Eledin
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- Apr 4, 2023
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Lets all chill for a moment, I love this song.
Buckethead was too good for guns n roses, no matter how much I love their songs.
Because its over-priced. It has nothing to do with the product itself. It's why I use armor si' instead of power si'. I refuse to pay the premium that power si' costs and I feel for my own home grows, armor si' is sufficient in the cost vs benefit analysis.
Now youre talking about silicon. Silicon dioxide is way more expensive because potassium silicate creates salts.
If you were to say to me, "I'm an organic grower because for me it fits me as a person." I could completely respect that. To tell me that organic farming is superior? Well, that's your opinion and I don't agree. I don't think either method is superior to the other. I use what I use because it fits me. So please, let's stop all this nonsense. I'll never tell you to stop being an organic grower ... deal?
I never said its superior, but kelp and other ammendments bring things like aminoacids, vitamins and hormones that synthetic fertilizers cant. So yes, many times organic is better, unless youre looking only for dry weight.
For the most part, I'd say you're spot on. I do want to know what you're specifying as root uptake of carbohydrates directly because everything I learned says this is not so. There's no mechanism in the plant's root system to uptake sugars directly. The must be another system involved before any uptake can occur.@RoadKillSkunkHunt
@Eledin is correct. Carbohydrates CAN get absorbed by the roots but they have to be specifically chelated to be able to do that. The better question is how much in relation to how much the photosynthesized carbohydrate amounts? From a botanist I spoke to he thinks at least 80% - 90% of the carbohydrates the plant has are produced through photosynthesis while the other 10% comes from root absorption so your argument is really more subjective to what you consider more important. Certainly, when carbs are poured into media microbial life is what benefits the most but the plant will also pull up carb ions that bacteria present in the rhizo. The plant itself also expells carbohydrates at root level in the rhizo that microbial life can feed on.
I don't use carb boosters or Big Bud or any of those things. I had the luxury of being able to watch side by side experiments when I worked at LGO's being done by the staff Botanist to analyze supplement claims. In almost every test there was no appreciable difference found. Much like @RoadKillSkunkHunt I've resigned myself to the most basic of recipes using what I've actually seen work. In your case, you may have seen an improvement by using these products but many times there are a myriad of other factors that have nothing to do with the product at hand that made your grow successful in your eyes. I'm not encouraging or discouraging you from using whatever you want to pour into your pots. I'm only posting what I got to witness in a professional, scientific environment.
I also agree that most ferts are overpriced. Advanced Nutrients is a perfect example. At a molecular level there is no difference in terms of a nutrient ion that came from Advanced's pharmacy grade ions and ones made in bulk through the Bosch-Haber process from General Hydroponics. Same goes for organically derived versus synthetic. The plant can't tell the difference. The only benefit I see with going organic is if you are growing outdoors. The soil conditioning that organics provide is much better for outdoor grows. Indoors in pots you don't have enough time to truly develop organics.
I had someone on another site tell me that they chose Botanicare as their line versus General Hydroponics because Botanicare was cheaper. I use GH's FloraNova. I asked him to compare the dosage amounts on each gallon bottle and tell me which one provided more doses. FloraNova had over 30% more doses vs Botanicare. When you compared price vs the actual amount of usable fertlilizer, Botanicare was actually more expensive. He realized that he was being sold water with a little bit of chemical added in to try and keep it real. Most manufacturers do this. I've used Advanced lines and at the end of the day the only really useful product I found that wasn't criminally overpriced was their Voodoo Juice. Basically liquid bacteria without all the fillers Big Mike likes to add in to make the product look better.
In all the LGO's and outdoor farms I've worked at the only two nute lines that I've seen used consistently are from GH and Dyna Gro. Everything else is too expensive. If these other lines were so superior they would be using them. You have to understand that almost all supplements are targeted at commercial grows. Grows that house 1000's of plants. If I'm a fert salesman and I can present a supplement that can improve my commercial grow by 2%? Hell yeah! That's a lot of extra dry weight but for the 3 plants you have growing in your tent. The improvement is negligible. They aren't lying that you'll see improvement. They just don't tell you how much and if they say they can improve your grow by X percentage? RUN AWAY as fast as you can.
Nope. Sil Dio also breaks down into salt. ALL nutes are essentially salts so when I hear others talk about how organics are better than salt based ferts I just roll my eyes. When it comes to silicone what I learned was you want a specific kind. Mono Silicic Acid or MSA. Silicon Dioxide will NOT break down into MSA. Potassium Silicate will.
Synthetic fertilizers provide everything the plant will need. Things like amino acids are just a variable of the same ion but with specific properties that depend on the situation you are using it in. For organic growing AA's are superior as they can't be over applied so no soil toxicity. They also don't move like ammonia so way less fertilizer pollution on outdoor grows. None of those properties improves the plant in your pot versus synthetically derived ions.
I thought dry weight was the goal? Am I wrong?
No, theres no system at all, roots can take carbohydrates period. That said some carbohydrates are of more use to fattening than others. Ussing molasses is a good fix but ideally you want more specific suggars for fattening thats why I choose bud candy and carboload while I feed molasses during veg.For the most part, I'd say you're spot on. I do want to know what you're specifying as root uptake of carbohydrates directly because everything I learned says this is not so. There's no mechanism in the plant's root system to uptake sugars directly. The must be another system involved before any uptake can occur.
But that's not the point of anything I've been trying to say. I don't see organics as a superior method. I'm a container grower. I've experienced exactly what you stated ... organics isn't exactly suitable for a few fabric pots indoors. Outdoors? Yes, I can believe that because nothing replicates nature better than mother nature.
Here's what I like about synthetics. Reliable and repeatable results. They are easy to use. You're not playing a timing game with microbes in a fabric pot. I also don't feel to over-haul a system that isn't broken. (Call me old school ... yes, I'm old so I guess it fits.) I believe after all these years the end results of my grow will have more to do with how well I respond to the needs of the plants more so than a brand name on the side of a bottle.
And I don't sell any of mine ... none of it at all! I share with family and friends. It's better than anything in any of the local dispensaries.Yes, you can produce top shelf stuff with synthetics. One of my best friends sells athena weed (partially synthetic) at 8 euros per gram. Then they will sell it at 10-12 euros per gram, thats top shelf in Spain, only tourists will pay that much.
I bet! I think anything homegrown with love is better than all that shit they try to sell unless you go for the overpriced stuff.And I don't sell any of mine ... none of it at all! I share with family and friends. It's better than anything in any of the local dispensaries.
Organic indoors can be so much better too, you just need to look at some posts from seasoned growers in here. Most of them grow with organic ammendments. With synthetics you will get skinnier plants, maybe same ammount of trichomes of similar but it wont be the same when you smoke it.
Matter of preference like I said in another thread. Im not trying to shove organic down anyone's throat, the OP is already using organics. Im just saying that organic ammendments come with way more goodies that synthetic fertilizers. Wether thats put to good use depends on the grower, also for coco and hydro in general is best to stay away from 100% organics.I am a seasoned grower. I have done both organics based and salts based. I choose salts.
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