Dirtbags Hydroponics Thread.

Dr.Green55 · Apr 4, 2021

when it comes to mycorrhizae I think you will find that P selectively inhibits the development of immature arbuscules but still only in the short term, older arbuscules or established colonizes are not inhibited by P. Its also shown that at higher levels of P plants will automatically produce more carbon protecting or helping the mycorrhizae. Now thats not to say that high levels of P don't suppress or inhibited growth or activity but i think its on a much smaller level then one thinks. there are other factors to, Vesicle formation is increased in P-treated plants. I mean there has to be a push pull to ensure consistent P uptake. The main function of mycorrhizal fungi is to increase the nutrient and water uptake of the plants from the media. and that collaborative relationship between plant and beneficial fungi far out ways any reasoning to have it active in any potting mixture then not

PipeCarver · Apr 4, 2021

MIMedGrower said:
I think outside it would occur naturally with enough organic content.

fox farms products tell it like it is funny enough.

Happy frog is their budget (read cheap) potting soil. They inoculate it because it has little organic content.

ocean forest is their premium potting soil. It does not have or need inoculation as it has plenty of organic content.

And they do not inoculate their outdoor garden soil either I believe.

I see myco in my pots at transplant from time to time but none has been introduced by me.

What I read on the package says not to be kept below 5c - 41f and do not freeze. If that's the case putting it in the soil at the manufacturing plant would be useless up north, getting it to market the stuff is going to lots of weeks / months where it's freezing & well below 41f killing off all the myco's.

I get the hype maybe overblown but how can stuff like Great White sell for $30/ oz get repeat customers if they don't get results? The science shown ( that I've seen ) supports the use a mycro's product not one company in particular but mycorrhizae. If you stopped using it did you not get the advertised added root growth?

I've been generally pleased with most of my grows and I only added this to see if it does what's advertised. We all want bigger badder buds so I'll see in a month or so on next transplant to 5 gallon pots if I see improvement in root production.

MIMedGrower · Apr 4, 2021

PipeCarver said:
What I read on the package says not to be kept below 5c - 41f and do not freeze. If that's the case putting it in the soil at the manufacturing plant would be useless up north, getting it to market the stuff is going to lots of weeks / months where it's freezing & well below 41f killing off all the myco's.

I get the hype maybe overblown but how can stuff like Great White sell for $30/ oz get repeat customers if they don't get results? The science shown ( that I've seen ) supports the use a mycro's product not one company in particular but mycorrhizae. If you stopped using it did you not get the advertised added root growth?

I've been generally pleased with most of my grows and I only added this to see if it does what's advertised. We all want bigger badder buds so I'll see in a month or so on next transplant to 5 gallon pots if I see improvement in root production.

i get way better faster root growth and higher yield every time in ocean forest than pro mix with myco.

and if the spores die below 40 degrees than why would pro mix put it on their bales?

The truth is the info on all these products says “may” give the benefit and they tend to use one clinical agriculture trial from the past to justify sales.

It’s easy to sell growers. We see improvement and believe it’s from product added rather than better gardening skill. Which I have proven over and over. My results kept getting better but I didn’t add anything for years.

Plants don’t need help from myco fungus to uptake available chelated nutrients in a container. In fact the roots would grow and search more without the help

If we are talking raw organic inputs then micros are needed to break down the food.

most of the info on myco is from trees and that is different kind of fungus. And it’s outside in an ecosystem.

Dirtbag · Apr 4, 2021

MIMedGrower said:
i get way better faster root growth and higher yield every time in ocean forest than pro mix with myco.

and if the spores die below 40 degrees than why would pro mix put it on their bales?

The truth is the info on all these products says “may” give the benefit and they tend to use one clinical agriculture trial from the past to justify sales.

It’s easy to sell growers. We see improvement and believe it’s from product added rather than better gardening skill. Which I have proven over and over. My results kept getting better but I didn’t add anything for years.

