Clawing and low ec issues

[lockedshed]

Ok thats like 30% runoff per plant, lift the pots to get a feel for the weight of each plant pot.

Next day Stick fingers in soil 2-3 inches if its still wet don't feed, if its dry feed, lift pot for weight feel.

Once the plants get bigger you'll go by finger feel or a use a stick or soil moisture meter.

NPK is on ur fert bottles 4-0-1, 1-4-2

ur plants are droopy overwatered .

Im in coco but you keep saying soil.
Im told by some on here and other places that coco is hydro and I need to keep it at least 90% saturated and that when I feed (apparently should be at least twice daily) I am giving oxygen to the roots?

I should not let coco 'dry back' so the pot is light?

 

[Redneckx]

Thanks.
Google is suggesting its over watering, from what the guy posted.
Im in coco and im getting told that over watering is impossible.
For plants my size in a 5 gallon pot, 1.5 litres once daily doesn't sound much from my research, though 50% run off is higher than the 10 - 30% I see.
I'll water 1 litre with stronger nutes and cut the cal mag back by half, and maybe cut my light back more.

Everybody will tell y that in coco there is no overwatering.
But imo there is. That's why I always give my plants a dryback of 2-3 days, and only around 5-10% runoff.
I'm in pure Coco, just some charcoal and clays on the bottom.
Hadn't any big issues with those drybacks, maybe the yield will suffer a little but also don't want to water 3 times daily, which my plants don't take up anyway.

Y may try out to water with less volume and give them a day dryback or sth. The plants will show y that they like it. 50% run off seems a little much, if y use a recirculating system no biggy, otherwise a lot will be wasted.
Your plants have to pray no droopy (prob. Lights a little too strong and or too close)

 

[Clearbluesky]

The lower EC means your plants are feeding, you say you are using 5 gallon pots for coco which i think are to big, I use 2.6 gallon pots and grow plants that I get over a pound of buds.
The size of your plants in the 5 gallon pots can be over watered which i just went threw with one of my plants, i would try to feed every other day until your leafs starts to pray then go with feeding once a day with 20 percent run off.
Using a 5 gallon pot it's hard to have a good root system when you transplant your seedling into it which should be a 2 week old seedling that was started in a solo cup and should have a nice root system ready for transplant which works good in a smaller pot, but going into a 5 gallon pot probably should be just feeding to run off every other day and see if they start growing better, once your plants develop a good root zone then you can feed every day in that 5 gallon pot , next time if I was you I would use smaller pots for your next grow, that's how you learn from your mistakes.. good luck

 

[Grownsince95]

Tap water is 0.1

Can you explain the bit you said about the 0.6 EC you're dropping back.
Do I add more a + b to replace the cal mag and make the same EC - 1.9 (instead of 1ml cal mag and 2.5ml A + B, I do something like 0.5ml cal mag and 3.0ml A + B?)

Is the cal mag causing the clawing and is my watering once a day ok? (I'll cut back a bit from 1.5 litre to get less run off)

Thanks btw

If your runoff is .6 lower than your input, raise the a & b .6

The thing is...that might put your EC in the high range. Calmag adds a lot of ppm per ml. Plus extra N. If you want to keep the max amount of a & b in the mix, add calmag to your tap water until it's .2 EC or use half as much and see what it says.

Add your regular dose of calmag to the tap water and measure it. It might be over .5 EC.

 

[Grownsince95]

And stop listening to the fools that are telling you to dry back your coco.

 

[lockedshed]

The lower EC means your plants are feeding, you say you are using 5 gallon pots for coco which i think are to big, I use 2.6 gallon pots and grow plants that I get over a pound of buds.
The size of your plants in the 5 gallon pots can be over watered which i just went threw with one of my plants, i would try to feed every other day until your leafs starts to pray then go with feeding once a day with 20 percent run off.
Using a 5 gallon pot it's hard to have a good root system when you transplant your seedling into it which should be a 2 week old seedling that was started in a solo cup and should have a nice root system ready for transplant which works good in a smaller pot, but going into a 5 gallon pot probably should be just feeding to run off every other day and see if they start growing better, once your plants develop a good root zone then you can feed every day in that 5 gallon pot , next time if I was you I would use smaller pots for your next grow, that's how you learn from your mistakes.. good luck

Thanks. I do have white roots peaking out of the bottom of the 5 gallons atm.
The roots looked good when I transplanted from solo to 5 gallon.
I'll look into small pots for future

 

[Clearbluesky]

I have a journal on here with my last coco run being feed 3 times a day in 2.6 gallon pots, i use master blend 3 parts for my nutrients, and last run I got over 4 pounds of cured bud's from 4 plants.

