Nubee lookin' for advice.

[TALLDOG]

Hello everyone... have been reading some of your threads... seems like you folks are helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, .... etc... ;)

Have a BC Northern Lights "The Producer" grow box. have 18 seedlings approx 3 weeks old... I believe I've been pushing them too much... as I have them under 18 hrs of light CFL and MH. Have been keeping the box regulated (65* to 78*), but I do have straight Air-conditioning running all the time... I live in the deep south and box reaches 100* plus without it.

They all seem to droop during the light cycle... and were bouncing back after the dark cycle.... now they stay drooped... They are getting two 5 min water/nute feedings a day.

When I turn off the MH lights and run the CFL only ... they bounce back... and look good again...

I know... I know ... Doc when I do this it hurts.... Doc says... "Stop doing that"...

Patience ? Try kicking into full veg lighting in a 2 - 3 more weeks?

What do you think?

 

[Seamaiden]

Vapor pressure deficit is likely at play here. We would need to know the temps AND relative humidity. Seeing some pix would be helpful here, too, but given the behavior you report, I'm guessing that when the MH is on that VPD parameters are not to the plants' liking. VPD *IS* the plant's circulation system, so it's very important.

Oh, and please allow me to be the first to welcome you to the farm. Now, let's see you get your grow on. :D

 

[Oregon Panda]

Welcome. HID's are freekin hawt! That coupled with the Ac and your at RH 0% in no time.

Basically what seamaiden said.

 

[TALLDOG]

Just over 3 weeks after popping out of the rock wool.

 

[TALLDOG]

Is it ok to program box to run CFL 18 hours and MH 8 to 10 ... just to lessen stress.... as long as the dark cycle is 6 hrs... ?

 

[Seamaiden]

Yes, it should be fine.

 

[TALLDOG]

thanks... looks ok after 6 hrs of dark ? Your thoughts?

 

[Seamaiden]

I don't do undercurrent, so can't tell you really much of anything on those particulars. I see one or two plants that have what looks like the very beginning of a simple Mg- (magnesium deficiency), however, I also see lots of purple/reddened petioles and the plants appear to be an overall darker green than they should be, which hints at a P+ (phosphorous toxicity). All of that suggests an imbalance, or improper pH range for feeding. However, I couldn't' begin to tell you how to correct it.

Not knowing temperature and relative humidity, neither can I tell you whether or not the VPD is within good range (vapor pressure deficit).

The lighting seems to be just fine.

 

[ttystikk]

There are a few pieces of important info that you haven't shared with us. Get a 'hygrometer', aka a good quality RH meter so you can see what your moisture content is. Anytime it falls below 50% (IMHO, this applies up to and including the last day of bloom, too, but that's a controversy for another day), you need to actively boost your RH.

The target numbers to shoot for in your growing area are 80 degrees F and 70% RH. This is a good combo for everything except fresh cuttings (80-100%RH) and final flush (55%RH).

So, needed info includes the size of your MH bulb- and whether it's dimmed (never dim an MH bulb! Today's safety/ equipment care message, brought to you by the friendly folks on the Farm forum. In this case, repeated straight from Philips and Gavita) or not and how high above the plants you're keeping it.

It may sound counterintuitive, but I recommend leaving your veg zone lights on 24/7. I'm not sure how much faster things will grow than with 18/6 or gas light techniques, but the reason I do it is just to ensure a stable environment for my girls. If temps and RH swing too much, then just skip a dark time. If you're concerned that it will affect flowering times, don't be. If you're concerned about excess cost to leave the lights on in veg, pay attention to the guys on here who can save you money on nutrients- and I promise they will save you more than the electric bill from a box o' pot!

Welcome! Can't wait to see what you do with this!

 

[TALLDOG]

Thanks for the welcome, info and advice.

Will switch over to 24/7 light… I completely understand … stabilize the environment. I can do that. Will program M/H bulbs (400 w each ( 2 each)), to come on in the middle of the night when temp control is easier.

Specifications:
BC Northern Lights “The Producer”.

http://www.bcnorthernlights.com/the-producer


With some upgrades… (T-5 lights, veg tray, clone dome, veg lights (M/H), upgraded CFL). Was a give away… $250.00.
Plus a years worth of nutes, a grow room full of lights pumps, hoses, a box of spare bulbs for the grow box…. and more (Co2 etc…).


Hygrometer:
Temp Stays between (65* and 78*). Had to switch lighting schedule to over night to control high temp.
RH moves between 38% and 70%. Drops to 38% when M/H lights are on.

Running ducted AC into the box to keep temps between 65 & 78.

I had a cool mist humidifier, but it lasted about 4 days. I keep several open containers of water in the box to boost humidity.

Bulb Info:
Two 400 W MH and One CFL
Will switch over to HPS bulbs during flower cycle.
They are approx. 28” – 30” from the rockwool surface.
No dimming that I am aware of. But does have a LCD interface to program light and feed times. Light can be controlled separately. … i.e. I can control the M/H time separate from CFL time.

I currently run the lights from 1700 to 1100 (overnight)… due to high temps. But temps are controllable with CFL light (all day).
Will switch to 24/7 … but will have to modulate M/H lights to maintain acceptable temp.

I use Advance Nutrition Nutrients ( cam with the box ) for now… but am aware of the marathon thread on cheaper nutes … “Jacks”.. by Peters… I believe?... Will swap over when I run out of this high priced “electric Kool-Aid”.

I am currently running first week nutes per the recipe in the nute book for this machine…. I’m sure everything is tunable, but this is my first run, so I am trying to stay as close to the book as possible. Will swap over to 2nd week veg nutes tomorrow.

1st Week Nutes:
100 PPM

2nd Week Nutes:
200 PPM

See feeding schedule attached.
It’s been 24 days since they popped out of the rockwool

 

[TALLDOG]

Sorry.. photos were not compatible format?

 

[TALLDOG]

OK... one more time....

 

[ttystikk]

Nice setup, and complete, turn key. Dig that, even if I'm an avowed DIY guy in my grow op.

Buy another swamp cooler- and yes, get a swamp cooler. How does the air circulate through the cabinet? If you humidified the room the cabinet's in, would it make a difference inside?

 

[TALLDOG]

I'm sure it would make some diff... would need to duct it into the cabinet.... I live in a very humid region... not uncommon to have humidity levels close to 100%. If I limit my MH lights to 8 - 12 hrs a day... I think my levels should be better. Do I really have a low humidity problem if it stays between 38 and 70%? Having a swamp cooler here is like having a swamp cooler in the swamp... which is just down the road. Complete w/ alligators and mosquitoes.

 

[TALLDOG]

air circulation is accomplished via the two fans in the photo of the box... lower fan is intake and upper fan is exhaust.... I keep a small fan inside to keep em' swaying...

 

[ttystikk]

So the bottom line on climate control INSIDE the box is to control temps and humidity in the room OUTSIDE the box. Now that we know where to start thinking... LOL

Seriously, seal the room the cabinet is in if possible. Augment CO² in the room, get it a bit cold and too damp. Then, when the cabinet pulls air from this cold damp room, it will warm and dry to the correct readings.

 

[TALLDOG]

Will give it a try. Thanks for the help.