Need help sizing my chiller for my UC systems

[UCHQ]

Need help sizing chillers for UC systems

Is there a formula growers can follow to help them size a chiller to their UC?

 

[Texas Kid]

Most that I looked at where based on a flow rate and a volume, so when I bought my Artica 1/3hp setup I used the total volume of my UC 8 site which was roughly 65 gallons and he flow rate of my pump at 500gph...and then I got the size up from there for the overkill factor

Tex

 

[UCHQ]

I'm curious especially for growers using multiple systems in a large space using delivery/return manifolds and coils to cool each system from one centralized commercial chiller.

Say, (8X) UCE24XXL's in a 90 x 30 space w/ an ambient temp of 78F? Is there a cooling guru moderating this forum that has any input for us?

 

[Seed Buyer]

Call Steven at Hydro Innovations.

 

[Texas Kid]

Ya'll should start offering chillers on your website, one stop shopping is nice..plus you could offer guidance on the sizing for each specific config.

Chill King/Hydro innovations chillers and their coils although wort chiller coils are cheaper and beefy as hell.

Artica/JBJ chillers work great

Tex

 

[Chillville]

Sorry this is a long answer....

There is an accurate way of sizing a chiller for a UC system by calculating the BTU's being absorbed by the water in an hour. What you want to do is first fill the UC system to the highest level that it would ever be at (this level will require the most heat removal because the higher the water volume, the greater the heat absorption). Next turn on the lights over the UC and let the room warm up the the highest temperature that it would be during the on cycle. It's important to turn the lights on because radiant heat from the lights will affect the UC water temp. Ice down the water in the UC to get it around 65, record the water temp....wait one hour and then record the water temp again. While testing if your water temp reaches your room temp before the end of the test then the test must be started over with a cooler starting temp. This will give you your temp differential over an hour, and from there you can calculate the BTU’s per hour being absorbed by the UC. The formula to find out how many BTU are absorbed in to the water is

Gallons in UC x 8.34 (weight of a gallon of water) x temperature rise in one hour

Example
I've got a 6 site UC with 70 gallons of total water volume, I turned on my lights and got the room to 80 degreees. I started with 65 degree waters....waited one hour and the temp was 70, so a 5 degree rise in temp.

70 x 8.34 x 5 = 2,919 BTU per hour.

1 hp (or ton) of cooling = 12,000 BTU, so I would need a 1/4 hp of cooling for my UC system. Most chillers do not perform at their listed rating, instead they usually test at around 80% of their rating, which is the industry standard unfortunately. The only chiller that I've tested that perform at their rating is the ChillKing chillers. Since a typical 1/4 hp chiller only outputs 2,343 BTU (80% of 3000 BTU), I would actually need to step up a size to the ½ HP chiller if going that route. You always want to leave yourself at least a 20% cusion, you never want to size a chiller to exactly what you need b/c it won't cycle properly. You can find the actual chiller BTU output of most chillers online.

 

[Chillville]

Chillers can perform far below its rating if not allowed enough fresh air. Ducting them, putting them in attics, hot garages or basements will cut your BTU's down siginifactly. Chillers perform best when put outdoors, and although the JBJ is a great chiller it isn't made to go outdoors. For larger chillers putting them outdoors becomes a necessity in most cases.

Insulation on the UC buckets makes a big difference. Every square inch of the UC system that is in contact with water is absorbing heat and can actually absorb quite a bit. I've had grow rooms in dark cycles cooled down with just the UC system and a top off res chilled to 68 degrees with no other cooling. If you can insulate the UC system you would need a much smaller chiller. Double bubble foil wrap works good or you can wrap with wall insulation and extra large zip ties to hold it on.

I recommend ChillKing chillers for one because they can be used outdoors. JBJ artica would be my second choice only for indoor installations. Sunlight Supply also has a commercial line of chillers now that are inexpensive and aren't bad at all.

 

[Chillville]

I'm curious especially for growers using multiple systems in a large space using delivery/return manifolds and coils to cool each system from one centralized commercial chiller.

Say, (8X) UCE24XXL's in a 90 x 30 space w/ an ambient temp of 78F? Is there a cooling guru moderating this forum that has any input for us?

If running multiple systems each system would need to be BTU tested for accurate chiller sizing. If all systems are in the same room and are the same size then most likely testing one and multiply that by how many systems there are. This may seem like a PITA but you only have to do it once and it saves you from buying an oversized or undersized chiller.

