Ice Ice Baby growing for fun.

[Roxyheart420]

Good morning THC Farmers. I am considered a new grower because I'm only on my 3rd run at the moment. I love growing and yes my first run was a breeze and everything came out amazing. I bought some clones which I was told they were SFV OG and after the run we realized they were Cookies. LOL It wasn't funny that I was told one thing and they turned out to be something else, however they came out awesome. I got 2 lbs per light the first run. There is a problem with that however. I thought what's the big deal about growing this is so easy! haha Then it happened my 2nd run, and my 3rd... problems.
I grow in Soil ( Ocean Forest) for Veg and Happy Frog for flower. My veg girls are under T5's and my flower is switched into 1000wt HPS lights.
I use Heavy16 for all my nutrients.
The 2nd run I did I battled with a little nut burn because I used the wrong soil for flower. I got the wrong information and bought Ocean Forest soil for my flower side. UGH! The soil was tooo HOT. I only came out with 1.3lb per light the 2nd run. Nugs were small. Wasn't happy.
Then I decided to switch up strains and purchase some Purple Punch clones. I'm here in Los Angeles and I was super unhappy with the very expensive PP I bought. (14.00 a clone) I bought 45 and within 5 days they started dying out. I was able to save around 20. I called the company I bought them from and they said they have a 2 day policy for exchange or refund. Such bullshit! So I bought 25 more from All Star Clones and they are awesome. Lesson learned on buying clones from the internet.
So, on that note. I'm here for some help. The 20 I saved are doing really bad. I'm thinking they are just bad genetics now. They are dying from the bottom up. The tops look amazing. But slowly but surly they are dying leaf by leaf. I took the worst one and pulled it out and dissected the roots. After 6 weeks the roots looked very small. No root rot, no bugs, no mold, just very small root ball. Here are all the levels. Water ph going in 7.5 water ph run off 5.6 My ppm going in 1500 ppm coming out 2200-2600 This is where it gets tricky. Ocean Forest has a run off of roughly 900-1000 ppm run off all alone. So how do you know what are good ppm and what's not good. After 6 weeks I took that bad plant put it in a bowl added water until it was able to give me a ppm reading, it was 800ppm
So there you have it, new grower looking for some answers haha I laugh because when I read all the threads there are 5 different answers to the one questions. To bad there wasn't a Cannabis Doctor LOL
How cool would that be? Take your plant in for a diagnosis.
Any help would be super welcomed! Thank you

 

[Beachwalker]

"Water ph going in 7.5 water ph run off 5.6 My ppm going in 1500 ppm coming out 2200-2600"

Your problem is likely related to your above sentence; could you include some pictures

 

[Roxyheart420]

Here are 4 photos. You can see how the bottom is dying out on some, look at the tops at how awesome they are but then there's a few leafs in between dying..Same everything, it just seems like the genetics are terrible on some. If that's not it I'm at a lose.

 

[Beachwalker]

You're over-watering &/or keeping them too wet; Adjust your pH to 6.5 and stop feeding them nutes. Consider adding 20 - 25% perlite to the ffof soil next time

 

[Roxyheart420]

You're over-watering &/ keeping them too wet; Adjust your pH to 6.5 and stop feeding them nutes now

So adjust my water going in to 6.5ph and stop feeding them. I just did a big flush with Enzymes and Sea Green. I'll let them dry out. However, I have never been one for over watering. On the 3rd day I will put my moisture meter in and if it says moist I will wait a day. Most people go by how heavy the pot is, I go by my meter. Even when I was letting them dry out this was happening. I have been fighting this since clone days.

