Crazy high runoff PPM on first feeding

[MIMedGrower]

You can also flush out the excess nutrients pretty easy. Just keep pouring your nutrient solution untill the in and out numbers match. Or just feed lighter and later.

 

[Glassdub]

I would think this is generally legit?

"I would like to offer a ppm chart as a rule of thumb or ball park target ppm, but each grow or garden is going to be different.

These numbers are based on EC readings, .500 readings, TDS readings converted from EC or the common Hannah Chart:

Seedlings, Early Sprouts 100 to 250

Early Vegging 300 to 400

Full Vegetation 450 to 700

Early Blooming 750 to 950

Full Mature Blooms 1000 to 1600

(this excludes the ppm of your water)"

 

[MIMedGrower]

I would think this is generally legit?

"I would like to offer a ppm chart as a rule of thumb or ball park target ppm, but each grow or garden is going to be different.

These numbers are based on EC readings, .500 readings, TDS readings converted from EC or the common Hannah Chart:

Seedlings, Early Sprouts 100 to 250

Early Vegging 300 to 400

Full Vegetation 450 to 700

Early Blooming 750 to 950

Full Mature Blooms 1000 to 1600

(this excludes the ppm of your water)"

Ok the low end is a good guide except sensitive plants will likely want to stay under 1.5ec 750 ppm at peak bloom.

Also the ec of the water needs to be included with the total ec because if the nutrient solution is say 1.4 ec and the water is .4 ec you are giving the plant a 1.8 (900ppm) solution and it may be too much.

So always err on the side of underfeeding. Can always give more easier than take away.



Also another tip. Before led i read a tip that the max directions on a weed nute bottle are for 1000w hps. So if running a 600w hps shoot for 60% of max directions.

Not sure how that converts to todays led lamps and fuller spectrums bit it is a good guideline that tends to hold true. I am usually at 60% of directions on average at peak bloom.

As a guide. Still have to read the plants of course.

 

[Glassdub]

Also the ec of the water needs to be included with the total ec because if the nutrient solution is say 1.4 ec and the water is .4 ec you are giving the plant a 1.8 (900ppm) solution and it may be too much.

I thought you were supposed to subtract the water ppm from the final count.
From the Dyna Grow feed chart:

PPM (Parts-Per-Million)Our PPM values are based on elemental weights and percentages and should be used as an estimate. Staying within a range of 150± would be optimum. If using water other than Reverse Osmosis, obtain the ppm before adding your nutrients and supplements, then subtract that amount from your total.

 

[MIMedGrower]

I thought you were supposed to subtract the water ppm from the final count.
From the Dyna Grow feed chart:

PPM (Parts-Per-Million)Our PPM values are based on elemental weights and percentages and should be used as an estimate. Staying within a range of 150± would be optimum. If using water other than Reverse Osmosis, obtain the ppm before adding your nutrients and supplements, then subtract that amount from your total.

Yes i am aware but my diesel thai hybrids for example could not take the extra ppm’s of my well water. I had beter luck mixing say .8 ec including my .3 well water and only go up if the plant demands more.


Just another way to err on the side of underfeeding.

 

[growsince79]

Ok the low end is a good guide except sensitive plants will likely want to stay under 1.5ec 750 ppm at peak bloom.

Also the ec of the water needs to be included with the total ec because if the nutrient solution is say 1.4 ec and the water is .4 ec you are giving the plant a 1.8 (900ppm) solution and it may be too much.

So always err on the side of underfeeding. Can always give more easier than take away.



Also another tip. Before led i read a tip that the max directions on a weed nute bottle are for 1000w hps. So if running a 600w hps shoot for 60% of max directions.

Not sure how that converts to todays led lamps and fuller spectrums bit it is a good guideline that tends to hold true. I am usually at 60% of directions on average at peak bloom.

As a guide. Still have to read the plants of course.

I'm new to led and trying to dial things in. 100w hlg plants are getting 800 now and the tips barely burn. Next feed straight water.

 

[MIMedGrower]

I'm new to led and trying to dial things in. 100w hlg plants are getting 800 now and the tips barely burn. Next feed straight water.

Ok. But barely burning means you are already too hot. Once we see a deficiency or problem it likely started last week before we see it.


I say it a lot but i live and grow by it.

Alway err on the side of underfeeding. :-)

 

[Glassdub]

Watered the back row today got one very high run off read & two closer to reasonable.

LSD #2 PH 6.3 PPM 566
LSD #4 PH 6.4 PPM 387
Gelato #2 PH 6.3 PPM 375

 

[growsince79]

Ok. But barely burning means you are already too hot. Once we see a deficiency or problem it likely started last week before we see it.


I say it a lot but i live and grow by it.

Alway err on the side of underfeeding. :-)

A little tip burn isn't gonna hurt at all. I just use plain water and next feed will be 750. I'm thinking about going to promix or straight hydro. It's real tricky trying to mix organic and bottles.

