Is this Phosphorous deficiency? Lime green growth, red/purple stems, bronze spots

[SamRD]

FML is all I can say.

Organic grow, switched to flowering 3 days ago. Everything had gone perfectly up until now. About a week or so ago all new growth is bright green, I notice bronze spots. Stems had been purple/red for a while but now it's extending to the middle of the leaf lines (I don't know what they are called). Growth has come to a sudden halt. I feel that months of work are about to go into the trash can.

My research indicates it's phosphorous deficiency. Can someone please help me out.

ps. Initially I thought it was N deficiency so I gave an organic plankton supplement that is high in N and it backfired and resulted in N tox. You can see the lower leaves are dark green, shiny and clawing. Plus slightly burned tips

 

[mysticepipedon]

The lower leaves are making me think phosphorus, but that doesn't explain the light green/yellow upper leaves. This might be a pH problem, affecting a number of nutrients.

What's the pH?

 

[SamRD]

The lower leaves are making me think phosphorus, but that doesn't explain the light green/yellow upper leaves. This might be a pH problem, affecting a number of nutrients.

What's the pH?

It's an organic grow, I don't ph water. I'll test the runoff next watering

 

[SamRD]

It's light bleaching

 

[RealizedReal000]

It’s possibly roots I would back off on the light or raise it up. Better high then low I say. Get a ph soil tester if your going organic. Will help a lot. Most people say they are dumb but i have only had positive experiences. Now if I could get a handle on the microscopic bugs on my next grow I would be golden. Lol

 

[RonnieB2nd]

I think you're over thinking it a bit. Could be ph my guess is lighting. How old is that plant. If its young its impossible to have a deficiency how old.?

 

[Dirtbag]

Organics gone sideways can be really hard to correct.
What are your lights on and off temperatures?
What is the organic soil made up of? Watering practices?

To me it looks like its not transpiring enough to draw up enough Calcium, and looks like its in a hot media so some other nutrients are getting locked up. The leaves shying away from the light indicates they can't use as much as you're giving them also, I'd back that off or turn it down a bit.

 

[RonnieB2nd]

Organics gone sideways can be really hard to correct.
What are your lights on and off temperatures?
What is the organic soil made up of? Watering practices?

To me it looks like its not transpiring enough to draw up enough Calcium, and looks like its in a hot media so some other nutrients are getting locked up. The leaves shying away from the light indicates they can't use as much as you're giving them also, I'd back that off or turn it down a bit.

I didn't see it was 100% organic. My apologies. And hes right.

 

[Dirtbag]

Being mainlined I assume it's also quite an old plant? How many weeks veg to get to this point?

 

[FuriousStyles]

Looks like mag and phos issue. Both will have similar symptoms. Leaf turning yellow then turning brown at the end is a phos def symptom. Red stalks is usually mag but could be the phos def as well. Epsom salt mixed 1.5 tablespoon per gallon of water and whatever bloom top dress you're doing should fix it in about a week.

 

[ImpulsiveGrower]

Hit it with some Recharge to help regulate ph and give a top dress with some bloom.

 

[Aqua Man]

Your over watering which slow uptake of all the different deficiencies your seeing. Back the light off and let it dry out... the plants not taking up enough nutrients to support photosynthesis. When you see multiple deficiencies it's almost always a lockout or uptake issue.


Temp can also play a big role in this and to small point humidity. What are they?

 

[SamRD]

Your over watering which slow uptake of all the different deficiencies your seeing. Back the light off and let it dry out... the plants not taking up enough nutrients to support photosynthesis. When you see multiple deficiencies it's almost always a lockout or uptake issue.


Temp can also play a big role in this and to small point humidity. What are they?

Hit it with some Recharge to help regulate ph and give a top dress with some bloom.

Looks like mag and phos issue. Both will have similar symptoms. Leaf turning yellow then turning brown at the end is a phos def symptom. Red stalks is usually mag but could be the phos def as well. Epsom salt mixed 1.5 tablespoon per gallon of water and whatever bloom top dress you're doing should fix it in about a week.

Being mainlined I assume it's also quite an old plant? How many weeks veg to get to this point?

I didn't see it was 100% organic. My apologies. And hes right.

Organics gone sideways can be really hard to correct.
What are your lights on and off temperatures?
What is the organic soil made up of? Watering practices?

To me it looks like its not transpiring enough to draw up enough Calcium, and looks like its in a hot media so some other nutrients are getting locked up. The leaves shying away from the light indicates they can't use as much as you're giving them also, I'd back that off or turn it down a bit.

I think you're over thinking it a bit. Could be ph my guess is lighting. How old is that plant. If its young its impossible to have a deficiency how old.?

The lower leaves are making me think phosphorus, but that doesn't explain the light green/yellow upper leaves. This might be a pH problem, affecting a number of nutrients.

What's the pH?

Thank you all for the answers. I will try to answer all in one, so maybe you can help me figure out what the problem is. I also have new pictures to update the situation.

