Grow diary mission impossible (low to medium budget lol)

[MartyMcFly42oh]

Found this article:

Earth Tubes: How To Build A Low Cost System To Passively Heat and Cool Your Home For Free

When we build our pole barn house we know we want to put in Radiant floor heating to heat our home but haven’t decided on how we want to cool the house. So I have been researching the best op…

milligansganderhillfarm.wordpress.com

 

[Grownsince95]

I'm a youtube guy. if it's on there on how to do something. i'll give it a go. it has to be something sensible and not some silly gadget lol

I never even thought about a closed loop but then I found this dude on you tube!! Gives a really good assessment and even mentions greenhouses!

 

[BearWater]

I know where you are coming from, trust me. I live in a mobile home with an added four season porch , that in the infinite wisdom of the original builder wasn’t insulated. The temperature differential is extreme in the summer and winter months 10-20 degrees warmer and cooler in respective terms. This creates a giant heat sink in the summer that is a major bitch to deal with. I have to balance human and pet comforts with the environment in my grow room, which regularly exceeds 90-95 degrees daily. Running an air conditioner isn’t an option in that room because of the load it places on the circuit breaker.
So I’ve learned techniques to get around these situations, one thing that I hadn’t mentioned is having the lights off during the day here it’s at the hottest 1pm-6pm after that the suns no longer beating directly on the house.
I like the idea of a cool air intake by burying the inlet ducts, it’s a low cost solution to getting cool fresh air, more labor intensive than anything. I would recommend using a galvanized stove pipe and some sort of intake inline fan.
With a high mounted exhaust fan.

Yeah dude thats an extreme case of necessity is the mother of all inventions right there! It’s making me think I may be able to get through the summer! Not sure if you follow Cbrian or not but he pushes his plants to the ABSOLUTE brink and beyond in his green house! : ) if i could get enough air flow from under the shed/ground pretty sure that would be cool enough! Only a few times a year do we ever hit 100 or more up here, and like i said for better or worse I’ve got shade from pines.

And thank you for the link to the earth pipe! (Didn’t catch the title just saw the link/ pic lol)

 

[BearWater]

I never even thought about a closed loop but then I found this dude on you tube!! Gives a really good assessment and even mentions greenhouses!

Really liking the idea of this! Between getting something under the shed and quite possibly buried also I could use this! Power consumption alone would make it worth the effort and cost in materials! As of now I’ll put my “it’s too hot” theory on the side line and get hopeful again! Still going to try and get the AC going properly but dropping 4-6 hundred for a new unit of any kind is out of the question. So back up will be absolutely be needed if im going to keep it going enough to finish my currently planned next run.
Thank you for sharing!

 

[BearWater]

I never even thought about a closed loop but then I found this dude on you tube!! Gives a really good assessment and even mentions greenhouses!

Wondering if you could use this in conjunction with with a ac unit (in my shed situation) I’m thinking the heat produced from the lighting may need the help from the ac? Thats my thought, I dont know jack F all about thermo/thermal anything hahaha!

Adding this is an open question and not only directed at G95 : )

 

[BearWater]

Found this article:

Earth Tubes: How To Build A Low Cost System To Passively Heat and Cool Your Home For Free

When we build our pole barn house we know we want to put in Radiant floor heating to heat our home but haven’t decided on how we want to cool the house. So I have been researching the best op…

milligansganderhillfarm.wordpress.com

This is a good read! A must if one is serious about doing the pipes. As you suggested so did someone in the comments of that link. And making a space for condensation!? Would have never even considered that, and what needs to happen under ground with the pipe.

 

[BearWater]

Haha, neat!

 

[TheGoldenRoad]

Dude no snow! it went from almost 80 back to 40 real quick though hahahah! It’s looking wet and cool for the next week and a half, though we all know how that can change : )

Man it hit somewhere. I haven’t checked the flow rates or the lake level but we are losing real estate quick. Everyone camps along the shores for the 4th of July and a couple of years ago, the lake was at capacity which meant a ton of the campsites were submerged. It’s looking the same this year and we are going to have a bigger fireworks display Glad I’m not a tourist!

 

[MartyMcFly42oh]

This is a good read! A must if one is serious about doing the pipes. As you suggested so did someone in the comments of that link. And making a space for condensation!? Would have never even considered that, and what needs to happen under ground with the pipe.

It made me reconsider my comment about galvanized stove pipe, but if you used a good pitch it could still be feasible. I think air flow and cooling would be best achieved with metal vs plastic but the condensation factor would have to be addressed. You don’t want to introduce dirty air into the shed. Maybe a hepa filter would be helpful.

 

[MartyMcFly42oh]

Hey at least you are recognizing the issues before your fully involved in them, preemptive action vs reactive action is almost always better. Prepare for the worst and expect the worst, then the best is always better than the best it’s the bestest!!