 

[Grownsince95]

Your plant needs a little warmer environment and more N/P/K and should bounce back quickly. Aim for no more than 20% runoff, and if you can, give it to them in more than one dose. The first watering doesn't even have to have runoff as long as you get that 20% by the end of the day.

And one last thing because I didn't ask before...When you filled your pots did you pack the coco in with as much as you could? Or leave it naturally loose? If you stuffed it in (like I did when I was new) it's ability to hold air is greatly decreased.

Coco with synthetics is more like a DWC bucket than soil. The coco is your air stone.

 

[MercDod]

Cannabis Grow Guide - Coco For Cannabis - Science and Practice

Cannabis grow guide: articles, tutorials, DIY projects & more! Dedicated to the science and practice of growing cannabis in coco perlite and other media.

www.cocoforcannabis.com

 

[lockedshed]

Your plant needs a little warmer environment and more N/P/K and should bounce back quickly. Aim for no more than 20% runoff, and if you can, give it to them in more than one dose. The first watering doesn't even have to have runoff as long as you get that 20% by the end of the day.

And one last thing because I didn't ask before...When you filled your pots did you pack the coco in with as much as you could? Or leave it naturally loose? If you stuffed it in (like I did when I was new) it's ability to hold air is greatly decreased.

Coco with synthetics is more like a DWC bucket than soil. The coco is your air stone.

Thanks for your help.
From all of the replies (thanks everyone), yours seem to fit some of what I've read elsewhere and marry up more with coco, not soil.
When I filled my pots i did not pack them at all.
I left the substrate loose and level with the top of the pot.
However, they are lower than the top of the pot now, as when I watered, they sank down.
I was thinking of packing a bit next time due to sinking when watered, but from what you say, its shouldn't.

 

[lockedshed]

Cannabis Grow Guide - Coco For Cannabis - Science and Practice

Cannabis grow guide: articles, tutorials, DIY projects & more! Dedicated to the science and practice of growing cannabis in coco perlite and other media.

www.cocoforcannabis.com

I was following this but a lot of people said its outdated information.
From the pucks used for seedlings that can hinder root growth to the over watering (although people say you cannot over water coco).

Im very confused with everything

 

[Redneckx]

And stop listening to the fools that are telling you to dry back your coco.

Everybody does what fits the best, but if y ment me im no fool at all, only not as experienced as y are.
Fuck around and find out is my way to go.
In my cold & humid environment it's completely wasted to water a couple times per day only to keep to top a little more moist.
Without any little dryback my plants would suffer, less airation and droopy plants.
Tried it and they didn't like it at all, also the gnat army was evolving.
Maybe it's because I compact them as much as possile for the air pots that the substrate don't get flushed out to the sides.
With fluffy Coco and automated system I would let the drips run all day long as well.

 

[Grownsince95]

Thanks for your help.
From all of the replies (thanks everyone), yours seem to fit some of what I've read elsewhere and marry up more with coco, not soil.
When I filled my pots i did not pack them at all.
I left the substrate loose and level with the top of the pot.
However, they are lower than the top of the pot now, as when I watered, they sank down.
I was thinking of packing a bit next time due to sinking when watered, but from what you say, its shouldn't.

Always happy to help!

If you like to read about this stuff, do a few deep dives into VPD/transpiration, mobile vs immobile nutrients and mass flow/passive vs active transport. It will help you to understand how your environment shapes how the plant eats and the adjustments you can make.

 

[Redneckx]

Maybe y look around here a little:
https://www.cocoforcannabis.com/watering_coco/
Guess the best way to find out what fits the best in your environment is to trail and error things to dail it in for your setup.

Good luck and happy growing!
Coco is the best

 

[Grownsince95]

Everybody does what fits the best, but if y ment me im no fool at all, only not as experienced as y are.
Fuck around and find out is my way to go.
In my cold & humid environment it's completely wasted to water a couple times per day only to keep to top a little more moist.
Without any little dryback my plants would suffer, less airation and droopy plants.
Tried it and they didn't like it at all, also the gnat army was evolving.
Maybe it's because I compact them as much as possile for the air pots that the substrate don't get flushed out to the sides.
With fluffy Coco and automated system I would let the drips run all day long as well.