With a system that large you are looking at buying multiple smaller chillers OR buying one large chiller which makes the most sense. This chiller would need to go outside because all of the heat pulled out of the UC will come out of the chiller. You really don't want to run nutrients through your chiller because it can corrode the heat exchanger and it can build up gunk inside. The best options is to use something like Coolcoils dropped in each epi which you can run chilled water through from a central reservoir. This res should be filled with freshwater and propyleyne glycol....around 30% PG is the minimum amount to be effective. PG stops oxidation of heat exchanger inside chiller keeping the performance high. When you buy PG make sure its 100% glycol in the bottle, sometimes its already a 50/50 mix. If you buy 50/50 then you would need twice as much.

I usually set the chiller temp one degree above the dew point inside the garden to get started, this will keep your Coolcoil hoses from sweating. If all the UC systems are the same size typically you can adjust the chiller temp to get the right temp in all the UC's OR you can use a water valve and a Resistat to regulate the chilled water flowing through the coil. This becomes necessary if you have systems with different water volumes using one chiller. You can set the Resistat to whatever temperature you want for each system and it will open and close the water valve.

So to answer your question about what size chiller I would recommend for the setup that you listed.....without knowing the temperature rise of the system I can't accurately tell you. I wish it was simple enough to just say "x" system gets "x" chiller but there are so many variables you really can't do that. I could list a dozen things that could effect that size of the chiller, the only way to know for sure it to run the BTU test properly....it only takes an hour!

 

[TheHydroChronic]

Dank info chillville

 

[Jalisco Kid]

Sorry this is a long answer....

There is an accurate way of sizing a chiller for a UC system by calculating the BTU's being absorbed by the water in an hour. What you want to do is first fill the UC system to the highest level that it would ever be at (this level will require the most heat removal because the higher the water volume, the greater the heat absorption). Next turn on the lights over the UC and let the room warm up the the highest temperature that it would be during the on cycle. It's important to turn the lights on because radiant heat from the lights will affect the UC water temp. Ice down the water in the UC to get it around 65, record the water temp....wait one hour and then record the water temp again. This will give you your temp differential over an hour, and from there you can calculate the BTU’s per hour being absorbed by the UC. The formula to find out how many BTU are absorbed in to the water is

Gallons in UC x 8.34 (weight of a gallon of water) x temperature rise in one hour

Example
I've got a 6 site UC with 70 gallons of total water volume, I turned on my lights and got the room to 80 degreees. I started with 65 degree waters....waited one hour and the temp was 70, so a 5 degree rise in temp. While testing if your water temp reaches your room temp before the end of the test then the test must be started over with a cooler starting temp.

70 x 8.34 x 5 = 2,919 BTU per hour.

1 hp (or ton) of cooling = 12,000 BTU, so I would need a 1/4 hp of cooling for my UC system. Most chillers do not perform at their listed rating, instead they usually test at around 80% of their rating, which is the industry standard unfortunately. The only chiller that I've tested that perform at their rating is the ChillKing chillers. Since a typical 1/4 hp chiller only outputs 2,343 BTU (80% of 3000 BTU), I would actually need to step up a size to the ½ HP chiller if going that route. You always want to leave yourself at least a 20% cusion, you never want to size a chiller to exactly what you need b/c it won't cycle properly. You can find the actual chiller BTU output of most chillers online.

I would run your lights for while to get room at running temps,fire off your air pumps also.The rooms radiant heat will change your numbers. Just do not let the air heat up let the heat get into the floor, walls and somewhat the plants.
You did not mention it but I assume you have the pumps running as the pipes pick up a lot of heat. Now that it is Aug it is a good time for this test. This test done in Jan would give you bad numbers for running your chiller in Aug. Good info though,most manufacturer techs try to put us in undersized chillers. Suerte JK

 

[johnnyrex]

sizing chiller

Great info i have a 4xxl-13 in a 10x10x tent i need to change my chiller 1 ton i find it to be over over kill and its just WAY too noisy for me in the bedroom can i get a 1/6hp would that wook for me running 3000w 2 over head and 1 vert in the middle thanks for the help guys

 

[Get HI]

Do you know the temperature differential? If you get that measurement then you can use the equation that Chillville posted to let you know how many BTU your system is absorbing and size the chiller accordingly.

 

[johnnyrex]

Do you know the temperature differential? If you get that measurement then you can use the equation that Chillville posted to let you know how many BTU your system is absorbing and size the chiller accordingly.

Hi get hi sorry for the late reply I didn't see chill like differential temp post as I saw it after I purchased my unit I knew that I would need around 1/4-1/2 hp chiller but I said what the heck 1 hp would be over kill and run more efficient as it would cycle on and off. I also have a hydro innovation hydrogen pro co2 water cooled burner so that's another reason that influence my decision on getting something as big as a 1 hp chiller.

The funny thing is that I never end up running the co2 burner cause I run a sealed room and the label on the burner stated that one should not use it in a sealed room have to vent at least once aday that's not an option for me.

