Grow#3 - Black Jack by BigBlonde

[BigBlonde]

Two Black Jack seeds were started January 31st using the paper towel and plastic bag method. Both seeds sprouted and were planted in starter pots February 4th. One seed had about a half-inch tap root. The other had just barely opened. I decided to plant them both because mold appeared near the opening of the plastic bag.

This is the seed that just barely opened. I believe it was later because that part of the paper towel wasn't as moist.

This grow, I'm trying to do a better job at the seedling stage. So I'm using a warmer under the pots. I have the tray upside down because the warmer's instructions said not to let it sit in water. The potting soil was slightly moist, so I lightly sprayed the top of the soil water and covered them with plastic.

Here's a view of the new 2x2x3 tent I'm using for starting the plants. The light is a ViparSpectra XS1000 in its first use. The light is 24 inches from the soil and is set to about 40%. (I set it after I took the picture.) That is the manufacturer's recommendation. I don't have a fan for the tent yet. One is supposed to be delivered in two days. There's a ventilation hole just above the light, so it shouldn't get too hot. I have a temperature and humidity sensor that I can use that I haven't installed yet.

My plan is to grow these two plants in this small tent until the grow that is currently flowering in the big tent is finished. It began its sixth week today.

 

[Zen_Seeker]

You updating weekly or as things progress?

 

[BigBlonde]

You updating weekly or as things progress?

Thanks for asking. I didn't have a plan yet, so I'll update as it progresses for now I suppose. I didn't think anyone notice the thread. There hasn't been much progress, but I can update.

So far, the plants are still tiny and seemingly slow to grow. One is really taking its time but is clearly still alive.

The plants should be warm enough, especially with the heat mat. The soil moisture is good. I used a good-quality potting soil.

I added humidity domes. They are slightly too small, so I used tape to keep them from sliding off. They came with pots, so they'll work better in the future.

The light timing is 18/6. The light is a ViparSpectra XS1000. It is 24 inches above the soil and set to about 40%, which is what the manufacturer recommends.

Temperature at the sensor ranges from 73F when the lights are off to 80F when the lights are on. I don't know the soil temperature, but it's warm from the heat mat. I didn't know how to set it, so I set it to medium.

The tent has an exhaust fan above the light that runs on the same schedule as the lights.

As you can see, one plant is normal. The other looks to be little more than a seed slightly above the top of the soil. There's a tap root and the shell seems to be opening. I keep hoping this one will do something. It is just very slow. So, I have been thinking about starting another seed and may do so today.

 

[PipeCarver]

Thanks for asking. I didn't have a plan yet, so I'll update as it progresses for now I suppose. I didn't think anyone notice the thread. There hasn't been much progress, but I can update.

So far, the plants are still tiny and seemingly slow to grow. One is really taking its time but is clearly still alive.

The plants should be warm enough, especially with the heat mat. The soil moisture is good. I used a good-quality potting soil.

I added humidity domes. They are slightly too small, so I used tape to keep them from sliding off. They came with pots, so they'll work better in the future.

The light timing is 18/6. The light is a ViparSpectra XS1000. It is 24 inches above the soil and set to about 40%, which is what the manufacturer recommends.

Temperature at the sensor ranges from 73F when the lights are off to 80F when the lights are on. I don't know the soil temperature, but it's warm from the heat mat. I didn't know how to set it, so I set it to medium.

The tent has an exhaust fan above the light that runs on the same schedule as the lights.

View attachment 1329351

As you can see, one plant is normal. The other looks to be little more than a seed slightly above the top of the soil. There's a tap root and the shell seems to be opening. I keep hoping this one will do something. It is just very slow. So, I have been thinking about starting another seed and may do so today.

View attachment 1329352

Hey there, There's a couple of things I see that are not recommended. One is a dome over your seedling. I dome up clones but not seedlings ( something I learned here) and if you don't have a controller on your heat mat it may get too warm on the bottom. I put a spacer of about 1/2 inch under my pots so it doesn't get the direct heat off the mat . Too much light too early isn't good either I like to keep the intensity low. I use T5's and I have my seedlings 3ft away from the light the first week they are above ground then after they've grown there second set of leaves start giving them more light

 

[BigBlonde]

Hey there, There's a couple of things I see that are not recommended. One is a dome over your seedling. I dome up clones but not seedlings ( something I learned here) and if you don't have a controller on your heat mat it may get too warm on the bottom. I put a spacer of about 1/2 inch under my pots so it doesn't get the direct heat off the mat . Too much light too early isn't good either I like to keep the intensity low. I use T5's and I have my seedlings 3ft away from the light the first week they are above ground then after they've grown there second set of leaves start giving them more light

I have been wondering about use of the domes, and how they affect light intensity. The humidity in the tent stays below 50% when the lights are on, which is significantly lower than the humidity in the room. I do have a small humidifier available. I certainly can remove the domes and adjust the light. I was wondering if this were the cause of the slow growth.

