Did I defol too late into bloom?

Potsquatch · Apr 15, 2021

Hi all,

First grow, have a couple of Trifi Cookies (Fire OG x GSC) looking lovely in a very tiny space. I did a bunch of LST throughout veg to train them into flat spirals and maximize the number of buds getting prime canopy lighting (I like to think of it as a screenless ScrOG, which I deeply hope people refer to as a "faux-ScrOG").

In any case, I missed the pre-bloom and early bloom windows for removing fan leaves, and halfway through flowering the canopy was way too dense with too many popcorn buds and sad looking fan leaves (i.e. smaller, thinner, and a much brighter green) underneath. They've both been super happy with lighting, ph, and nutrients their whole life, so I gave them a pretty decent haircut (25-30% of all fan leaves?) mid week 6 to open up the canopy and expose the popcorn to more direct light.

A week later, I'm sweating because I haven't noticed much/any new pistil growth on the top buds, and I'm worried I sent the plants into shock. Leaves still look great and no reveg growth from the bud tops, so I presume things are ok, but I'm still a nervous first time plant dad.

Any tips? Should I add a recovery week to my bloom schedule to accommodate (e.g. harvest week 11 instead of week 10, so flush nutes in week 9 instead of 8, etc.)?

Before and after pictures with a couple recent bud shots (mid week 7).

Thanks so much!

growsince79 · Apr 15, 2021

They'll be okay. How much light at canopy? The pic makes it look too high. Lots of little buds. Have you tried just making 4 colas/sqft?

Potsquatch · Apr 15, 2021

They were getting just over 700 lux during veg (Spider Farmer SF-1000, 19" high @ 60% intensity) right at the canopy, been cranking up the intensity a few notches every day during bloom. It's somewhere just above 1000 lux now at 100% intensity, still 19" up.

I read somewhere that 700 lux was the most the plants can absorb during veg. When I first put these in the tent I had the light too close and cranked it way too high, made some of the leaves extra crispy. Hence the cautious distance since.

Never heard the 4 colas/sqft rule, I'll try that next time. These were also grown from clones, I hear that impacts bud size.

Would you recommend lowering the lights a little each day to continue ramping up the light? Anything else I can do to plump up these buds before harvest?

growsince79 · Apr 15, 2021

Potsquatch said:
They were getting just over 700 lux during veg (Spider Farmer SF-1000, 19" high @ 60% intensity) right at the canopy, been cranking up the intensity a few notches every day during bloom. It's somewhere just above 1000 lux now at 100% intensity, still 19" up.

I read somewhere that 700 lux was the most the plants can absorb during veg. When I first put these in the tent I had the light too close and cranked it way too high, made some of the leaves extra crispy. Hence the cautious distance since.

Never heard the 4 colas/sqft rule, I'll try that next time. These were also grown from clones, I hear that impacts bud size.

Would you recommend lowering the lights a little each day to continue ramping up the light? Anything else I can do to plump up these buds before harvest?

I think you have lux confused with ppfd. Or did you forget the last 0 on the numbers? Mine get 25-35k lux in veg and 45-60k lux in flower. 3 x 100w hlgs full strength 12". You bud size was from too many branches and not enough light imo. No such thing as a 4/sqft rule. That's just what I find to be the best yields for me. 32-40 colas in a 2 x 4 is perfect for my setup.

Potsquatch · Apr 15, 2021

Definitely confused on the unit of measure for light, should be whatever makes sense for values between 700 and 1000 (ppfd? Lumens? Shiny bright bits?).

I'll try lowering the lights a bit and see what happens--was hesitant given the late defol. If you're saying they look fine but small, I'll start lowering half inch a day until I see leaves bending up.

growsince79 · Apr 15, 2021

Potsquatch said:
Definitely confused on the unit of measure for light, should be whatever makes sense for values between 700 and 1000 (ppfd? Lumens? Shiny bright bits?).