 

[Beachwalker]

Your perlite suggests over-watering and or keeping it too wet

adjust pH of everything going in to 6.5

Stop feeding; Fox Farm ocean Forest has plenty of newts for plants that size for 4 - 6 weeks and you're feeding much too strong a ppm anyway, try half what the label says when you eventually start feeding again

Follow these above steps & watch the new growth, it should get better

Eventually start to feed at half strength

and stop Flushing

 

[Roxyheart420]

Hi @Beachwalker, thank you for your replie. Here is something interesting that I'm not sure if everyone knows. I did an experiment last night. I tested the water before putting in any nutrients, my ph was 7.4 I then added my Heavy16 nutrients and tested the water again. The ph came out at 6.5. Therefore phing my water to 6.5 before adding will then lower the ph to low at watering time. Therefore it doesn't look as though the PH is the issue here.
Next, after my flush I let dry out (really dry out) added a small amount of nutrients, did this twice already and the same results as before. Lower leafs are drying up and falling off. They veg plants are now tall with very little leaves. For purple punch this is weird considering they are suppose to be bushy plants. I'm at a loose here on what's happening.

 

[az2000]

my first run was a breeze and everything came out amazing.
my 2nd run, and my 3rd... problems.

From your other thread, (<<link) it sounds like you're frustrated with some of the help you've received. I hope I don't add to that.

Did anything change between your 1st and 2nd grows? (Anything? at all?). It's really hard to believe everything was good, and then went bad, because of bad karma or something. (wink). There must be some explanation in there. Something must be different.

I grow in Soil ( Ocean Forest) for Veg and Happy Frog for flower.

My veg girls are under T5's and my flower is switched into 1000wt HPS lights.

The photos suggest you're still under T5? Is that T5HO? Have you replaced your tubes? They lose intensity after they're used awhile. But, in veg I wouldn't think that would matter much. 2000 hours is a good time to replace.

Similar thought: how many hours does your HPS bulb have on it?

Are the strains taller than your first grow? Fluorescent light doesn't have great penetration. When I used it for a taller grow, I had a lot of leaf loss around the bottom as the plants entered transition/flower.

I bought 45 clones and within 5 days they started dying out.

I'm confused about which soil you're using. You said you use hot Ocean Forest in veg, and low-nute Happy Frog in flower. It seems like that would be hard to know when to feed, or to have uniform nutrient strength at the roots (some would be hot?).

Did you do this the first time you grew (when things turned out happily)? Like @Beachwalker said, if you're growing in fresh OF soil, I think feeding a full-strength "lineup" would be too much.

I think your problem is with lighting. Your plants don't look bad. They don't look overfed to me. In your other post, you said it's just the lower growth dying which concerns you. I think that's relatively normal, especially with light that isn't high intensity (like T5HO, and especially T5 without the HO part).

But, that wouldn't explain why so many clones died so quickly.

 

[Roxyheart420]

From your other thread, (<<link) it sounds like you're frustrated with some of the help you've received. I hope I don't add to that.

Did anything change between your 1st and 2nd grows? (Anything? at all?). It's really hard to believe everything was good, and then went bad, because of bad karma or something. (wink). There must be some explanation in there. Something must be different.

I grow in Soil ( Ocean Forest) for Veg and Happy Frog for flower.


The photos suggest you're still under T5? Is that T5HO? Have you replaced your tubes? They lose intensity after they're used awhile. But, in veg I wouldn't think that would matter much. 2000 hours is a good time to replace.

Similar thought: how many hours does your HPS bulb have on it?

Are the strains taller than your first grow? Fluorescent light doesn't have great penetration. When I used it for a taller grow, I had a lot of leaf loss around the bottom as the plants entered transition/flower.



I'm confused about which soil you're using. You said you use hot Ocean Forest in veg, and low-nute Happy Frog in flower. It seems like that would be hard to know when to feed, or to have uniform nutrient strength at the roots (some would be hot?).

Did you do this the first time you grew (when things turned out happily)? Like @Beachwalker said, if you're growing in fresh OF soil, I think feeding a full-strength "lineup" would be too much.

I think your problem is with lighting. Your plants don't look bad. They don't look overfed to me. In your other post, you said it's just the lower growth dying which concerns you. I think that's relatively normal, especially with light that isn't high intensity (like T5HO, and especially T5 without the HO part).

But, that wouldn't explain why so many clones died so quickly.

