Clones looking worse by the minute

[Mr.]

Just picked some purple bubba rooted in rapid rooters. Temp is 74, humidity 64, 500w MH 12 inches above them (started it off further away). They began wilting like crazy and falling over at the stems. I diagnosed it as under watering, and gave ph'd ro water with 110 ppm of cal mag and .3 ml/a gallon of roots excel and still nada they look worse.

Yesterday, I sprayed them with a mix of neem, saturator, and .2ml/gallon of azamax (yes super low dose), ph was 9.2. I know that blew me away when I read that it was ok and not to adjust the ph, but there is no discoloration indicating ph or nute issues just leaves and stem falling over and wilting. I sprayed them with ph'd calmag water a few hours ago and still nada.

Searched for answers galore and now finally asking you all. Any direction on how to remedy the problem is appreciated.

 

[mastacheeser]

1. quit spraying them with crap, just use water
2. back your light off, i leave mine sitting on the floor of my veg room on a heating pad 6+ ft away from my 600 hps
3. What are you using to water them? no cal mag right now and your ppms should be -500

throw up some pics for a good diagonose

 

[Cort]

Are they well rooted?

If not I'd ditch the MH and put them under a dome with a tray warmer of some kind (I use my cable box) and a few CFLs or T5.

Im just a noob but Id try to mimic the best I can the environment they were doing well in. Chances are good that they did not have that strong of a light.

 

[mastacheeser]

search around for lumen shock, you say theyre falling over at the stem?
this would be my guess
overwatering is real bad too, whats ur medium

 

[ibTheMan]

way to much light on um and way to close, and thats crazy PH.

 

[ScuzyRoach]

^^^^^^^^^^^ Like they all said, too much crap being sprayed, too much light/heat.
Have you transplanted to any other medium or are they just cubes w/ roots sitting in a tray? If so then move to lower light area until they perk up, then get them into something to protect the roots before you expose them to higher light/temps.

 

[Mr.]

The light was 3 1/2 ft away to start. I will move it back and see what happens. There are only a few small roots protuding from the plug, on the sides. The plugs were in the plastic trays and I moved them into cups if ph rinsed perlite to aid in aeration and drainage if the plug being to moist was the issue (this was after they looked like crap).

Oh, and the co2 level in the 12x24 room stays between 800-1200ppm. Human generated co2, it is a well sealed room. I calibrated the monitor and it still gives those readings.

 

[Mr.]

On the next batch should I just spray them with ro ph'd water w/ neem and leave the saturator and azamax out? thanks

 

[mastacheeser]

if you really wana go at them early to stop bugs, dip them all in a azamax solutions right when you get them
at this point in their life they dont have any roots to absorb water through, so they absorb EVERYTHING you spray on them
i only spray UN phed ro water on mine(they just absorb the acid you add to ph your water)
if it is lumen shock they should come back to life eventually
get some pics up!!!!
ps i only spray with azamax during lights out or a half hr before

 

[Mr.]

thanks, if i keep having issues i will post some pics. once the garden gets on and going i will post a journal in the coco forum. it sucks having a bumpy start like this. i just checked on them and they look the same, droopy. the light is now about 3 1/2 ft above them. well we'll see how they look in the morning.

 

[mastacheeser]

cool cool keep us posted
i have problems with lumen shock almost every run, the ladies go from 400mh to 2 1000w
usually just adds a day or two to your veg, and ive noticed it doesnt slow the roots 1 bit
ive seen people that have 2 footers totally drooping to the ground b/c of lumen shock too but have never seen this myself
good luck to ya

 

[hiboy]

I will jump on the wagon and say HELL YEAH back that light off. I wouldnt spray many bug, mold killas that young eitha.
hiboy

 

[ScuzyRoach]

It sounds like me that your just jumping the gun on things. You should use a fluorescent or T5 light for small clones or small transplants. This allows for the roots to reach out into the medium you are using so they can absord water. I also agree that plain water is best or a light cloning solution for any foliar sprays. Once you see new growth start to take off you can go to the big lights. I cant tell my friends enough that less is better w/ small plants. They always put them straight into large pots and under big lights right away. They end up having to veg. for 4 weeks where i usually can only go 2 full weeks veg. under my main lights.
Take it easy and give em time. Good luck, SRoach

 

[Mr.Newcastle]

Just picked some purple bubba rooted in rapid rooters. Temp is 74, humidity 64, 500w MH 12 inches above them (started it off further away). They began wilting like crazy and falling over at the stems. I diagnosed it as under watering, and gave ph'd ro water with 110 ppm of cal mag and .3 ml/a gallon of roots excel and still nada they look worse.

Yesterday, I sprayed them with a mix of neem, saturator, and .2ml/gallon of azamax (yes super low dose), ph was 9.2. I know that blew me away when I read that it was ok and not to adjust the ph, but there is no discoloration indicating ph or nute issues just leaves and stem falling over and wilting. I sprayed them with ph'd calmag water a few hours ago and still nada.

Searched for answers galore and now finally asking you all. Any direction on how to remedy the problem is appreciated.

I think a good lesson here is, if your plants are misbehaving and you don't know why, ask the farm before you attempt to solve it on your own. if you are a newb, of course. All good answers that Iam sure would have helped your ladies recover quicker. I always ease my new rooted clones into intense light. And ease patiently too. Ladies are tough, dont give up on them. Cheers.

 

[Tobor the 8th Man]

Put them in the fridge for an hour and see if they perk up. It might be too late for that though. If you get clones like that again and they droop do the fridge trick. It works quite well for me.

 

[mastacheeser]

is this for the lumen shock?
sounds like a good idea if it is?

 

[Tobor the 8th Man]

It is to help them regain there turgor. It doesn't matter if they got limp from heat, to much light, to quickly removed from humidity dome or a combo of things that can happen to cuts or clones that travel in the mail or trunk of a car. Refrigerators are cool and have high humidity.

When I get new cuts and they look limp at all I snip the very stem ends and stick them in cold water and then in the fridge. They usually perk up or you can see great improvement in a short while.

For rooted cuts that wilted if they just came out of humidity dome I stick them back in. If they don't perk up I gaive them some water and stick them in the fridge and it does the trick.

If they are wilted for some other reason like stem rot, ph problems or something else it isn't going to help much.

It also doesn't hurt to try it for whatever reason. So it is a safe and easy save attempt.

 

[Seamaiden]

if you really wana go at them early to stop bugs, dip them all in a azamax solutions right when you get them
at this point in their life they dont have any roots to absorb water through, so they absorb EVERYTHING you spray on them
i only spray UN phed ro water on mine(they just absorb the acid you add to ph your water)
if it is lumen shock they should come back to life eventually
get some pics up!!!!
ps i only spray with azamax during lights out or a half hr before

How about a dip in Physan 20? I've been thinking about that to prevent further spread of powdery mildew in absence of a good systemic (Excel LG ain't it).

Put them in the fridge for an hour and see if they perk up. It might be too late for that though. If you get clones like that again and they droop do the fridge trick. It works quite well for me.

Neat tip, thanks! I generally only work with cuts I take myself, but on those occasions when I'm gifted, this is a good thing to remember.

 

[Mr.Newcastle]

Put them in the fridge for an hour and see if they perk up. It might be too late for that though. If you get clones like that again and they droop do the fridge trick. It works quite well for me.

This is why the Farm is great. Good stuff Tobor the 8th Man. Its the little stuff in life that can go far. Peace.

 

[mastacheeser]

yep thx tobor