenced by several factors, such as MW, DDA, solubility, positive charge density, chemical modification, pH, concentration, chelating capacity and type of micro-organism. Chitosan has also become a postharvest promising treatment for fruits due to its natural character, antimicrobial activity and elicitation of defence responses. In spite of the chitosan advantages, the poor solubility of chitosan is the major limiting factors in its utilization. Therefore, several researchers have started to modify a chitosan molecule to produce high-antimicrobial active derivatives COS. Our review suggests that chitosan and COS can be used as potent antibacterial molecule in biological systems.
http://medcraveonline.com/APAR/APAR-01-00006.php"

 

[Confuten1]

Because i read that one of the benifits of Chitosan is that it breaks down the cell wall of fungus, I donot apply with my teas, seems counter productive to me. I apply chitosan twice a week now and teas once a week in between. Chitosan is no joke and lives up to the hype. I had stem rot on several of my plants and i foilared sprayed the base of the rot and it stopped it dead in its tracks. it healed up and scabbed over. my last run, i had root issues like fusarism and with the help of applying chitosan regularly, i had one of my best runs at 1.75 per light. I dont think i would ever grow without it.

confu

 

[john martin]

Been playing with Marine Green by Roots Organic, but I'm wondering if I should use it in a tea with maybe insect frass and worm castings and some high brix, and do my regular teas on other days?

"Roots Organics Marine Green compost is a synergistic combination of byproducts from marine life such as sustainably harvested Dungeness crab and line-caught Albacore Tuna. This powerful and sustainable compost blend is the result of a long composting period during which the marine mix is augmented with aged humus and forest materials. An ample source of natural and organic nutrition particularly nitrogen and calcium Marine Green offers a powerful biology that includes the chitin consumers that decompose the crab shell component. This compost is great as an amendment or as top dress to support vigorous growth bountiful harvests and strong beneficial biology."

 

[Kygiacomo]

check out how many live beenies are in insect frass. i just cant find a reason not to use this stuff. it will help protect against insects in the veg stage and will also help protect in the flowering stage against fungi. this is the reason why bud factor x works so well bc it has chitosan in it..here check this lab report on how many good microbes this shit has in it. i will never not grow without chitosan again..here is the lab report and the kind i use. this stuff comes with microbes so i do not think it hurts the others. i will find the research on this bc i have read it before that it does not kill worms it actually encourages them

 

[john martin]

I'm assuming most of the benies in the insect frass are compatible with Chitin. I know worm castings in tea result in better Chitin digestion also. This is why I'm thinking it may be best to have a dedicated tea each week to Chitin, and a second tea each week with with Benies like Cap's OG Biowar and organic foods once a week as well.

 

[Kygiacomo]

ya its got trillons in man its awesome! just get the 12$ bag off ebay which is 1/2 pound and add 1tsp per folair and watch the magic happen..i think that would be a great ideal bro. please post ur results. what lead me to learn all i could about chitosan was bud rot last year

 

[Kygiacomo]

Also i found that chitosan has great chelating properties which aids in better uptake of macro,secondary and micro nutrients. i got some Vitazyme on the way here right now and im gonna be doing some testing with it. the 2 main things that interested me was the Tricantonal and brassinosteroid. i spent $12.95 for 8oz bottle and the dose per gallon is .5 tsp so it will last a while if it does what it says. i will post my findings here as well. i love learning new things about growing esp when its all natural ways to boost performance. i really think canna boost has brassinosteriod in it and i also think that Heavy 16 roots has chitosan in it. when u study up on what brass does and chitosan its very similar to what they describe. i dont know for sure only my theory!

"The use of chitosan from fungi biomass has great advantages, such as independence from seasonal factors, wide scale production, simultaneous extraction of chitin and chitosan, and the fact that the process of chitosan extraction is simple and cheap, resulting in reduced time and cost. Moreover, this strategy avoids protein contamination, particularly from proteins that could cause allergic reactions in individuals with shell fish allergies (Franco et al., 2004).

Chitosan has better chelating properties than other natural polymers due to their amino groups, as nitrogen is a donor of electron pairs, although hydroxyl groups participate in combining these reactive groups with metal ions. Based on these chemical properties, chitosan may stimulate the plant growth and yield as well as induce the immunologic system to promote resistance to plant pathogens (Boonlertnirun et al., 2008). Furthermore, the addition of C. elegans, which are fungi that produce chitosan and polyphosphate, may increase the availability of phosphate in the soil (Franco et al., 2011)."

 

[Seamaiden]

"Warning about concentrated doses of chitinase
I have a friend who grows worms. She threw some extra chitin "brew" in one of her worm piles to feed them. The thing she didn't think about was that worms also have chitin in their skin. The brew killed the entire worm population just like it can kill fungi and bugs.

