My plant seems droopy

[Atokad28]

Im not sure the gender yet but it had a rough start going from a home made grow bucket then being my first plant to transplant into hydro. It started to get nutrient burn in the hydro because I wasnt sure what i was doing with hydro at the time. But now its in soil and seems healthy just droopy. I might just be over reacting but I'm trying for a really strong potent plant to stsrt developing a nice strain.

 

[Smoking Gun]

What soil is that? Is it Home Depot stuff?

Your plant is definitely stressed. I would start using some kelp, both as a foliar spray and a drench feed. It does also appear that your soil is a bit on the dry side, so I would get to watering.

 

[Atokad28]

What soil is that? Is it Home Depot stuff?

Your plant is definitely stressed. I would start using some kelp, both as a foliar spray and a drench feed. It does also appear that your soil is a bit on the dry side, so I would get to watering.

Tops dry but right underneath is wet i have a two way meter for checking under the soil aswell. But if its not underwstwring stressing it out whats stressing it?

 

[Atokad28]

Oh the soil is potting mix and miracle grow from walmart. Didnt see that first part sorry.

 

[az2000]

MiracleGro potting mix? (<<link) 0.21-0.11-0.16? That's pretty strong. You're not feeding anything else?

I'm growing two plants in Kellogg Cactus potting mix (<<link, go to page 2). One of them looks a lot like yours. I've noticed it more when it's kept too wet too long (for example, when I think it won't make it till morning without being too dry, then I feed a few hours before lights out (a timing problem), while they could have waited 8 hours. I notice the one plant of mine will look more like yous (than the other).

The cactus mix is mostly sand, and packs together. It drains well, dries fast. But, I've worried that it might not be airy enough. I don't see much perlite in your soil. Maybe that's an issue. Your plant may not like wet feet the way mine has been showing it doesn't. Plus, it could be getting more nutrients than it needs from the already charged soil. (I've been experiementing with strong feeding. I think that made it worse.).

 

[Smoking Gun]

Miracle grow is not for anything edible, or smokable.

I personally never trust those moisture meters. I rely on the lift test; I lift it after a watering to see how heavy it is and then lift again each day to monitor how much water is being used or evaporating. What it becomes too easy to lift it is time for water.

You have moved this plant 3 times, overdosed it with nutrients, and from the looks of it you have no fresh air getting into your growing area. What isn't stressing it? Its time to leave the plant to grow uninterrupted and get the environment dialed in. You can ease up on nutrients if you are using any at the moment, there is plenty in the soil.

 

[Atokad28]

Miracle grow is not for anything edible, or smokable.

I personally never trust those moisture meters. I rely on the lift test; I lift it after a watering to see how heavy it is and then lift again each day to monitor how much water is being used or evaporating. What it becomes too easy to lift it is time for water.

You have moved this plant 3 times, overdosed it with nutrients, and from the looks of it you have no fresh air getting into your growing area. What isn't stressing it? Its time to leave the plant to grow uninterrupted and get the environment dialed in. You can ease up on nutrients if you are using any at the moment, there is plenty in the soil.

So far i havent added any nutrients nit since its week in the hydro bucket. But why can your use Miracle-Gro on anything edible or anything being smoked. I looked a bit into it and other than problems with too much nutirents i cant find anyrhing saying its harmful. But I try to open to open the closet multiple times a day to help with fresh air. I kinda just have some fans brining in fresh air from outside into the room the closet is in. Then there is a fan in the closet on tbe door moving air in the grow area. This is my first time growing any type of plant so ill try the lifting method and try to rely less in the meter.

 

[Atokad28]

MiracleGro potting mix? (<<link) 0.21-0.11-0.16? That's pretty strong. You're not feeding anything else?

I'm growing two plants in Kellogg Cactus potting mix (<<link, go to page 2). One of them looks a lot like yours. I've noticed it more when it's kept too wet too long (for example, when I think it won't make it till morning without being too dry, then I feed a few hours before lights out (a timing problem), while they could have waited 8 hours. I notice the one plant of mine will look more like yous (than the other).