 

[BearWater]

Man it hit somewhere. I haven’t checked the flow rates or the lake level but we are losing real estate quick. Everyone camps along the shores for the 4th of July and a couple of years ago, the lake was at capacity which meant a ton of the campsites were submerged. It’s looking the same this year and we are going to have a bigger fireworks display Glad I’m not a tourist!

Being married to a nurse prior to my short career on the ambulance you learn to miss the holidays LOL! Now I hate doing things on the weekends and try to avoid major holiday events as crowds just aren’t fun for me anymore. we have access to a pretty special place not far from our house that accommodates us nicely : )

 

[TheGoldenRoad]

Wondering if you could use this in conjunction with with a ac unit (in my shed situation) I’m thinking the heat produced from the lighting may need the help from the ac? Thats my thought, I dont know jack F all about thermo/thermal anything hahaha!

Adding this is an open question and not only directed at G95 : )

It’s way too long for me to explain on here but what you want to search to understand how a structure functions is “thermodynamics.”

If you read a bit about it, you’ll get a better understanding for how a building’s envelope functions. You’ll also come to understand what you can add and remove to make your structure function better and more efficiently.

 

[BearWater]

It made me reconsider my comment about galvanized stove pipe, but if you used a good pitch it could still be feasible. I think air flow and cooling would be best achieved with metal vs plastic but the condensation factor would have to be addressed. You don’t want to introduce dirty air into the shed. Maybe a hepa filter would be helpful.

I get weird tid bits in my head and then have to run with those! Im stuck on the rock at the bottom of the trench and the drain hole or whatever in the pipe itself. not in a bad way either! that for some reason is what I’m most interested in doing

 

[Cannacraze]

I never even thought about a closed loop but then I found this dude on you tube!! Gives a really good assessment and even mentions greenhouses!

back in 1991 the saudi's built some underground bunkers. they had the Tab-vee then underground housing and it would 115 degrees outside but inside the housing it was a nice 68-72 degrees. they had used the underground air sytems. i would think this would be be good to do.

 

[BearWater]

“thermodynamics.”

Thats the word! Hahah! Thank you : ) I’ll be looking into some of this. Feel like it could me with not chasing my tail in a circle, im pretty good at that!

 

[TheGoldenRoad]

Thats the word! Hahah! Thank you : ) I’ll be looking into some of this. Feel like it could me with not chasing my tail in a circle, im pretty good at that!

I sent you a DM.

 

[Grownsince95]

It's all about using materials that conduct heat well like @MartyMcFly42oh said and dealing with condensation. I noticed in that guy's video he mentioned using bigger pipe and this struck me as counterintuitive. The ratio of pipe to air seemed important for heat transfer and just off the top of my head I assumed there would be more air/pipe the bigger you got.

I'm not good at the maths so I had to turn to chatGPT for help. After a few minutes of asking it badly worded questions we arrived at this:

So at 4" pipe diameter the ratio of pipe surface to air volume is 1:1 and at 2" it's 1:2.

According to the math and my understanding of it a smaller diameter pipe should increase cooling efficiency based on how conduction works. 3" ducting that is readily available sounds perfect for the job.

 

[TheGoldenRoad]

It made me reconsider my comment about galvanized stove pipe, but if you used a good pitch it could still be feasible. I think air flow and cooling would be best achieved with metal vs plastic but the condensation factor would have to be addressed. You don’t want to introduce dirty air into the shed. Maybe a hepa filter would be helpful.

A good way to combat condensation is to make a sediment filter. Where the pipe is going to go upwards into the structure, you want to make a “T” connection versus using an elbow. Connect a 6” piece of pipe to create a drop on the bottom of the junction. Any condensed moisture will fall to the bottom and evaporate slowly instead of being sucked upwards.

 

[BearWater]

It's all about using materials that conduct heat well like @MartyMcFly42oh said and dealing with condensation. I noticed in that guy's video he mentioned using bigger pipe and this struck me as counterintuitive. The ratio of pipe to air seemed important for heat transfer and just off the top of my head I assumed there would be more air/pipe the bigger you got.

I'm not good at the maths so I had to turn to chatGPT for help. After a few minutes of asking it badly worded questions we arrived at this:
View attachment 2404106
So at 4" pipe diameter the ratio of pipe surface to air volume is 1:1 and at 2" it's 1:2.

According to the math and my understanding of it a smaller diameter pipe should increase cooling efficiency based on how conduction works. 3" ducting that is readily available sounds perfect for the job.

This where I have to figure it out! My thought was inline with what you are thinking. If you have a huge volume of air its going to take more to cool it (thats the very un common sense I have) there is some crazy equations so ill have to dust off the pipe fitters calculator! im not that smart, im just freaking tenacious

 

[MartyMcFly42oh]

A good way to combat condensation is to make a sediment filter. Where the pipe is going to go upwards into the structure, you want to make a “T” connection versus using an elbow. Connect a 6” piece of pipe to create a drop on the bottom of the junction. Any condensed moisture will fall to the bottom and evaporate slowly instead of being sucked upwards.

As long as you can prevent standing water, don’t want to get Legionaries disease or anything else that can mess up the grow