 

[Get HI]

Johnny, yeah the 1 HP should be plenty. And, how large is your room that you want to run the HydroGEN in? If you visit the room once a day then you would be venting the room enough to run the HydroGEN...imo

 

[woodsmaneh]

I have been running coils in my uc and my DIY UC, they are attached to a 1 hp chiller. I have been running the coils in the epicenter but am going to change it around and run the coils in the res for the chiller and pump the nutrients through the coils. This will put the coils totaly under water and cool the res better, I think. If your looking for coils try brewing stores as they are 1/3 the cost. I got my 50 foot coils for 75$ each, they are SS with hose ends on them.

 

[johnnyrex]

Thanks wood I actually brought the cool coil from UC but I only have one unit so I am running the chiller straight so far it's running great I had a 1 hp with my 4xxl 13 it was over kill and very loud so I down graded to 1/4 hp I'm loving it so far thanks once again

 

[ttystikk]

Thanks wood I actually brought the cool coil from UC but I only have one unit so I am running the chiller straight so far it's running great I had a 1 hp with my 4xxl 13 it was over kill and very loud so I down graded to 1/4 hp I'm loving it so far thanks once again

I guess I saw your post a bit late, as I would have suggested you investigate a different approach; are you running AC in your 10x10 tent? How are you cooling 3kW worth of lamps? Did you try the sealed room?

I would have used the 1 hp chiller to not only cool the water in your UC but also the air in your tent, eliminating the need for another air conditioning unit at all. This would likely also have been more energy efficient. If you use Ice Boxes, you can push air through them with a blower fan- I use 8" maxfans to blow through my 8" Ice Boxes, I bet you'd do fine with 6" versions- and then put the fans on a thermostat. Voila! Cooled growroom air! You can even bump the efficiency of the whole thing by ducting outside air through sealed and vented hoods and sending much of the bulb heat outside directly.

 

[TwoFeathers]

Couple comments...

There is an accurate way of sizing a chiller for a UC system by calculating the BTU's being absorbed by the water in an hour. What you want to do is first fill the UC system to the highest level that it would ever be at (this level will require the most heat removal because the higher the water volume, the greater the heat absorption). Next turn on the lights over the UC and let the room warm up the the highest temperature that it would be during the on cycle. It's important to turn the lights on because radiant heat from the lights will affect the UC water temp. Ice down the water in the UC to get it around 65, record the water temp....wait one hour and then record the water temp again. This will give you your temp differential over an hour, and from there you can calculate the BTU’s per hour being absorbed by the UC.​

One is that you will have a hell of a time cooling anything over about 50 gallons with ice. And if you try, you'll be encountering the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle because you are adding a huge amount of water (ice) to the formula when you try to cool down your res before you test the rate of heat change. Chillville what do you think of plugging the connection tubes on one DWC bucket and performing the heat exchange test on just that one bucket, then of course you would just multiply the resulting number times the total number of buckets to get the number for the whole system. Doing it this way would require less ice and you could more easily lower the water level to the maximum normal usage level AFTER adding the ice. Otherwise, if you fail to lower the level AFTER adding ice, you're measuring the rate of change for the wrong volume.

Second... about running coils...
I've tried cooling my veg room (small DWC) by running my 66 degree flower nutes through some 1" PVC plumbing that took it to coils which circulated inside the veg nute buckets. The system sound great in theory but in practice, running a large volume of liquid through a long distance of pipe (of any diameter) becomes really hard on your pump. The smaller the pipe, the more difficulty you will have and the slower the flow rate will be. If you were to put 50' of that stainless steel pipe (that woodsmaneh is showing above) inline between your pump and your 1hp chiller you will effectively stall your flow down to about - nothing. What I found that works better is to use insulated 1" PVC to move the nutes as much as possible, then use soft, thin wall tubing with at least a 1/2" inside diameter to make your coils. This still allows for a pretty decent flow volume. If you could get the company to make those pretty stainless coils with 1/2" inside diameter, then you'd really be in business.

Another alternative for using the small diameter stainless coils might be to install a high pressure pump just in front of the coils. This might push enough volume through there to keep your 1hp chiller happy - maybe.

 

[UClover]

I have been running coils in my uc and my DIY UC, they are attached to a 1 hp chiller. I have been running the coils in the epicenter but am going to change it around and run the coils in the res for the chiller and pump the nutrients through the coils. This will put the coils totaly under water and cool the res better, I think. If your looking for coils try brewing stores as they are 1/3 the cost. I got my 50 foot coils for 75$ each, they are SS with hose ends on them.

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Only problem I found with the brew store coils in a UC is that they don't fit around the disc in the Epicenter.

HI Cool Coils fit perfectly :)

 

[Badmf]

Be prepared for emergencycooling locate a dry ice supply place it in a plastic bag and drop in th rez. Sorry fot all the folks w/o power thru the midwest.