The heat mat does have a controller, but I don't know what the best setting would be. So I just guessed and set it half way. The bottom of the pots feel slightly warm to the touch.

 

[Harpua88]

I use domes for seedlings. I find the plastic lids that come with shakes from different fast food places work well. Some just have an X cut in the top. Some have a larger hole in the top, like a golf ball can fit in them.......those are good once a seedling is established, and if it's stretched a bit the lid holds it up nicely.

Even though I use domes (after the seed pops), the general room humidity is usually quite low, especially since I don't grow indoors in the late spring/summer months.

Mine done get all steamed up like that though. I don't know if they're getting hit with light heat, or the soil is wetter than I keep it but those look more like a steam bath......that may not be good.

I also don't warm the pots up much......in fact, my overall temp might be a bit too low, I may be sacrificing slower seedling growth for high % survival. My air temp is usually around 70.....sometimes just below. Maybe this is why domes work well for me.

 

[Zen_Seeker]

Thanks for asking. I didn't have a plan yet, so I'll update as it progresses for now I suppose. I didn't think anyone notice the thread. There hasn't been much progress, but I can update.

So far, the plants are still tiny and seemingly slow to grow. One is really taking its time but is clearly still alive.

The plants should be warm enough, especially with the heat mat. The soil moisture is good. I used a good-quality potting soil.

I added humidity domes. They are slightly too small, so I used tape to keep them from sliding off. They came with pots, so they'll work better in the future.

The light timing is 18/6. The light is a ViparSpectra XS1000. It is 24 inches above the soil and set to about 40%, which is what the manufacturer recommends.

Temperature at the sensor ranges from 73F when the lights are off to 80F when the lights are on. I don't know the soil temperature, but it's warm from the heat mat. I didn't know how to set it, so I set it to medium.

The tent has an exhaust fan above the light that runs on the same schedule as the lights.

View attachment 1329351

Reminds me of Dairy Queen Sunday cups, just with a dark rather than clear bottom.

I use water bottles. Same idea. I open or remove the cap for air.

As long as you don’t over water I’ve been fine with domes. Can’t say if it’s better or worse as it the only way I knew at the time.

 

[BigBlonde]

I decided to remove the domes to see what would happen. After a few hours, there was slight but noticeable growth on the slow-growing plant. The husk looks more like it's being pushed off, too. The bigger plant seems fine. It has good color and is a good height.

I don't think the soil is too wet. However, the moisture meter shows the soil is more dry near the bottom, which it shouldn't be. So, thinking that the heater is to blame, I lowered the temperature. I'm thinking about only running the heat pad when the lights are off, but need to do some wiring changes for that to happen.

This starter tent is in the same room as the 2x4 tent with plants finishing their sixth week of flower. So the room temperature stays in the mid 70s and the humidity is usually in 50s. My thinking is that should be fine for seedlings. The starter tent has a small fan to keep it from getting too hot from the lights.

 

[BigBlonde]

It has been more than a month since my last post in this thread. Two of the three seedlings survived and look like they'll make it. I am very slowly getting better at starting plants--but I'm not good enough yet though. Fortunately, these plants are resilient.

The plants were potted up to one-gallon pots three days ago on the 17th. They showed some transplant stress for about a day, then they recovered and are looking okay now. They are slightly over-watered, so I'm going to leave them alone for a few days. I'll only check for soil moisture and light burn.

Some leaf tips are showing light burn, so I have been lowering the light level. I can't raise the lights any higher. I should have bought a 4-foot-high tent. This one is only 3, and that's not quite enough. The light is a ViparSpectra XS1000, which is rated at 120 watts. I have it set to about 30%. It is about 17 inches above the tops of the plants.

I like the idea of having a smaller tent for seed starting and early vegetation. It uses less electricity, for one thing. It's also easier to access and adjust. It's just not tall enough.

I'll need to move these to the 2x4x6 tent sooner than I had expected. It's empty now, so I'm doing some between-grow cleaning and modifications. I have a new humidifier for it. It's an AC Infinity T3. I ordered it in November, and it arrived on the last day of February. I'm also changing from two ViparSpectra XS2000 lights to one. I have plans for changing the fans and the heater, as well.

