HELP - 1st time growing in DWC = Multiple mixed signals issues.

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PK1

PK1

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these enzymes are used after you ph the water. So, 1st nutrients, then ph, then enzyme. Unless, you have to ad cal/mag and or other shit which then im not the guy to ask what goes in 1st. lol
I think RO needs Cal/Mag but im not sure.
 
PK1

PK1

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Noted.
I really do appreciate you all taking your own time and replying. Hopefully i can help back one day.

The rockwool thing got me worried then, it makes sense that the roots pulls minerals bottom up, and all this residues gets stuck in the rockwool, which at this point god knows at what PH and ppm it is sitting at also nutrient uptake will pass through rockwool everytime, and there is not ever a doward flow (but gravity) from rockwool back to solution. Does that sound correct?
i don't get what you mean. For now just dump some of the rez water from top so the rockwool gets back to the proper range. That should help the plant get back on track or if you have a small pump then you can connect a hose to it and have it on 1 min intervals for every couple hours to drop some rez water to the top.
 
labomba

labomba

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Little update, one previous plant ive transfered from bucket to a small spare pot with soil i had (rockwool also planted with it) and watered once translanted with the same dwc solution she was in and left her with other plants by a window, barely getting any light. The plant is getting greener, opposed to the bucket ones even though ive ripped most of its roots when removing from pebbles. Can this be ''overwatering"?
Ive got nearly 5L per min of air being pumped in each bucket

Pictures taken 4 to 5 days after transplant
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1650837843474
 
PK1

PK1

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that soil is too compact. you should mix it with something to allow better water penetration
also, since the plants where hydroponic their roots are set for that. Now that they are in soil there going to need some time to redevelop. Better be ready for a long hault.
Also also, never change your plant in soil into hydroponic. That just asks for heaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaadache
 
PK1

PK1

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you are also making the nooooobst mistakes. go smoke a joint and listen to this song
Stop fingering it and wait until you get your third bottle.
 
labomba

labomba

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looool im not actually trying to do anything with that one in soil, ive just placed there cause was either there or the bin, im impressed she even survived.
 
smokedareefer

smokedareefer

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Good day Y'all.
About 4 weeks ago I've started growing in DWC and so far, pretty much nothing has worked as expected.
I have germinated 5 seeds with few days difference in between them just so I could correct issues that showed up on the first plants, all of them went on serious issues within the first 2 weeks, my last seedling came out decent but now is experiencing necrosis, tip curl and few burn. So for I will focus on the last one for now.

For starters, the set up:
Light: 2x Samsung LM301H 3500k +660nm +UV +IR (measuring by lux where the sun is 80k, ive started them out at 12k lux and slowlay increased to what is around 20-22k)
Water: Tap aired out coming out at around 130ppm
Temperature: 21 - 26 c
5gl Buckets (only 3.5 filled)
PPM: set at around 480 (2ml cal/mag + 7.5 GHmicro (Hardwater) + 15 GHbloom (Lucas))
Humidity always around 50-60%
PH: checked daily and kept on the 5.6 - 6.1 range, very rarely drifiting and needing adjustment.
Some H202 added and rez change recently as some slime showed up.
Clay pebbles and rockwool medium
Plenty of bubbles 24/7
2-3" distance from water to net cup

This should cover most of the techs.
Now to the fun part, EVERY plant has showed mixed signs. My first seedlings were germinated and planted in rockwool placed inside a bag for humidity, they developed very slowly. Opposed to my last 2 seeds, which had spent 2 weeks in a heated chamber and they sprouted MUCH quicker than the first ones. I've watered them with plain water for start and after couple set of fan leaves showed up, I started watering the rockwools with a solution around 400ppm (140 from tap) but only around 20mls of solution to each plant.