Thank you for your reply. No, it's not confusing haha it is frustrating. So, the photos I posted were from my veg cycle when I was under T5's I didn't get a new photo in flower because at the time of post this is all I had. Sorry for that confusion. I was in Ocean at Veg under T5's now I re-potted into 7 gal using Happy Frog under HPS 1000wts lights. I only have 1 grow of hrs on my bulbs. My first run came out awesome. Got 2.3 lbs per light. Using about 3/4 strength of the heavy16 line. The second run I messed up on my soil and used Ocean Forest which I know now is very hot, and I used full strength Heavy16, so I had a few issues there but still came out 1.8lb per light. I'm only in my 2nd week of flower but if I could somehow help 20 out of 45 plants that would be awesome. The other 25 came from different nursery. I bought 45 at first 25 went bad, bought 20 more hoping I could help the one I had left that didn't completely die. (speaking clones, and early teens)

 

[Evr1sFavKush]

You ever seen what the early onset of russet mites looks like? You definitely got a few of the symptoms and a matching back story: 1 good grow. 2 failed grows back to back. Quick leaf death starting from the bottom. Deficiencies you can’t seem to remedy. Started after picking up the 2nd batch of clones and now can’t seem to reign it in on the third.

This looks very similar to me. I would scope for russets on leaf petioles and undersides of the leafs about half way up. Ones that are just starting to show problems are your target areas. I would rule this out 110% before I did anything else cause it’s posible you’re just chasing your tail with deficiencies.

Again NOT saying you have them, but it’s something you REALLY need to check off the diagnostics list in my opinion. You shouldn’t need that much food to keep a green plant especially in soil.

 

[Jack og]

I’m getting a sense that I’ve read this same post elsewhere???? But that NUT burn... lol, sorry I had to read it again.
I think the other thread you have has it covered as to your issues and solution. Great input @Evr1sFavKush about checking for russets.

 

[Roxyheart420]

Your perlite suggests over-watering and or keeping it too wet

adjust pH of everything going in to 6.5

Stop feeding; Fox Farm ocean Forest has plenty of newts for plants that size for 4 - 6 weeks and you're feeding much too strong a ppm anyway, try half what the label says when you eventually start feeding again

Follow these above steps & watch the new growth, it should get better

Eventually start to feed at half strength

and stop Flushing

Beachwalker, it was russet mites or broad mites I have. That is the problem. Thank you for all your suggestions. I'm sure if I didn't have these little fuckers what you suggested would of helped.

 

[Evr1sFavKush]

Zing! I knew it.

Sulfur at 3 TABLESPOONS per gallon or 2 and 1/4 TEASPOONS per 32oz spray bottle.

Spray every other day for 3 weeks and clone away from the moms ASAP. Do not keep the moms or original soil. Use rockwool cubes. Do not get sulfur run off into your soil or cloning medium. You will get lock out of iron.

Heat room up to 120F for 1 hour after your plants are clean.

It’s a long process to ensure they don’t come back. They can live for 21 days with a food source.

 

[Roxyheart420]

Thank you so much for that. I was killing myself lookin

Zing! I knew it.

Sulfur at 3 TABLESPOONS per gallon or 2 and 1/4 TEASPOONS per 32oz spray bottle.

Spray every other day for 3 weeks and clone away from the moms ASAP. Do not keep the moms or original soil. Use rockwool cubes. Do not get sulfur run off into your soil or cloning medium. You will get lock out of iron.

Heat room up to 120F for 1 hour after your plants are clean.

It’s a long process to ensure they don’t come back. They can live for 21 days with a food source.

Thank you so much for that. I was killing myself looking for the solution. BTW, the whole crop is gone. All 42 plants had them and they were just getting worse by the day. I started green cleaner, Azamax, sulfer... I would rather take the hit and start over fresh & clean and chalk it up as a learning lesson, rather than get shitty buds and not be able to sell any. I have a professional pest control that is very knowledgeable about spraying cannabis rooms. Everything is out so I can spray and never let that happen again, or try really really hard. LOL

 

[Roxyheart420]

Quick question

Zing! I knew it.