The cactus mix is mostly sand, and packs together. It drains well, dries fast. But, I've worried that it might not be airy enough. I don't see much perlite in your soil. Maybe that's an issue. Your plant may not like wet feet the way mine has been showing it doesn't. Plus, it could be getting more nutrients than it needs from the already charged soil. (I've been experiementing with strong feeding. I think that made it worse.).

i never thought to use sand or rocks to help drain my pots probably plugged up and cant drain. I'll look up some ways to help drain my pot as is. Thank you

 

[az2000]

i never thought to use sand or rocks to help drain my pots probably plugged up and cant drain. I'll look up some ways to help drain my pot as is. Thank you

Perlite is customary. I'd probably mix it 50%. I like fast-drying soils. (Organic growers might use pumice to be more "natural.").

Now that the plant is locked into the unmodified soil, you could aerate the soil with a 1/8" diameter rod. Poke it all the way through. That can help the soil get air. Don't go crazy perforating the soil, shredding roots. (Put a rounded point on the end.). But, 6-8 holes could help. (However, I did that to my cactus-soil mix, and that plant (which is similar to yours) seemed to suffer. It just seems sensitive in every possible way. I might have broken a root, and that stressed the plant. The other plant liked it.).

In that amount of soil, you could use a 1/4" diameter rod. (That's actually what I used, but the plants were in 20 oz seedling cups. That might have been invasive for that size of soil. 1/8" would have been better.). If you made some good size holes, you could dribble in some small perlite pieces (crush the larger pieces if you need to). That would create some permenent aeration passage ways. After making 6-8, make 1-2 every watering. That should start to have an effect (hopefully positive).

 

[Atokad28]

Perlite is customary. I'd probably mix it 50%. I like fast-drying soils. (Organic growers might use pumice to be more "natural.").

Now that the plant is locked into the unmodified soil, you could aerate the soil with a 1/8" diameter rod. Poke it all the way through. That can help the soil get air. Don't go crazy perforating the soil, shredding roots. (Put a rounded point on the end.). But, 6-8 holes could help. (However, I did that to my cactus-soil mix, and that plant (which is similar to yours) seemed to suffer. It just seems sensitive in every possible way. I might have broken a root, and that stressed the plant. The other plant liked it.).

In that amount of soil, you could use a 1/4" diameter rod. (That's actually what I used, but the plants were in 20 oz seedling cups. That might have been invasive for that size of soil. 1/8" would have been better.). If you made some good size holes, you could dribble in some small perlite pieces (crush the larger pieces if you need to). That would create some permenent aeration passage ways. After making 6-8, make 1-2 every watering. That should start to have an effect (hopefully positive).

Wow thank you so much. I'll go do it right now. I think i have somthing that will work for putting tbe holes in.

 

[az2000]

I'll go do it right now. I think i have somthing that will work for putting tbe holes in.

Regarding the MiracleGro Potting Mix. If you're using the one I linked to, I've seen people use it. But, they usually have problems because it's so strong (and, it's time-release synthetic nutrients, I believe. People try to flush it, which you do if a plant's overfed. That just burns the plants more because it releases more of the polymerized nutrients. It's not organic sources that the plant can take up as needed.). I haven't seen anyone say they use it on a continued basis. (It's more like your situation. Saw it at the store. Decided to use it. You're having much better results. Probably because you haven't tried to feed.).

However, I have seen people who say they use MiracleGro Organic Choice (0.10-0.05-0.05) as their soil of choice, have good results, etc. That's about half as strong as the "Potting Mix" version. (Be aware, there is a "potting soil" version of that, which is stronger. I think that's for outdoors.). OC might contain organic sources of nutrients, not time-release synthetics. You might have to feed that a little, at some point. But, it shouldn't be "too much" (which I think you're running into right now). If you wanted to feed more and rely on the soil less, Black Gold organic potting mix is (0.05-0.00-0.00). Personally, I like to feed every watering and be more in control of what the plant's getting. But, I've never used that product. (I would add perlite to any of this. Lots of perlite. At least 30%. Maybe 60. I like the soil to dry in 2-3 days when the plant has grown into the container. That's one problem you have. That plant's in a fairly over-sized container. That makes it challenging to keep it uniformly moisturized, but not too wet too long. It's hard to balance that when the container is large, the roots haven't filled it yet.).