My soil is 50/50 FFOF and HF, mixed with 20% perlite, diatomaceous earth and the standard quantity of lime. I have only fed it with great white and molasses for the first 3 months and now only with recharge. I have a humboldts secret bottle laying around, thinking about alternating recharge with it. What happened was that I was told that my soil would run out of nutes in 3-4 weeks. It didn't, was perfect for many months without me adding any synthetic nutes so I just decided to continue organic until the end. One thing I'm thinking is maybe my soil run out of amendments which is why I'm getting problems.

I know for sure I am not overwatering, I'm very careful with it and only water when it's light and a slight droop in leaves. RH is around 40-45%. Temp is a little bit high during the day around 27-30C. I can't do anything about it because it's a closet grow and I can't add more tools to fix it. I raised the lights a bit but still not sure what to do about it. Wasn't that much. Is it enough? Does it need to be raised quite a bit more?

I have added a new layer of lime on top of the soil about a week ago. I have not tested ph yet, I have to do a water only feed next time to test.

Flowering started on day 21 of last month. A lot of yellowing going for the lower leaves since. Bright green continues and flowering progress seems to be slow too.

Also about the bloom top dress, can you recommend me something? From my own research I found this https://www.stepwellsoil.com/products/stepwell-soil-bloom-top-dressing?variant=32930517090444 Got to wait around a week to have it delivered to me

 

[SamRD]

One more thing, the purple color everywhere has increased a lot in the last month I think. I noticed it's going down the middle of the leaves. Not sure what that means.

 

[mancorn]

It’s not too difficult. Fox Farm soil is dirt. It’s like any other other dirt you buy, it’s DIRT. If you have really great dirt with tons of organic material, you can plant a garden and stuff will grow lush and green. If you have sandy or clay soil with little organic matter, and you don’t use fertilizers, your garden will be weak and pathetic. Almost all farmers use fertilizers in order to grow crops. Fox Farm isn’t magic dirt or living soil - it has some earthworm castings, bat guano, fish and crab meal. There’s no way you can expect a bag of FF dirt to supply nutrients for a cannabis plant, which are heavy feeders, beyond a seedling.

Great White and Recharge are not nutrients. They’re primarily mycorrhizal and beneficial bacteria and fungi, that live on organic matter, which has been depleted from your soil months ago. You have no food for the microorganisms, which in turn are supplying no food to your plants. No amount of lime (which is seriously missing with your pH), mycorrhizal (which are probably either dead before you apply or shortly there after), molasses (which is primarily used for ginger snaps, not plants), moving your lights up and down, turning up the AC or watering more or less is going to do diddly until you provide nutrients. Really your plants aren’t that different from you - sure it’s nice to crank up the heater on a cold day, but if you don’t have a grilled cheese sandwich and tomato soup, you’re going to die. You’d be better off with a box of Miracle Grow or pissing in a bucket of water, than using Great White or Recharge. For the love of God and all that is holy, feed your poor plants!

 

[SamRD]

It’s not too difficult. Fox Farm soil is dirt. It’s like any other other dirt you buy, it’s DIRT. If you have really great dirt with tons of organic material, you can plant a garden and stuff will grow lush and green. If you have sandy or clay soil with little organic matter, and you don’t use fertilizers, your garden will be weak and pathetic. Almost all farmers use fertilizers in order to grow crops. Fox Farm isn’t magic dirt or living soil - it has some earthworm castings, bat guano, fish and crab meal. There’s no way you can expect a bag of FF dirt to supply nutrients for a cannabis plant, which are heavy feeders, beyond a seedling.

Great White and Recharge are not nutrients. They’re primarily mycorrhizal and beneficial bacteria and fungi, that live on organic matter, which has been depleted from your soil months ago. You have no food for the microorganisms, which in turn are supplying no food to your plants. No amount of lime (which is seriously missing with your pH), mycorrhizal (which are probably either dead before you apply or shortly there after), molasses (which is primarily used for ginger snaps, not plants), moving your lights up and down, turning up the AC or watering more or less is going to do diddly until you provide nutrients. Really your plants aren’t that different from you - sure it’s nice to crank up the heater on a cold day, but if you don’t have a grilled cheese sandwich and tomato soup, you’re going to die. You’d be better off with a box of Miracle Grow or pissing in a bucket of water, than using Great White or Recharge. For the love of God and all that is holy, feed your poor plants!

Don't roast me, I'm trying my best Would you recommend this https://www.stepwellsoil.com/products/stepwell-soil-bloom-top-dressing?variant=32930517090444 Would it be enough? I have the flora trio at home too

 

[SamRD]

It’s not too difficult. Fox Farm soil is dirt. It’s like any other other dirt you buy, it’s DIRT. If you have really great dirt with tons of organic material, you can plant a garden and stuff will grow lush and green. If you have sandy or clay soil with little organic matter, and you don’t use fertilizers, your garden will be weak and pathetic. Almost all farmers use fertilizers in order to grow crops. Fox Farm isn’t magic dirt or living soil - it has some earthworm castings, bat guano, fish and crab meal. There’s no way you can expect a bag of FF dirt to supply nutrients for a cannabis plant, which are heavy feeders, beyond a seedling.