In other words, be careful and only use active chitin brews during an outbreak. It is likely that using chitinase brews can kill beneficial organisms as well as pests. To correct this, once the brew has had time to do its thing and break down (a few days to a week) it is best to re-introduce beneficial organisms to the plant and soil. Spray your plant and soil with a compost/manure tea or simply sprinkle some compost over the dirt and water those good guys into the soil."

Segmented worms being killed, wow? This must have been super, super concentrated. I know that I can't keep my bugs in too much of their own shit or they'll go cannibalistic and stuff. But, I also know (and as Kygiacomo has demonstrated) that when you're using actual frass, it's got lots of 'good stuff' in it, so that's my perspective. I haven't used a concentrated product, just frass, and since I grow my own bugs I've got a good bit of it. Just dumped a few pounds into the aquaponics system a few days ago (along with some Sea-90, MaxiCrop concentrate and MicroHume) and am watching the veggies take off.

ya its got trillons in man its awesome! just get the 12$ bag off ebay which is 1/2 pound and add 1tsp per folair and watch the magic happen..i think that would be a great ideal bro. please post ur results. what lead me to learn all i could about chitosan was bud rot last year

Jesus, $12/.5lb? Maybe I should start selling mine.

 

[Kygiacomo]

thats my next step as well Seamaiden to get my own colony of mealworms. that would be so awesome to have frass at my disposal anytime for free. Everthing i have used frass on takes off! veggies,cannabis and even my orchids they all love the frass

 

[Kygiacomo]

oh ya i forgot to mention 2lb is 25$ and 5lb is 51$ and 160$ its costly as hell but its got the broken down form of chitin in it for immediant plant use which is chitosan. its very expensive when u gotta order it online but im sure there are local places where ur from that has them alot cheaper. im just stuck in the hills of eastern ky with no hydro stores within a 2hr drive in all directions from me,so i gotta get all the hydro products online and that costs extra for shipping. Here is how i see it though i can spend 50$ and last me the whole grow for 20 plants doing 1 time a week 1-2tsp and get all the benefits that chitosan has to offer and help save my crop or i can not use it and take the chance and lose 1000s of dollars. i weigh the pros & cons of the price and the cons defo add up for me. i will one day start my own colony but im very new to organics and how stuff work so right now i would just rather buy everthing. i paid 25$ for 4 gallon of living soil and i put 10-15 gallon of it in 4 holes just bc i did not know how to properly add the stuff and cook it off along with the correct aeiration amendments,so i said fk it i will buy the living soil this year that way i can truly experience organic living soil and see if its something i will want to contiune on in the future. if i had bought the organic living soil kits and fked up the mix bc i didnt know what i was doing then i would been turned off organics bc of my own mistake and i didnt want that to happen hence the reason i shelled out 200$ just on 4 holes.

 

[Blaze]

Just FYI guys if you are looking to add chitin to your regiment, bat guanos contains higher concentrations of it than insect frass, crab shell meal, and just about anything else, and it won't cost you and arm and a leg.....

 

[john martin]

Never heard of bat guano containing Chitin, thanks!

http://www.frontiersinzoology.com/content/11/1/59

 

[Kygiacomo]

u gotta find the bat guano that eats insects which is the high nitrogen ones if i am remember correctly. the high phosorpus ones are fruit eating bats. Chitin has to be broken down,chitosan is already in plant usable form which is why i like to use frass its plant avaliable asap. i have crustaceion meal in my soil though and i have bat guano that i just got in 2 days ago that im gonna do teas with and see if it works as well as frass. i will also send in for a lab report to see if it has as many microbes in it like frass does as well.

Edit: blaze do u have a certain bat guano that u can recommend for the high chitosan?

 

[john martin]

Here is the one I use:


Considering this for my heavy N eating strains:


Anyone know if Seabird guano should also have Chitin in it?

 

[john martin]

"Seabirds eat small marine fish, squid, shellfish, and a variety of crustaceans (such as krill and crabs). Since some foods may be better than the rest, we want to know what kinds of food seabird adults and chicks are eating."

 

[Kygiacomo]

"Seabirds eat small marine fish, squid, shellfish, and a variety of crustaceans (such as krill and crabs). Since some foods may be better than the rest, we want to know what kinds of food seabird adults and chicks are eating."

i never even thought about the seabird guano. im also gonna be using a product called Regalia which is another ISR/SAR inducer in our plants. i had such a bad case of bud rot last year that it opened my eyes to alot of things i was doing wrong. im going hardcore on the prevention plan this year and using ever product or compound i can to induce SAR in our plants from Aloe vera,chitosan,b1 thiamine and Regalia along with ever feeding of potassium silica. im hoping with the outdoor proven strains and these prevention measures that bud rot will be kept to a minimum this year. check this regalia out its all natural as well http://www.marronebioinnovations.com/products/brand/regalia/