Ditching soil - first (DIY) hydro setup

[juliando]

The 2 gallon system is an increasing pain in the ass. The ph was super stubborn, steadily rising to 6.5. Yesterday i put in 8ml phosphoric acid throughout the day to get it to 5.8 and this morning - right back at 6.4

Plant looks good though (I think) starting to stretch a little.

So I took the whole thing apart - cleaned the sump out, rinsed the root ball in some low ec water. Some detritus came out, roots released some sediment. We'll see if it helped tonight.

But, while I was working on it I had a thought - Im trying way too hard - it doesnt ALWAYS need to be a 5.8 (even though thats the sweet spot) it just needs to NOT be way outside the range all the time - with some windows at 5.8.
So if i can keep it close to 6 or even 6.3 (if thats where it insists on being) - and dose with phosphoric acid everyother day or so to get it down to the ideal range, I should be fine right?

We'll see I guess.

 

[juliando]

Refining the proccess' and schedule.

Flushing the systems did not seem to help much - cleaned the sumps, flushed the roots, full water changes and still - ph stubborn high. Climbs to 7 if im not on it everyday.

So, i decided to get much more aggressive with the phos acid - eat up the ions or minerals or whatever was buffering my water so well (I suspect its the nutrients themselves, which I cant avoid adding - so wtf?)

Anyway, a big dose for both systems - 45mls for the 4 gallon system and 25mls for the 2 gallon. Rather than struggling 10-15mls at a time.

I also made up a drip cup, 16oz filtered water with 5ml phosphoric acid - seems to keep the 2 gallon nearly in check. Steady-ish at 5.9

Keeping the EC a bit lower as suggested, around 1150-1200 to allow for some spikes without burning leaves.

Hopefully this a long term balance for me - these things are a pain in the ass right now.

 

[juliando]

Boom - 2 days straight at 5.9 for both systems.
But - of course, the fuckin Phosphorus starts to drive EC up.

2 gallon system was 1455 this morning, 4 gallon at 1550 or so.
So - small water change, little less than a gallon (200ec) filtered water for each to balance with nutes (5.7 ph 1000EC)
Remove a little phosphorus maybe? Dilute my EC slightly definitely. HOPEFULLY I havent added enough buffers to start this whole stupid ph process over again.

Its nice that Ive got it stabalized, I just hope the actual contents of the water are what the plants need - Not being able to test for anything specific is tough. The older the water gets, the more dosing and balancing - the more I start to wonder exactly whats in it. (I can keep track of my additions, but not what the plant uses or gets converted or left over from reactions)

I guess thats why the 100% (or big) water change is so tempting - you know exactly whats there.

Tell you what though, Im not keeping 2 systems after this, Ill probably break down both and make one good one - go back to dirt in the big tent. Cant wait lol.

 

[juliando]

Ok, seems like I got it locked in.
Ph consistent at 5.7-5.9 EC 1100-1300

Using my drip cup of more concentrated acid - 6ml-10ml/per gallon (depending on buffers)
Drawing out the dose gives it time to eat up the resistance.

But, despite being stable (compared to my first weeks) for the last week - I ended up losing one of the plants.
The weird thing is - it was one of the plants sharing the big tent - sharing the same water and light as the other.

Different strains though, maybe the GGH isnt as tolerant as the Strawberry Cough? Maybe I shocked it with a dose? Anyway, probably for the best - lets me concentrate on the 2 that arent struggling as hard.

Remaining plant lookin a little crispy - I cant turn the fan down because its built into the light with no controls.
But still kickin.

Week 8 for this plant I think

This 2 gallon system is much easier to deal with, much more consistent and stable.
Young straw. cough is still short compared to my soil plants but starting to spread in the 2nd week of flower - and still lookin very happy.
I think Ill use some of my frozen pollen on this one next week.

 

[juliando]

Both systems remained stable for another week - routine is really workin out.
50% water change for both, drip cup with 8ml/gallon phosphoric acid - leaving ph consistently at 5.7-5.9
EC around 1100-1300
But...the older plant took a hit (maybe when the other one died?) and the older leaves lookin crispy - but new growth looks better and it continues to flower.

Younger plant in the 2 gallon system is lookin good - small - but good.
Stable system, few burns - little more spread in 3rd week or flower.
If i can keep it happy for 5 more weeks I think itll be a banger.