About the soil mix: I'm using roughly equal parts of FFOF and FFHF, which together make up most of the bulk. I'm also using rice hulls, but less than I have previously and adding a lot more perlite. I also added 2 tablespoons per gallon of Gaia Green All Purpose. I have it all mixed in a big tub and have been spraying it with water and mixing to keep it moist.

I have been thinking about adding some other amendments to the mix--peat moss and/or worm castings, perhaps. I have time to add to the mix, so some suggestions would be appreciated.

I have been watering the plants with a mixture of 5 ml per gallon of FF Grow Big and 5 ml per gallon of Clean Kelp. I mounded up the plants in the soil, so the water runs to the edge of the pot.

These plants, by the way, were purchased as Black Jack Auto Feminized. These last few seeds were left over from our first growing attempt last summer. We lost that crop to spider mites and inexperience. We decided to grow these seeds out of curiosity. We were able to figure out during the first grow that they probably are not autos, because they kept growing without flowering. They eventually flowered when they were flipped. So, this time, we're going to grow them as photos.

 

[BigBlonde]

@GNick55, I don't like to ask for help, but I need help--again. I'm beginning to think I'll never be able to grow indoors. These plants are 66 days from sprouting and they're just not growing. This is very frustrating. I see pictures of so many other grower's plants that are growing so much better than mine.

Black Jack: I don't know what else I can do. I suspect nutrients may be my problem. I have good equipment. I have a lung room. The VPD is nearly 1.0. I'm using a ViparSpectra XS2000 light in a 2x4 tent at 25% (for the seedlings). The plants are in equal parts FFOF and FFHF with perlite. I amended the soil mix with two tbsp of Gaia Green per gallon of soil. I'm watering with 5ml FF Grow Big and 5ml Bloom City Clean Kelp. Nevertheless, it's now almost 10 weeks since the seeds sprouted, and the plants refuse to grow. They aren't even a foot tall. They look healthy, but they're just growing so slowly. These were sold as autos, but they don't grow like autos.

Here's a screenshot of the controller report:

This plant grew two stems from the cotyledons. So far, there are only three nodes on each stem.

This one was topped above node five a few days ago. Branches are beginning to grow.

---

Amnesia Haze: I started these two plants about two weeks ago. They're so small I need a magnifying glass to see their leaves. People say no nutrients are needed at first, but I'm not sure that's true. They responded well to nutrients. I'm thinking of top-dressing part of the way up the stem with some of my soil mix with Gaia Green.

 

[GNick55]

@GNick55, I don't like to ask for help, but I need help--again. I'm beginning to think I'll never be able to grow indoors. These plants are 66 days from sprouting and they're just not growing. This is very frustrating. I see pictures of so many other grower's plants that are growing so much better than mine.

Black Jack: I don't know what else I can do. I suspect nutrients may be my problem. I have good equipment. I have a lung room. The VPD is nearly 1.0. I'm using a ViparSpectra XS2000 light in a 2x4 tent at 25% (for the seedlings). The plants are in equal parts FFOF and FFHF with perlite. I amended the soil mix with two tbsp of Gaia Green per gallon of soil. I'm watering with 5ml FF Grow Big and 5ml Bloom City Clean Kelp. Nevertheless, it's now almost 10 weeks since the seeds sprouted, and the plants refuse to grow. They aren't even a foot tall. They look healthy, but they're just growing so slowly. These were sold as autos, but they don't grow like autos.

Here's a screenshot of the controller report:
View attachment 1349463

This plant grew two stems from the cotyledons. So far, there are only three nodes on each stem.
View attachment 1349458

This one was topped above node five a few days ago. Branches are beginning to grow.
View attachment 1349459

---

Amnesia Haze: I started these two plants about two weeks ago. They're so small I need a magnifying glass to see their leaves. People say no nutrients are needed at first, but I'm not sure that's true. They responded well to nutrients. I'm thinking of top-dressing part of the way up the stem with some of my soil mix with Gaia Green.

View attachment 1349457

mmm ok.. firstly the plants look healthy as can be..
yes it’s true seedling don’t need nutrients until the 2 small round cotyledon leaves begin to yellow.. yes you can add a bit of the soil mixed with gaia green but that’s not the reason why.. are the haze autos too?..

 

[GNick55]

also i’m just heading out for a while but i’ll be back

 

[BigBlonde]

are the haze autos too?..

No. I decided to stay away from autos.

Also, I grew the Black Jack last summer and they didn't act like autos, even though they were sold as autos. Those didn't flower till they were flipped.

mmm ok.. firstly the plants look healthy as can be..

That's what's troubling about it. It has been 67 days since they sprouted. They seem to be doing better since I transplanted them to the 7-gallon fabric pots. The roots looked okay when I pulled them out of the 1-gallon plastic pots.

also i’m just heading out for a while but i’ll be back

Thanks so much for your help.