Great White and Recharge are not nutrients. They’re primarily mycorrhizal and beneficial bacteria and fungi, that live on organic matter, which has been depleted from your soil months ago. You have no food for the microorganisms, which in turn are supplying no food to your plants. No amount of lime (which is seriously missing with your pH), mycorrhizal (which are probably either dead before you apply or shortly there after), molasses (which is primarily used for ginger snaps, not plants), moving your lights up and down, turning up the AC or watering more or less is going to do diddly until you provide nutrients. Really your plants aren’t that different from you - sure it’s nice to crank up the heater on a cold day, but if you don’t have a grilled cheese sandwich and tomato soup, you’re going to die. You’d be better off with a box of Miracle Grow or pissing in a bucket of water, than using Great White or Recharge. For the love of God and all that is holy, feed your poor plants!

I also want to add, I gave the plant marine phytoplankton around 2 weeks ago which is high in nitrogen and it immediately gave me a slight nute burn, half dose too. Which made me think nutes are not the problem

 

[mancorn]

Don't roast me, I'm trying my best Would you recommend this https://www.stepwellsoil.com/products/stepwell-soil-bloom-top-dressing?variant=32930517090444 Would it be enough? I have the flora trio at home too

Sorry not trying to roast you, but drives me crazy that you’ve been sold a load of nonsense about how FF soil is some super soil and using mycorrhizal/microorganisms products are beneficial. It’s like strapping a spoiler on your Honda Civic hoping you’ll win a Formula 1 race. A car spoiler does have a use, but freeway driving isn’t one of them. It’s not that these microorganisms products are completely worthless, but they aren’t a magic bullet and unless you have all the basic dialed in, a complete waste of your money.

I can’t speak to the Stepwell products or marine phytoplankton. But really KIS. If your dog was starving and you had a choice between a can of dog food or phytoplankton, which will you give your dog? It’s not that bloom boosters or phytoplankton are bad, but they’re not going to providing all the nutrients, vitamins and minerals that your plant (or dog) needs. And unless you’re really experienced horticulturalist it’s much better to stick with compound/mixed fertilizer product (which contains the full complement of NPK and micro nutrients. Going back to the dog analogy, people do make their own dog food. But most people aren’t biologist or nutritionist and unless you know the fundamentals, are better off feeding their dogs food made by experts.)

It’s great that your growing organically. Lots of good reasons to continue. But for being so basic (humans have been organic growing for over 100,000 years) it’s definitely harder to do indoors than using synthetic fertilizers. Mainly because you’re trying to recreate and environment in your closet that nature has spent millions of years perfecting, and much harder to make corrections. Organic fertilizers aren’t plant available. This means that there’s an intermediate steps between applying the fertilizer and your plants being feed (and where your GW & Recharge products fit in). But it’s no easy task to figure out how how long any specific fertilizers will take before it’s of any use. For instance you may read about using egg shells for Ca. Sure egg shells are fine to throw in your compost, but the Ca won’t be available to your plants for many years. Rock phosphate will take 1/2 year before it provides phosphate for your veggies. When you look at a product like Stepwell Soil Bloom, you need to look at the ingredients, and then figure out if these ingredients will actually be plant available in 8 weeks before you harvest. The alfalfa will, I doubt the wollastonite will (but honestly have no freaking clue).

So don’t be afraid to just pick up a bottle of Dyna-Grow, Jacks, General Hydroponics or any of the other “Grow” blends. Then as you gain more gardening experience, you’ll be better positioned to use more and more natural products. And just to be clear, using a synthetic fertilizers isn’t going to poisoning your organics. Even if you’re doing great with your organic grow, using a synthetic fertilizer won’t burn up your microorganisms or nuke your environment. You can safely mix synthetics with your organics to get yourself back on track.

 

[mancorn]

I also want to add, I gave the plant marine phytoplankton around 2 weeks ago which is high in nitrogen and it immediately gave me a slight nute burn, half dose too. Which made me think nutes are not the problem

Nutrients are most definitely THE problem, simply because you don’t have any. It’s like not eating for a week and saying “I don’t know why I’m so tired”. Fox Farm dirt is not going to supply enough nutrients for a cannabis plant, no mater what you’ve read or heard. Your plants need nutrients from some source. There’s not enough in your bag of dirt, so how would there be too much in your pot?

 

[SamRD]

Nutrients are most definitely THE problem, simply because you don’t have any. It’s like not eating for a week and saying “I don’t know why I’m so tired”. Fox Farm dirt is not going to supply enough nutrients for a cannabis plant, no mater what you’ve read or heard. Your plants need nutrients from some source. There’s not enough in your bag of dirt, so how would there be too much in your pot?

Ok, I just watered with the flora trio to see what happens.