They all look okay until they are put into their buckets.
My first ones after only couple of days starting showing signs of what it seems to be overwatering, Very pale, broopy leaves and some tip burns that are eating the plant from bottom up, which tells me could be some sort of deficiency, but I don't think they would be showing deficiencies within couple of weeks of sprouting, its got to be something else. Overfeeding? possible, but Im going very conservative on nutes, even flushed one of them and introduced to a 350ppm but there was no development.
Since i've increased lights, ppm's are increasing, but I believe its from evaporation rather than a tiny plant with couple leaves leeching 50+ ppm within 24 hours.

View attachment 1238671View attachment 1238672

This one is my #4, was the best looking but started showing brown spots, looking like necrosis, leafes turning yellow and a slight tip burn with it curling up, the new leaves growing don't look bad but my guess is that they will be soon.

This one and my previous ones, were all in the same environment and taking pretty much similar feeding and etc...
But the issues the previous ones showed were much severe, from week 2 leaves were dying, deformed, no coloration at all, despite having a nice long root string already in water. Ill post couple of their pictures as I think despite looking different, the issues are stemming from the same trigger, which i can't pinpoint.



This here is #1 and #2, #1 roots hit water pretty quickly and they are just over a week older than 4# but they never actually got to grow, very stunted with.... well you can see the pictures:
View attachment 1238673View attachment 1238674


Can anyone help pinpoint an issue here?
I'm very suspect of my tap water (140ppm) but i've seen people using much worse stuff and not getting into problems as early as i did. I did however ordered an RO system which won't be here for another 2 weeks.
I live at an odd spot in Europe and much of the water used here is from rain collection/ RO or desalination.

I have no idea of calcium or mg levels, just that ppm is always around 120-150. I haven't fed the first one no calmag at all and they all ran into problems, added a bit of cal mag to them but it surely did not help.

#4 looks a lot like a phosprus deficiency but again, im unsure this should be happening at this age especially using Lucas Formula, there should be plenty of it. A consideration is that calcium and phosphorus act together inside a plant, so maybe an imbalance there?

At this point i can't even pinpoint if its a mobile or immobile nute doing this as the first plants showed issues from the bottom up wheres my #4 the issues were more porminent in the younger set of leaves.
As a fact ill only keep the #4 for now, as looks it can be saved, but with the others since they will die i can use for experiments to try narrow down my issue.
Get rid of the foil covering the pellets.

I've read it causes "hot spots
 
S

sagadella

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To keep your temps down make sure your air pump is outside the room in a cool area. It will chill the water. You can also wrap a bath towel around your bucket for insulation. Both are quick and easy methods. Most people who grow using sterile methods run a chiller and keep their temps at 68.

Id recommend using hydroguard instead of h202 since its cheaper than a water chiller.

With both methods you can fully submerge your rockwool once enough have broken through. Your air gap since your not chilled is pretty warm. So in my eyes I see just a little bit of root mass under water, then those nutrients have to travel up through a hot zone with slime and h202 attacking the roots. I would dunk them. Ive been on rdwc for over a year and i never leave an air gap. Not to mention rockwool is not suppose to be used as wicking. The unused nutrients that travel up it get trapped. The ppms in the cube will become higher overtime if its not submerged in mixing water.

As for your nutrient blend. . i cant really aid on that. You need someone like runs sterile systems, but they wont like your water temps.

If I were at your spot i would be using .7ml per gallon of micro grow and bloom. And 1.1ml of calmag per gallon. Idk how you can grow in veg using the trio series without the grow bottle. The grow bottle is what you should be using the most of right now and you say you dont have it. Again i dont understand how jacks 321 works, but I thought it used epsom salt and was for coco methods. Most hydro nutrients are not as thick.

Again I hope something I said aids you. Give it time and im sure others will help.
You just nailed my experience with using a flood/drain system with 4" rock wool cubes.
I'm having to flush excess nutrients from the cube to keep the plants alive now! Awkward, time consuming and it will never be repeated! Interested in going DWS now- just looking for the best method based on my conditions and available equipment.
 
ninjadip

ninjadip

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Good stuff, Im using these exact two, (Micro Hardwater and Bloom)View attachment 1238733
On bucket size, i've got two type of buckets, one shorter and wider, and a longer, which feels a lot more stable and easy to handle (the one on root picture), i'll eventually swap the others too.