Sulfur at 3 TABLESPOONS per gallon or 2 and 1/4 TEASPOONS per 32oz spray bottle.

Spray every other day for 3 weeks and clone away from the moms ASAP. Do not keep the moms or original soil. Use rockwool cubes. Do not get sulfur run off into your soil or cloning medium. You will get lock out of iron.

Heat room up to 120F for 1 hour after your plants are clean.

It’s a long process to ensure they don’t come back. They can live for 21 days with a food source.

quick

Zing! I knew it.

Sulfur at 3 TABLESPOONS per gallon or 2 and 1/4 TEASPOONS per 32oz spray bottle.

Spray every other day for 3 weeks and clone away from the moms ASAP. Do not keep the moms or original soil. Use rockwool cubes. Do not get sulfur run off into your soil or cloning medium. You will get lock out of iron.

Heat room up to 120F for 1 hour after your plants are clean.

It’s a long process to ensure they don’t come back. They can live for 21 days with a food source.

Quick question. I will be getting some new clones here pretty soon. Can I do sulfer dips with them? They come in rockwool, therefore just take the stem and dip the whole thing in sulfer and let dry? How do I keep the sulfer from running down the stem into the roots after the dip? Or should I just spray them really well? However spray or dip I'm concerned with the solution running into the rockwool. Make sense?

 

[Evr1sFavKush]

Quick question

quick

Quick question. I will be getting some new clones here pretty soon. Can I do sulfer dips with them? They come in rockwool, therefore just take the stem and dip the whole thing in sulfer and let dry? How do I keep the sulfer from running down the stem into the roots after the dip? Or should I just spray them really well? However spray or dip I'm concerned with the solution running into the rockwool. Make sense?

You can flush the sulfur mixture out of the cube if it gets in there. Just know that if you get yellowing at the very top of the plant and it’s an iron def it’s being caused by sulfur and not your nutes or anything else. Its easy to fix if it happens just gotta have your eyes open and catch it early cause it takes a minute for the green to return and iron deficiency will stunt you pretty good.

With sulfur you want to use “micronized sulfur” such as from Bonide. A small 3 gallon bucket is great for dipping. You want to make sure the sulfur is constantly agitated. When you dip the clones just let the mixture run off the plant while you hold it upside down and you should be good to go. Spraying it seems to be easier to contaminate the media.

With sulfur:
-spray or dip every other day for 3 weeks in an infested room. Do not skimp!
-if bringing home clones bring Tupperware or plastic bags and after spraying them toss them in the bags and take them home. Be aware of your hands and what you’re doing after touching new clones!
-don’t worry about leaf crinkling that can occur
-no oil dips/sprays!!! The rule is about 2 weeks pre or post sulfur, but to me I just don’t do them at all
-keep temps under 80F
-raise lights up a little bit or turn them down
-do not rinse off the sulfur after treatment let it sit there so any emerging russets have a horrible time navigating and do not rinse the main stem either to keep them from being able to come back up the plant from the soil (they are so small they get tossed around your room or tent very easily and you’re relying on residual sulfur to keep the contact kill going)

You got this. Don’t feel bad, this is the new norm in cannabis. The first time I got them in 2015 I had all the chems (including shit I had to have imported from Romania) and I ended up doing the same just tossed them in the trash. I didn’t wanna smoke flowers from those plants. The second time I got them it was a sulfur shower and that was it. You will probably be traumatized after this like most are but it’s ok! They are not impossible to get rid of and knowing how to treat incoming clones will be huuuge for you down the road in acquiring rare genetics.

“Elite clones come with elite problems!”

My friend passed this info down to me about the sulfur and it was 100% effective just by being diligent and methodical in treatment. Good luck!

 

[Jack og]

Or get a great knockdown product like green cleaner to kill those fuckers first. And it’s safe for young plants . Use that every other day for a month to ensure they gone, I rotate with azamax so that it doesn’t get resistant