I would definitely tag "reply" to a post if my comment is directed at a specific member. It was more of a general statement to discourage new people from jumping on that runoff number and drawing the wrong conclusion.

But including "in my cold & humid environment" in your original post would have gone a long way to put your suggestion in perspective for both me, the OP, and everyone else reading this.

 

[Clearbluesky]

Here's something you can do to keep the gnats away if using air pots, I use panihose around my pots and put perlite on top or clay rounds Works for me.

 

[MercDod]

I was following this but a lot of people said its outdated information.
From the pucks used for seedlings that can hinder root growth to the over watering (although people say you cannot over water coco).

Im very confused with everything

Many people here will give different advice and its usually based on their experience, which means their pot size, their nutes, their perameters, etc, etc. and what worked for them. Ideally, find someone experienced who grows just like you.

The Coco for Cannabis site has helped many many growers, dont sell them short. There is a lot of exceptional information on that site.

My first and only Coco/hydroponic grow was started in a solo, transplanted to a 1.5 gallon, and then retransplanted into a 5 gallon fabric and was watered once a day although that may not have been ideal but was the amount of time I was willing to commit. It would do no good to give the yeild as that depends on several variables starting with genetics.

The 10 to 15% runoff is to ensure you wash out the salt buildup, I personally not go below that.

Good Luck fellow grower.

 

[Bilber]

Hey locked....

I'm not a coco user, but I'd like to know how slow or fast you dump your water or feed to the plant/s.....

Reason I ask is if you dump your water/feed in the soil/coco too fast, it pretty much slips by all the dry hydrophobic coco and immediately drains out the bottom of the container.....

If you water/feed slowly, the coco has time to get wet and absorb what you've slowly poured in.....

Maybe that's not the problem, but I like to water/feed with a solo cup, one cup at a time......

Take a puff of what you're smoking, give it sometime to soak in and dump another in....

Hope everything works out...

 

[Ninjadogma]

Hi, my plants have leaves that curl down, especially near the tips.
4 x feminized photos.
No tip burn, pictures show light near tips but they are the same green all the way.
Plants about 5/6 weeks old


feed with:
1ml/litre cal mag
2ml/litre canna A+B, 1.5 litres once a day, with 800ml runoff. (Upped to 2.5ml/litre A+B as run off ec was low)
Two of them have algae on the top (one is the worst clawing)


Example from two plants:

Purple punch 2.0 (most clawing)
Ph in - 5.83
Ec in - 1.7
Ph out - 6.0
Ec out - 1.3

Green crack 2.0 (healthiest and biggest plant)
Ph in - 5.89
Ec in - 1.9
Ph out - 6.31
Ec out - 1.1

Substrate - Canna coco premium pre buffered 70%, perlite 30%.
Ph tap water

18/6 light.

Lights on temp: 23-24c
Lights out temp: 19-21c

RH: 65%ish

Vpd - 0.8 - 1.0

Calibrated apera ph60 pen
Calibrated blue labs ec pen

Ac infinity 4x4 tent
Ac infinity 6 inch inline fan (setting 1 - 3)
2 ac infinity oscillating fans on settings 2 and 4, not pointed at plants.
Mars hydro Fce6500 light, 370 ppfd (34-ish DLI I think) - ive turned this down to 320ppfd.




Is the lower ec out a problem and am i under feeding?

am i over watering getting 50% run off daily?



Is my light the issue?



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I would suggest trying one little tweak and that is to take your 1.5 liter daily watering and do it as 3 separate 500 ml waterings throughout the day. Instead of a single dump and run you'll turn it into multiple fertigations. Or if you'd rather do less frequent larger volume waterings, run your coco soil style.

 

[Ninjadogma]

Im in coco but you keep saying soil.
Im told by some on here and other places that coco is hydro and I need to keep it at least 90% saturated and that when I feed (apparently should be at least twice daily) I am giving oxygen to the roots?

I should not let coco 'dry back' so the pot is light?

Coco is just a substrate that provides structure. You can use it hydroponic style or you can use it soil style. For hydro style you're using it with perlite as a blend of about 60/40 or 70/30 and for soil style you're throwing in some organics like worm castings, compost, peat, biochar, etc.