Plants don’t need help from myco fungus to uptake available chelated nutrients in a container. In fact the roots would grow and search more without the help

If we are talking raw organic inputs then micros are needed to break down the food.

most of the info on myco is from trees and that is different kind of fungus. And it’s outside in an ecosystem.

I have to agree. Growing in rockwool is a perfect example of this. Using the most inert, dead and lifeless media possible gives me the fastest growth and healthiest looking plants by a long shot, using nothing but spun rock, chelated nutrients and a splash of peroxide. Seems counter intuitive but is the truth in my world. And the finished product is for me at least, much higher quality as well.

I think in most cases its best to get out of the plants way and let it do its thing. Give it what it needs which is surprisingly simple and basic, and the rest is just either unnecessary or gives the placebo effect of making a difference.

Dirtbag · Apr 4, 2021

PipeCarver said:
I've been generally pleased with most of my grows and I only added this to see if it does what's advertised. We all want bigger badder buds so I'll see in a month or so on next transplant to 5 gallon pots if I see improvement in root production.

If you want to see an improvement in root production, try unislabs sometime. I've never seen roots like I'm getting now. It's incredible.

PipeCarver · Apr 4, 2021

Dirtbag said:
If you want to see an improvement in root production, try unislabs sometime. I've never seen roots like I'm getting now. It's incredible.

Yikes....each plant ? $116?

Dirtbag · Apr 4, 2021

PipeCarver said:
Yikes....each plant ? $116?
View attachment 1110012

They aren't cheap but they're not that expensive.

I bought a case of 16 for about $100, I suspect that price is for a full case of 16.

Dirtbag · Apr 4, 2021

PipeCarver · Apr 4, 2021

Dirtbag said:
They aren't cheap but they're not that expensive.

I bought a case of 16 for about $100, I suspect that price is for a full case of 16.

I saw the US amazon had them for about $100 + $100 shipping..+ taxes & duties for 16 of them. The Cdn Amazon doesn't show the quantity but I'd suspect it to be the 16 as well. The first site I got to was Unis Labs ? then a Russian site I'm afraid to click called unislabs . com I don't do Russian. Then Amazon Ah Unislabs lol

Dirtbag · Apr 4, 2021

Check out indoorfarmer dot ca.

But also know these sort of require automated drip irrigation. You need to feed the plants 4 or 5 times a day in them by mid flower.

PipeCarver · Apr 5, 2021

Dirtbag said:
Check out indoorfarmer dot ca.

But also know these sort of require automated drip irrigation. You need to feed the plants 4 or 5 times a day in them by mid flower.

They're not for me, I use cheap dirt (promix at the moment) water every 3-4 days. I won't live long enough to get through a new learning curves now. I know you guys like the Coco but after reading here the problems people have with it (learning curve) I'll stick with what I know.

Before coming here I was wallowing in mud, quite happily too. Then I found out about ph.....new tool needed....ppm.....new tool....tricomes....new tools....lux/par....proper humidity control....new tools....phup...ph down.....silicate....mycro's......added perlite....more ventilation...new tools.....okay enough is enough and now Coco? No I'm standing firm I'm staying with dirt.....next thing you all be trying to persuade me to cut my hair and get rid of the beard (no lose hair in grow room)........lol that ain't gonna happen either.

Dr.Green55 · Apr 6, 2021

MIMedGrower said:
i get way better faster root growth and higher yield every time in ocean forest than pro mix with myco.

and if the spores die below 40 degrees than why would pro mix put it on their bales?

The truth is the info on all these products says “may” give the benefit and they tend to use one clinical agriculture trial from the past to justify sales.

It’s easy to sell growers. We see improvement and believe it’s from product added rather than better gardening skill. Which I have proven over and over. My results kept getting better but I didn’t add anything for years.

Plants don’t need help from myco fungus to uptake available chelated nutrients in a container. In fact the roots would grow and search more without the help

If we are talking raw organic inputs then micros are needed to break down the food.

most of the info on myco is from trees and that is different kind of fungus. And it’s outside in an ecosystem.