 

[MIMedGrower]

A little tip burn isn't gonna hurt at all. I just use plain water and next feed will be 750. I'm thinking about going to promix or straight hydro. It's real tricky trying to mix organic and bottles.

I agree. And thats what i would do too. I didnt say it would hurt. Just that the plant is already over loaded some. So its time to dial back.

 

[MIMedGrower]

Watered the back row today got one very high run off read & two closer to reasonable.

LSD #2 PH 6.3 PPM 566
LSD #4 PH 6.4 PPM 387
Gelato #2 PH 6.3 PPM 375

Thats not bad. Different plants will differ by a couple hundred ppm with no problems. Just adjust as needed.

I water and feed each seed plant seperately with its own gallon pitcher when its truly dry and i adjust nutes individually that way.

Yes its more work but thats why growers grow a mono crop of clones. So they all eat the same.



But for less than 200 ppm i would let it ride unless i saw plant stress.

 

[Glassdub]

Run off levels have gotten down to about within 100 ppm of the solution for most plants but now I'm getting some blotchy leaves, under fed or something else? currently ruining 2ml FP/1 ml PT prior to this 1.5/.5.

 

[Glassdub]

Overall

 

[chemistry]

Overall

The one big disadvantage I found with those pots, and I love terracotta, is there is only one drainage hole in the middle of the pot, if this blocks you'll have problems you wont be able to diagnose. The really big ones work better, but the weight of them is unreal when it comes to moving them.

 

[Glassdub]

The one big disadvantage I found with those pots, and I love terracotta, is there is only one drainage hole in the middle of the pot, if this blocks you'll have problems you wont be able to diagnose. The really big ones work better, but the weight of them is unreal when it comes to moving them.

Re-potting to these over next weekend.

 

[MIMedGrower]

Overall

Look watered too often. You can see the perlite is staying tan. Always a sign its staying wet too long.

I would be using 2.5 ml foliage pro a week or so on that size plant so you should be fed.

Let them dry out real light and i bet they perk back up. The roots are drowned some at this point.


Thats my guess.

 

[Glassdub]

Look watered too often. You can see the perlite is staying tan. Always a sign its staying wet too long.

I would be using 2.5 ml foliage pro a week or so on that size plant so you should be fed.

Let them dry out real light and i bet they perk back up. The roots are drowned some at this point.


Thats my guess.

Nah, that's mosquito bits, I let them dry out plenty, watering about every 3-4 days as needed, someone mentioned over at GrowDiaries that my pH might be too high, its been running 6.5/6.6 in run off so I think this might be factoring in.

 

[MIMedGrower]

Nah, that's mosquito bits, I let them dry out plenty, watering about every 3-4 days as needed, someone mentioned over at GrowDiaries that my pH might be too high, its been running 6.5/6.6 in run off so I think this might be factoring in.

I looked again. I see the mosquito bits. Lol

I wouldnt think a few 10ths of a point of ph would do that. But i do see the ph looking stripes and leaf kink. They look like water stressed still to me. Did you flush them I forget sorry. Cause that can cause temporary throw off the ph at the root zone. You would need a good slurry test to confirm.

If they have not been too wet i would try increasing feed strength a little and see. Because if the ph is high like they said that shows the plants have eaten all the nutes. They may be hungry?

Hope this helps.

 

[Glassdub]

I looked again. I see the mosquito bits. Lol

I wouldnt think a few 10ths of a point of ph would do that. But i do see the ph looking stripes and leaf kink. They look like water stressed still to me. Did you flush them I forget sorry. Cause that can cause temporary throw off the ph at the root zone. You would need a good slurry test to confirm.

If they have not been too wet i would try increasing feed strength a little and see. Because if the ph is high like they said that shows the plants have eaten all the nutes. They may be hungry?

Hope this helps.

I haven't been flushing straight water but have been watering to run off after dry since I started feeding (was shy to do this when seedlings not wanting to waterlog with BX) & got those original high ppm #s. Most have dropped to about 100 ppm (or less as low as 30) above of the solution all but that blotchy LSD #1 & Gelato #2 look a bit N starved to me + Gelato #1 which has already been topped has been taking off, been tempted to up from 2 to 3 ml.

 

[MIMedGrower]

I haven't been flushing straight water but have been watering to run off after dry since I started feeding (was shy to do this when seedlings not wanting to waterlog with BX) & got those original high ppm #s. Most have dropped to about 100 ppm (or less as low as 30) above of the solution all but that blotchy LSD #1 & Gelato #2 look a bit N starved to me + Gelato #1 which has already been topped has been taking off, been tempted to up from 2 to 3 ml.

I agree going up a mil or 2 is a good idea. When i tried to rely on the pro mix charge i had yellow leaves quickly. And you have more light than me on them especially in veg. And 2 ml fp doesnt last long with growing plants.


And i only meant flushing out that starter charge and replacing with fp is a lot for young roots sometimes. They take another week to dry out for me after that. Thats why i contacted pro mix about the high ec out of the bale.