 

[Olddude420]

I used to chase ph trying to get to 5.8. Now I strive for 5.8 to 6.8. Plants seem to love it. 50 gallon system (4 buckets for plants & 1 reservoir outside the tent). Just my opinion.. only 3rd grow (all 3 hydroponics). Within 20 days of another bountiful harvest

 

[juliando]

I used to chase ph trying to get to 5.8. Now I strive for 5.8 to 6.8. Plants seem to love it. 50 gallon system (4 buckets for plants & 1 reservoir outside the tent). Just my opinion.. only 3rd grow (all 3 hydroponics). Within 20 days of another bountiful harvest

Yeah, i figure they dont need that exact 5.8 at every single moment - just some windows (days) inside it to make use of certain elements.
But, ive found a routine that seems to keep everything mostly stable around that ideal range.
Both systems are small - so 50% water change is only 3 gallons. And my girlfriend is able to use the wastewater for her plants - so win win.

 

[juliando]

Welp, bummer...Lost the 2nd plant from the larger system - only 1 left.
Feels like Ive been treating them both the same - Both systems flowering, same filtered water, same nutrients/ratios, target numbers, light cycles and strains. Very strange.
Maybe its the system itself? Or some bacterial issue inside?

Long story short....Moving on.
This is waaaaayyyy too much trouble.

Anyway, ive been preparing for this - Going back to dirt for the large tent.
Got 8 seeds started from this summers outdoor plants.

We'll see what happens with my last plant in the 2 gallon system.
Starting to show some stress - even though the levels have been steady "perfect" for weeks now.
1100-1300 EC 5.7 - 6.0 ph
I dont know...Lookin droopy

 

[THCosmic]

Welp, bummer...Lost the 2nd plant from the larger system - only 1 left.
Feels like Ive been treating them both the same - Both systems flowering, same filtered water, same nutrients/ratios, target numbers, light cycles and strains. Very strange.
Maybe its the system itself? Or some bacterial issue inside?

Long story short....Moving on.
This is waaaaayyyy too much trouble.

Anyway, ive been preparing for this - Going back to dirt for the large tent.
Got 8 seeds started from this summers outdoor plants.

We'll see what happens with my last plant in the 2 gallon system.
Starting to show some stress - even though the levels have been steady "perfect" for weeks now.
1100-1300 EC 5.7 - 6.0 ph
I dont know...Lookin droopy
View attachment 2558559

Have you been monitoring your water temperature as well? You want to maintain a range between 64f and 74f. I aim for 68f. Higher temps will lead to root rot.

Are you using any beneficial microbes? If you have higher water temps then I highly recommend adding bennies. You can get away with temps into the 80s with a healthy system of bennies.

 

[juliando]

Have you been monitoring your water temperature as well? You want to maintain a range between 64f and 74f. I aim for 68f. Higher temps will lead to root rot.

Are you using any beneficial microbes? If you have higher water temps then I highly recommend adding bennies. You can get away with temps into the 80s with a healthy system of bennies.

My temp is whatever the house is at + heat from lights and small water pumps - which (these days) is probably around 68f.

No other additions besides fertilizers.

 

[THCosmic]

My temp is whatever the house is at + heat from lights and small water pumps - which (these days) is probably around 68f.

No other additions besides fertilizers.

Most likely culprit is lack of dissolved oxygen or root rot, which lack of DO can lead to. You may need a more powerful air pump or add some more air stones so your current one can produce more bubbles.

How are the roots looking? You can also run your fingers through them to make sure they have a bristly texture. Give them a smell too, make sure there is no rotten egg smell. With your sterile solution, it should smell pretty clean.

If you notice any root problems at all, then add some hydrogen peroxide to your solution to kill off the microbes. The exact amount depends on how many gallons in your system, but, using 3% h2o2, it is generally 5ml per gallon with no root issues or 10ml per gallon to treat root rot. An added bonus is extra dissolved oxygen as the hydrogen peroxide breaks down.

 

[amneziaHaze]

Most likely culprit is lack of dissolved oxygen or root rot, which lack of DO can lead to. You may need a more powerful air pump or add some more air stones so your current one can produce more bubbles.

How are the roots looking? You can also run your fingers through them to make sure they have a bristly texture. Give them a smell too, make sure there is no rotten egg smell. With your sterile solution, it should smell pretty clean.

If you notice any root problems at all, then add some hydrogen peroxide to your solution to kill off the microbes. The exact amount depends on how many gallons in your system, but, using 3% h2o2, it is generally 5ml per gallon with no root issues or 10ml per gallon to treat root rot. An added bonus is extra dissolved oxygen as the hydrogen peroxide breaks down.