I'll try lowering the lights a bit and see what happens--was hesitant given the late defol. If you're saying they look fine but small, I'll start lowering half inch a day until I see leaves bending up.

What kind of meter are you using to measure? Its almost too late to matter now they wont get much bigger.

LexLuthor · Apr 15, 2021

That light could probably be about 12-15" away at full strength right away, I don't think you need to lower it half an inch a day, that's being too cautious.

According to professional horticulture studies I have read, defoliation of 25% is the most you should do at any given time, so you should be good there. The thing is you did defoliate kind of late in bloom, I don't think it is good to defoliate after onset of bud sites. Can't do anything about it now but you know for future grows.

Everything looks very good, like 79 said, I think they can use more light. It's good to be cautious early on when the plants are young, but after the stretch (week 3 bloom) plants can handle some strong light. Good luck with everything and happy growing!

_VLAD_ · Apr 15, 2021

Agreed, ive got 240 watts in a 2x4 and I went too hard at first. Now its at 100% about 16-18 inches away, almost done with week 1 flower. This is for mostly 2 plants, ive got a 3rd in the corner I dont worry about too much.

Both my indica and sativa pheno of blue dream have been stacked when it comes to nodes. The sativa pheno obv has a little wider spacing.

In your position id come down an inch or 2 and leave light at 100%. Also keep in mind to keep the temps up around 80 degrees F

_VLAD_ · Apr 15, 2021

What temps are you running?

Potsquatch · Apr 15, 2021

_VLAD_ said:
What temps are you running?

Tent consistently drops to 60 at night, warms to 80-85 most days.

_VLAD_ · Apr 15, 2021

That may be dropping a little much at night but daytime tempsnare perfect. Isnit a LED light?

Potsquatch · Apr 16, 2021

growsince79 said:
What kind of meter are you using to measure?

Nothing fancy

growsince79 · Apr 16, 2021

Potsquatch said:
Nothing fancy
View attachment 1113987

You can download free lux app for cellphone is much better.

Potsquatch · Apr 16, 2021

_VLAD_ said:
That may be dropping a little much at night but daytime tempsnare perfect. Isnit a LED light?

Yep, LED light.

smokedareefer · Apr 16, 2021

Potsquatch said:
Tent consistently drops to 60 at night, warms to 80-85 most days.

I try to keep the daytime nighttime temperature swing at 10 to 12 deg

JSH1973 · Apr 16, 2021

Those looks fine to me, you probably did them a favour with a good defoliation, don't worry about the ''slow growth anxiety'' it happens to all of us when we are waiting for the Buds to fatten up etc... I think ''the stretch'' fools you into thinking the plant should be doing better later when the mad growth slows down.

Potsquatch · Apr 16, 2021

smokedareefer said:
I try to keep the daytime nighttime temperature swing at 10 to 12 deg

Awesome, thanks for this-- I've heard it's good to have a 10ish degree difference between night and day, and that dropping into the low 60's is great for indica strains with purple qualities to bring out the color in the leaves and buds.

If that's the case, and 80-85 is an ideal daytime temp per above, which is more important: hitting target daytime and nighttime temps, or limiting the temperature swing to 10-12 degrees (presumably to reduce stress on the plants)?

Really digging this forum, you guys are great! Wish I had joined sooner

smokedareefer · Apr 16, 2021

Are you running co2

85 is warm if you aren't imo

Potsquatch · Apr 16, 2021

smokedareefer said:
Are you running co2

Nope, no co2.

Shayne010944 · Apr 16, 2021

I’m running sf 2000 about 10inch from the top of a plant at %100 intensity and it’s fine . Going to week 4 flower now

Did I defol too late into bloom?

Did I defol too late into bloom?

Potsquatch

growsince79

Potsquatch

growsince79

Potsquatch

growsince79

LexLuthor

_VLAD_

_VLAD_

Potsquatch

_VLAD_

Potsquatch

growsince79

Potsquatch

smokedareefer

JSH1973

Potsquatch

smokedareefer

Potsquatch

Shayne010944

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