The soil I use is documented here (<<link). That document links to the nutrients I use. I've used it for 5-6 years. Created it on a whim, without much thought. It's worked really well for me (and the nutrients I use). I'm experimenting with hardware-store soils now. I'd like to replace the Pro-Mix part of my soil with something else (something that's not a specialty-store item, more readily available). But, it works really well. The specialty store aspect is just a minor thing. I'd just like to simplify it a little.

I think your plants look great for your first grow, and using a somewhat problematic potting mix. (If you buy perlite, get Vigaro or something. MiracleGro's perlite has 0.10-0.10-0.10 added theirs. (It's like they can't refrain from nuting anything they touch. I was thinking the other day, the cafeteria at MG headquarters probably has an NPK value for every item on the menu. "Meat Loaf: 8-2-5." Who would add nutrients to *perlite*. It's like they wreck everything they touch.

 

[Atokad28]

Regarding the MiracleGro Potting Mix. If you're using the one I linked to, I've seen people use it. But, they usually have problems because it's so strong (and, it's time-release synthetic nutrients, I believe. People try to flush it, which you do if a plant's overfed. That just burns the plants more because it releases more of the polymerized nutrients. It's not organic sources that the plant can take up as needed.). I haven't seen anyone say they use it on a continued basis. (It's more like your situation. Saw it at the store. Decided to use it. You're having much better results. Probably because you haven't tried to feed.).

However, I have seen people who say they use MiracleGro Organic Choice (0.10-0.05-0.05) as their soil of choice, have good results, etc. That's about half as strong as the "Potting Mix" version. (Be aware, there is a "potting soil" version of that, which is stronger. I think that's for outdoors.). OC might contain organic sources of nutrients, not time-release synthetics. You might have to feed that a little, at some point. But, it shouldn't be "too much" (which I think you're running into right now). If you wanted to feed more and rely on the soil less, Black Gold organic potting mix is (0.05-0.00-0.00). Personally, I like to feed every watering and be more in control of what the plant's getting. But, I've never used that product. (I would add perlite to any of this. Lots of perlite. At least 30%. Maybe 60. I like the soil to dry in 2-3 days when the plant has grown into the container. That's one problem you have. That plant's in a fairly over-sized container. That makes it challenging to keep it uniformly moisturized, but not too wet too long. It's hard to balance that when the container is large, the roots haven't filled it yet.).

The soil I use is documented here (<<link). That document links to the nutrients I use. I've used it for 5-6 years. Created it on a whim, without much thought. It's worked really well for me (and the nutrients I use). I'm experimenting with hardware-store soils now. I'd like to replace the Pro-Mix part of my soil with something else (something that's not a specialty-store item, more readily available). But, it works really well. The specialty store aspect is just a minor thing. I'd just like to simplify it a little.

I think your plants look great for your first grow, and using a somewhat problematic potting mix. (If you buy perlite, get Vigaro or something. MiracleGro's perlite has 0.10-0.10-0.10 added theirs. (It's like they can't refrain from nuting anything they touch. I was thinking the other day, the cafeteria at MG headquarters probably has an NPK value for every item on the menu. "Meat Loaf: 8-2-5." Who would add nutrients to *perlite*. It's like they wreck everything they touch.

Thats alot to absorb but much apriceated. I honestly thought that putting it in a larger pot would save me from another transplant down the road so it had some time to catch up. But I get what you mean with its slowly filling it. I'm hoping that the amount of water i put into the soil helps flush some of the nuts from the miracle grow.

 

[az2000]

(However, I did that to my cactus-soil mix, and that plant (which is similar to yours) seemed to suffer. It just seems sensitive in every possible way. I might have broken a root, and that stressed the plant. The other plant liked it.).

I just wanted to clarify that I think that plant suffered due to overfeeding, not poking two holes in the soil. I did the aeration a few hours before the first of four strong feedings (twice as strong, no playing around). I'm sure that's what did it. This plant apparently doesn't need as much food. It was impacted more negatively than the other plant from those 4 feedings. So, I bet that's what I saw.

I'm hoping that the amount of water i put into the soil helps flush some of the nuts from the miracle grow.

Unfortunately, it probably won't help. If the unwanted nutrients in the soil were from you feeding, you can flush that out. But, MG Potting Mix has synthetic nutrients that are coated. They're designed to slowly release with each watering. If you water more, you'll release more. (The MG Organic Choice might have organic nutrients that work differently. It's half-strength too.).