I am using a shitty 15w airpump for 5 plants. soo you should be good.if you can buy some trochoderma it will kill evwrything that wants to live there
Its easy to see if its root rot open the lid and smell the water if its not an ugly smell then your good

Your tops are burning thata usually too much nutes.
Do you by any chance look at ppms from today and tommorow do they raise or fall?
At the start of my diary you can find a table for ppm and ph what it means when one drops or raises

 

[juliando]

Most likely culprit is lack of dissolved oxygen or root rot, which lack of DO can lead to. You may need a more powerful air pump or add some more air stones so your current one can produce more bubbles.

How are the roots looking? You can also run your fingers through them to make sure they have a bristly texture. Give them a smell too, make sure there is no rotten egg smell. With your sterile solution, it should smell pretty clean.

If you notice any root problems at all, then add some hydrogen peroxide to your solution to kill off the microbes. The exact amount depends on how many gallons in your system, but, using 3% h2o2, it is generally 5ml per gallon with no root issues or 10ml per gallon to treat root rot. An added bonus is extra dissolved oxygen as the hydrogen peroxide breaks down.

Now that I broke down the other system - i moved the air stone over, so now theres 2 stones on the 1 plant, maybe thatll help.
The roots feel fine - no slime or fuzz, shook them out a bit and no sediment came out, everything smells fine.
Maybe Ill do a peroxide dose.

 

[juliando]

I am using a shitty 15w airpump for 5 plants. soo you should be good.if you can buy some trochoderma it will kill evwrything that wants to live there
Its easy to see if its root rot open the lid and smell the water if its not an ugly smell then your good

Your tops are burning thata usually too much nutes.
Do you by any chance look at ppms from today and tommorow do they raise or fall?
At the start of my diary you can find a table for ppm and ph what it means when one drops or raises

Its a 2 gallon system - so i see a bit of a rise with evaporation. 16oz of water loss can be the difference between 1000-1300ec. But I check and top off daily.

 

[amneziaHaze]

Thats a huge range and at 20c-25c and 60% humidity you shouldnt get much evaporation its a closed bucket.soo your plant is drinking it

 

[juliando]

Thats a huge range and at 20c-25c and 60% humidity you shouldnt get much evaporation its a closed bucket.soo your plant is drinking it

Mostly closed, not enough to contain evaporation. And my humidity is (essentially) whatever my house is, just like my heat.
But yes Im sure the plant is using the water - the only thing I cant test for is calmag and since its in its 4th week of flower I thought it might be the issue. So i gave it an extra dose - sort of a hail mary, we'll see.

 

[THCosmic]

Mostly closed, not enough to contain evaporation. And my humidity is (essentially) whatever my house is, just like my heat.
But yes Im sure the plant is using the water - the only thing I cant test for is calmag and since its in its 4th week of flower I thought it might be the issue. So i gave it an extra dose - sort of a hail mary, we'll see.

How much calmag are you currently using? In another post you mentioned 10ml and 8ml. Is that per gallon or in the entire reservoir? Need to be very careful with calcium as it can lockout other nutrients. Using RO water, I max out with it at 3-4ml per gallon, even though on the bottle it recommends 5ml per gallon. 4ml gets me to 0.6 EC, which is plenty of calcium. The micro has more calcium in it too. If you need more magnesium, try adding epsom salt instead. You can add up to 2 grams per gallon, but I top out at 1 gram per gallon.

 

[juliando]

How much calmag are you currently using? In another post you mentioned 10ml and 8ml. Is that per gallon or in the entire reservoir? Need to be very careful with calcium as it can lockout other nutrients. Using RO water, I max out with it at 3-4ml per gallon, even though on the bottle it recommends 5ml per gallon. 4ml gets me to 0.6 EC, which is plenty of calcium. The micro has more calcium in it too. If you need more magnesium, try adding epsom salt instead. You can add up to 2 grams per gallon, but I top out at 1 gram per gallon.

5ml per gallon as a rule - so 10ml for a 2 gallon sump (max on 100% water change)
Usually less, when I do my weekly 1 gallon change Ill add 1 squirt 3mls. Thats why I thought it might be low.

* I think the 8-10ml numbers you mentioned were my phosphoric acid doses for correcting ph.

 

[amneziaHaze]

You shuldnt focus soo much on recommended dose thaty just the ballpark.some strains will want 10% some 200%

 

[THCosmic]

You shuldnt focus soo much on recommended dose thaty just the ballpark.some strains will want 10% some 200%

Concentration also varies per bottle. CaliMagic specifically should give 0.18 EC (90ppm @ 500 scale) with 1ml per gallon, mine is only giving me 0.15 EC. Previous bottle was about 0.25 EC per ml (cap never tightened properly and I suspect some water may have evaporated over time).

@juliando you can easily test the concentration of your bottle, just add 1ml to a gallon of distilled or RO water, measuring EC before and after to see how much it rises.