Re my water, i live in an island surronded by sea, suppliers say its a mix of well and desalinated, spoke to local growers and some said that due to filtering process ther is little cal and mag in the water, which aligns with Cashmeh thoughts, either way, an RO system is arriving in couple of weeks, it will give me a lot more feeding control, but until then my focus will be saving #4, I do think my tap is underpinning the failures despite 140ppm not sounding bad, tho people use 250+ water and don't run into issues as early as I did.
Is it possible that from my 140ppm none of it is actual Cal/Mag?

Re Canna, thanks for the advice, i will get the green bottle and give a go. I must be paranoid thinking its the nutes brand, they are used and proofed extensively.

PK1 what are your enzymes? Summers get to 35/40 c easily in here, plus the lights, i can totally see them black buckets reaching melting point. Good colonies seem a smarter way to fight water temps than manual work, my air pump stay outside tent and there is a fan blowing the tubes and buckets directly to help cooldown but it dont seem enough now let alone further down the road.

Thanks all
Yeah it's doable even with heat to have a successful dwc without a chiller or running sterile. My buckets water is dangerously high, 80-82 during summer. Now I'm not near as experienced as these other guys, but just want to let you know it's doable.

You asked about alternatives to hydroguard. My last run I used southern ag family fungicide, it's almost dangerously over concentrated, only had to add once at beginning.

This run I'm using TPS billions, which I believe is a great white alternative, which is working for me with terrible tap water and high temps. Seems to have taken 2-3 weeks to establish/colonize.

One really good tip I got from @Aqua Man was to innoculate your grow rocks/media after you have good bennies by running some of that colonized res water over your media at least once a week if seeing problems, but very important to do it at least once in the beginning.
 
ninjadip

ninjadip

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that soil is too compact. you should mix it with something to allow better water penetration
also, since the plants where hydroponic their roots are set for that. Now that they are in soil there going to need some time to redevelop. Better be ready for a long hault.
Also also, never change your plant in soil into hydroponic. That just asks for heaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaadache
I wish I would have came here months before I started to grow to have possibly avoided some of my own noob mistakes, not that I still don't make them lol I'm still a new guy to this.
@PK1 I did exactly what you said not to.. and you are def right. I was gifted some babies in soil, and I was gifted this aerogarden like thing for my wedding. So idiot me decides to transfer soil to hydro. I had more headaches than I had Tylenol lol. It worked out in the end, but was a very bumpy road in beginning.
 
Electrolights

Electrolights

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Enzymes isn’t ideal in a res from my own experience unless you use it a few days before changing the res, I used both z7 and cannazym, they end up leaving the roots they broke down sitting in your res, earth worm casting, bacillus, and mycorrhizae will kill the slime, slime I’ve noticed for me wasn’t just Pythium, once I started top feeding/inoculating from the top it let’s you control the slime above the water level as well
 
ninjadip

ninjadip

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263
Enzymes isn’t ideal in a res from my own experience unless you use it a few days before changing the res, I used both z7 and cannazym, they end up leaving the roots they broke down sitting in your res, earth worm casting, bacillus, and mycorrhizae will kill the slime, slime I’ve noticed for me wasn’t just Pythium, once I started top feeding/inoculating from the top it let’s you control the slime above the water level as well
Nice, I only top feed the first two weeks to get the top half inoculated.
This run, I have a few new variables being added, so I'm not sure which one is doing it, but I have absolutely zero slime in between changes now. It's beautiful, and the plants are doing great. I am really on board with TPS billions.

Just looked up canazyme and can't find a scientific breakdown of what's inside, it seems to be a secret.

Fyi here is tps billions breakdown
 
Screenshot 20221016 0800032

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