 

[Atokad28]

I just wanted to clarify that I think that plant suffered due to overfeeding, not poking two holes in the soil. I did the aeration a few hours before the first of four strong feedings (twice as strong, no playing around). I'm sure that's what did it. This plant apparently doesn't need as much food. It was impacted more negatively than the other plant from those 4 feedings. So, I bet that's what I saw.



Unfortunately, it probably won't help. If the unwanted nutrients in the soil were from you feeding, you can flush that out. But, MG Potting Mix has synthetic nutrients that are coated. They're designed to slowly release with each watering. If you water more, you'll release more. (The MG Organic Choice might have organic nutrients that work differently. It's half-strength too.).

Okay well in the last couple of days its kinda come back to life especially after I put some holes in the soil.

 

[Atokad28]

The lower leaves are looking a little rough though

 

[az2000]

Okay well in the last couple of days its kinda come back to life especially after I put some holes in the soil.

If you can keep it looking like that it will be ok. At some point (mid flower?) the built-in slow-release synthetic nutrients may be diminished. You might need to feed it.

I wouldn't worry about the lower leaves. It's common for them to be dropped. And, more common if the plant's stressed with overfeeding and staying too wet. (My two test plants' lower leaves were yellowing and preparing to be dropped. (I "mainlined" mine last night. I want to keep mine small and in veg longer. Mainlining's good for that. It spreads the growth sideways, and takes awhile for the fast vegetative growth to resume. I don't think it makes sense for most growing. But, I want more time because it's a short tent, and still want to experiment with the nutrients.).

EDIT: You might experiement with a larger-diameter rod. I discovered aeration using a Control Wizard Accurate8 ph-probe. It's 3/8" diameter. That's when I noticed the plants seemed to like it (especially later in flower when the soil seemed compact, the roots very dense). I made the 1/4" rod for that. But, sometimes I think the plants might like the greater disruption of 3/8".

I wouldn't rush into that. But, something to keep in mind. Maybe do it with a future plant after you have more aeration experience to judge it from.

 

[Atokad28]

For now ill stick with the dow rod im using it seems to love it. But with using miracle grow will I not be able to smoke the buds?

 

[az2000]

For now ill stick with the dow rod im using it seems to love it. But with using miracle grow will I not be able to smoke the buds?

Why not?

 

[Atokad28]

Miracle grow is not for anything edible, or smokable.

I personally never trust those moisture meters. I rely on the lift test; I lift it after a watering to see how heavy it is and then lift again each day to monitor how much water is being used or evaporating. What it becomes too easy to lift it is time for water.

You have moved this plant 3 times, overdosed it with nutrients, and from the looks of it you have no fresh air getting into your growing area. What isn't stressing it? Its time to leave the plant to grow uninterrupted and get the environment dialed in. You can ease up on nutrients if you are using any at the moment, there is plenty in the soil.

 

[az2000]

Have you googled about it? Lots of people grow with it. Usually the "Potting Mix" product you're using causes problems. That leads to a reflexive cacophony of "never use MiracleGro!" Plus, MG is owned by Scotts (which had/has a relationship with Monsanto). So, there can be a "big agro" opposition to it. That can take on a religious tone. (But, Scotts owns General Hydroponics, Botanicare, Sun Systems, et. al.).

Growweedeasy has a couple pages devoted to MG. They don't say you can't smoke your harvest. They do say there are better potting mixes and nutrients available. (I agree with that.). But, I've grown a plant from veg to harvest using MG "Tomato" (18-18-21). You can mix Tomato, All-Purpose and Bloom Booster to get various ratios (if it really matters, which I don't think it does too much.). I've seen people on forums who grow using MG Organic Choice potting mix. They tended to lay low because of all the reflexive hate. But, they're happy with their results.

I'd suggest researching it yourself. MG isn't liked very much. That tends to lead to overstatements about how it won't grow, or is dangerous. It clearly grows. And, if it were dangerous I'm sure it would come with warnings . (Sometimes people get into organic growing and can have exceptionally high standards. I've seen chemical analysis that MG has arsenic or mercury, or something. But, when you look up Advanced Nutrients, Botanicare, Gen Hydro, et. al. they do too. And then it tuns out the organic grower doesn't like that stuff either. It's just that MG's an easier target being "big agro, etc.").

That's my understanding of it.