If I was running Hydro again or rockwool or the uni-slab I would probably run sterilized setup. As those have constant water flow or are watered multiple time a day. Any type of soil peat etc stuff that is watered once a day or less would have Mycorrhizae which are beneficial microorganisms/fungi and other soil microbes as well, as both work together.

When you mentioned organics and micros you are correct the microbes have to break it down, but talking with people at some universities studying this stuff, with some better technology things are not so black and white or what people thought. What they are seeing is even in full organic with a healthy microbial biomass, By adding a fertilizer applications its not only not killing the myco or microbes its actually promoting microbial growth and activity which is leading to greater microbial biomass and greater enzyme activity. my understanding is they are measuring the enzymes/proteins ,and the more enzyme activity is contributed to the total microbial biomass .

Now your right in a pot with synthetic fertilizer, you don't need microbes or any of that stuff , when synthetic ferts are dissolved in water the Ions are readily available for uptake. However that doesn't mean they don't lock together etc. like P ,calcium , iron etc. adding everything I said above in an earlier post about the benefits, I think its clear. one may say not needed but that doesn't mean there is not a host of benefits to using them, from warding off bad bacteria, pathogens ,insects overall cleaner healthier root zone, keeping nutrients more active/available, transporting , the amino acids, chelates , nutrient cycling.etc etc. none of those are a negative and all lead to faster bigger healthier growth. , I guess what I'm saying is, once one understands and see the differents proper use of myco fungi and microbes can fully have one will understand what I'm talking about, as my grows are far better with them then without. but hey thats just my opinion.

Kanzeon · Apr 6, 2021

For those of us with less money than the local wildlife, silica is the easiest additive to get for free. Just buy things that have a moisture absorbent pack, save the pack, and use some of it when watering the plants in veg. I've never, ever paid for silica.

DreamwalkerJ · Apr 6, 2021

Dirtbag said:
Well, today was my last official day at my job, a place I worked for the past 13 years, I left early and spent the day working for myself. Felt pretty amazing.

Having a couple beers to celebrate tonight with some good tunes. Here is to 13 years in the trenches, and many more as my own boss with my own business.

Now playing

Congratulations brother. I wish you success in the future. Good job man.

SSgrower · Apr 6, 2021

Hey Dirtbag, I just semi-retired myself giving me plenty of time to grow. Just flipped to bloom 3 days ago. See: 1st bagseed grow in coco/perlite, my only thread so far. I am seeing pistols now. Retirement is a great time if you can $$ money, growing will save me $$. Have a look.

Dirtbag · Apr 6, 2021

Haha I should have just said I left that job, I'm nowhere near retired. I'm working more now than I ever have. So much so that I hardly have any time for my hobbies..

Dr.Green55 · Apr 6, 2021

Dirtbag said:
Haha I should have just said I left that job, I'm nowhere near retired. I'm working more now than I ever have. So much so that I hardly have any time for my hobbies..

Like they say hard work pays off, hopefully you have much success., running your own business can be challenging but also very rewarding.

Dirtbag · Apr 6, 2021

Dr.Green55 said:
Like they say hard work pays off, hopefully you have much success., running your own business can be challenging but also very rewarding.

Thanks, it's both right now for sure lol

Aqua Man · Apr 6, 2021

Man O man Killin it... always a pleasure to watch and learn.

One happy guy here you back getting your feet wet. So much fun to watch

SSgrower · Apr 6, 2021

Great Times now with the legislature in many states, here is my buddies grow on the coast with me in Texas. Is this a supercrop?

Dirtbags Hydroponics Thread.

Dirtbags Hydroponics Thread.

Dr.Green55

PipeCarver

MIMedGrower

Dirtbag

Dirtbag

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Dirtbag

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Dr.Green55

Kanzeon

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SSgrower

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Dirtbags Hydroponics Thread.

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Dr.Green55

Kanzeon

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