 

[BigBlonde]

My biggest problem is getting seedlings to grow. I have some Amnesia Haze now that are a month old and only an inch tall, yet they look healthy. At an inch, they have their third set of leaves. The plants are amazingly small, but look healthy when viewed using a magnifying glass. Today is day 77 for the Black Jack plants and only one has made it to 12 inches tall. I haven't a clue as to why my plants grow so slowly. At this rate, I may be looking at over a year to go from seedling to harvest, if I ever get to harvest. I'm out of ideas and thinking it may be time to quit trying. So far, after nearly a year, in my fourth growing attempt and about $2,000 invested, I've only harvested eight ounces. That's $250/ounce. It isn't worth it. It's especially frustrating when I see others in their first attempt with beautiful plants. I have no idea how they do it. Nevertheless, I continue to try everything I can think of to get better growth.

I repotted the Amnesia Haze because I was thinking the potting soil might be the problem. Once out of the first pots, I could see large dry spots in the soil. For some reason, the water wasn't penetrating well. I removed some of the original potting soil (especially the dry parts where there weren't any roots) and put the plants in slightly larger pots and used the Fox Farm based soil mix. The plants didn't die, so that's encouraging.

The Black Jack plants are in their final 7-gallon fabric pots. They look healthy. They have been topped. I've also been trimming fan leaves that block light from reaching lower branches. They seem to be growing better now that they're in the big pots. They're not using much water, though.

 

[Zen_Seeker]

Missed your posts. Glad your back. 👍

 

[Zen_Seeker]

I have trouble starting in pre-veg or veg before flower.

Clones are easy but seeds I’m about 75% these days. Including veggies.

Once you find your rhythm it will click.

Now deficiencies...that can be a bitc...you get it. 🤣

Have a great day.

 

[PipeCarver]

I have trouble starting in pre-veg or veg before flower.

Clones are easy but seeds I’m about 75% these days. Including veggies.

Once you find your rhythm it will click.

Now deficiencies...that can be a bitc...you get it. 🤣

Have a great day.

Hey, I don't know if this will help you with your sprouts or not but here goes. Once I have a tail on my seeds 1-2" long I saturate a solo cup filled 2/3 with promix then poke a hole, put the tail down with head above the soil, tap it to secure and keep the cup off the light in my veg closet 2-3 ft away from my T5 lights about [email protected]% I don't need to water again for 4-5 days and I water gently with a turkey baster around the sprout, not on it after the next watering they'll get transplanted up. If the seeds pop I'm 100% getting them to grow.

 

[Zen_Seeker]

Hey, I don't know if this will help you with your sprouts or not but here goes. Once I have a tail on my seeds 1-2" long I saturate a solo cup filled 2/3 with promix then poke a hole, put the tail down with head above the soil, tap it to secure and keep the cup off the light in my veg closet 2-3 ft away from my T5 lights about [email protected]% I don't need to water again for 4-5 days and I water gently with a turkey baster around the sprout, not on it after the next watering they'll get transplanted up. If the seeds pop I'm 100% getting them to grow.

Something similar to my tomato? Ignore the clones. I just can’t toss some branches. 🤣

I drill four holes in a “+” and then one in the middle of the clear cups we get from McDs. Then put in red cup.

Tomato or pepper is the one with the shell stuck. 🤦

 

[PipeCarver]

Something similar to my tomato? Ignore the clones. I just can’t toss some branches. 🤣

View attachment 1352747

I drill four holes in a “+” and then one in the middle of the clear cups we get from McDs. Then put in red cup.

Tomato or pepper is the one with the shell stuck. 🤦

a drop of water on the shell will help loosen it up and repeat as needed until it comes off

 

[BigBlonde]

Missed your posts. Glad your back. 👍

Thank you! I appreciate it. I've had some health issues.

The plants are doing better.

The Black Jacks are at day 82 and they're still small while looking healthy. I have been trimming them to encourage branching. They're very different-looking plants. The smaller one has been weird from the beginning. It split into two stems above the cotyledons, so it's shorter. I trimmed the space between the stems for light and air flow. Both plants are in 7-gallon pots. I've been increasing the light intensity. The plants are not using much water

I solved the problem with the Amnesia Haze. Both seedlings started growing well after I moved them to slightly larger pots and used my soil mix instead of that commercial potting soil that I tried for the first time. It was supposed to be good for starting seeds and it worked okay for tomatoes, peppers and basil, but it sure didn't work for cannabis. I'm sure the cannabis plants couldn't establish their roots.