dirk d said:

Actually Congress has a Republican Majority. Is ObamaCare perfect?? no But i tell you this, This current system is Fucking Broke! Insurance Companies and Hospitals and Big Pharma are the root cause behind our shitty health business.

And what could really be so wrong that we tell a sick person that he can't get care because he has a pre-existing condition. There is so much bullshit in the health insurance world it would make your head spin. We are the supposed "greatest country in the world" yet our healthcare system is ranked 37th by WHO. It's actually very embarassing.

Here's a simple question...How do you Fund a War if you don't raise any taxes? how bout 2 Wars?? It's getting to the point that no matter how hard you work you still have nothing. Democrats have run this country into the ground and so have the Republicans. I blame Republicans more but Democrats definitely were at fault as well.

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Hey dirk d, Points well taken... Some Others still try to "Define" (And Fail Miserably) what or who I am... They are "Clueless"... Is the answer to the question... Pile on another Huge, Heaping Tax? Last time I checked, Congress is composed of two parts... House/Senate, One Party Clearly on Each Side and Both Failing Miserably... One Clearly Responsible for the "Health Care Policy" and the other "Slamming it" With No Definate Alternative Path. If some of the people that obviously only fire on A Few brain cells at best, had the ability to "Read Between the Lines" it would be apparant that I Do Not Support Either Party...

You really don't have the ability to insult me but what I can and have done is "report " you for Site Policy Violations... If A moderator happens to agree... Maybe we can go back to Civil posts... Have A Good One...

Hey socal, you spoke very strongly that this would not make it out of the supreme court. What do you think about this now? Have your opinions altered or are you still convinced in the unconstitutionality and that President Obama wasted his time with this?

Obviously, I am very happy about this. While like most U.S. laws this one is far from perfect, I see it as a great step in the right direction. I see that your last post asks for civility, and although we may have lacked in that department last time I would hope that we can converse in a good manner on this one.

Ya lets all be civil. There are many ways to express your opinions without degrading others. I think it's time America started to work for Americans. We need less taxes for the middle class and we need to stop funding all this military. Pull back and focus on our kids, our cities, our infrastructure. Imagine all the people put to work by spending 1 trillion a year on infrastructure improvements. How can Japan and China have a high speed rail system and we don't????

Lol, good one. Ill do the same. Maybe we can get back to civil posts some day.

All I can say is its not trolling when I only post responses on one subject, Im sorry for being overly passionate.But a realist view can be harsh at times.

I do agree totally we need to stop funding the military, makes little sense, we could cut the budget in less than half and still have the most well funded military in the world by far. Ron Paul said something cool he said at a speech once that raising up the lowest class is more beneficial than bringing down the highest class.

If wed have passed the jobs bill like 2 years ago when it first was trying to get passed wed have unemployment under 6% trillions of dollars in revenue.......why did it not get passed though.....come on we all know why....

I understand your frustration DWB, because it seems as if there is constantly someone coming onto these threads with ridiculous Republican rhetoric and then attempt to say they are not apart of any party, non linear, non cohesive arguments to say the least. I hope he does "rat" you out to a mod, any mod that looks up his posts will know exactly what he has been up to......basically trying to rile people up and then run away from constructive arguments. I have argued with most everyone on this site, but almost always we can be civil about them and almost always it seems I leave a little better than when I entered, with the exception of arguments like socal 420. Saying "fuck obamacare" , Nancy Pelosi is the devil, and that the supreme court would strike this down all sounded like Fox news to me. Honestly, it is a little ludicrous to be following that "side" of politics if you will, considering we are all on a MARIJUANA website and openly break the laws that these conservatives love so much. That said, I am always interested in the other sides reasoning's, but no matter how hard I try I cannot seem to get accurate conversations primarily because of the lack of truth when people take on the "social conservative/fox news" rhetoric without attempting to bring any facts to the table. Civil arguments usually start in a much different manner than this which was his second post on this thread, especially when it verges with such gnarly insanity:

"Obama Care, Supreme Court, Unconstitional, Nancy Pelosi (You Got to Pass it to Know What's in It) A Law Created by the Obama Goons that is so Fucking Huge and Complacated that few on the Planet have Literally Read it all or Let Alone Understand it, Including Many Demacrats that Voted it in. There are People that have studied that pile since the day it was tossed on it's victims and are barely able to deciffer the mess. Does that sound Ligit to you in any way, shape or form? Hey, I Know, We'll Make A Law That Forces People to Like/Buy it.
How about Legalized Marijuana? Yeah, Legal but You Have to Buy it From Obama, But if it's Crap and You Don't Like it, to Bad, If you Don't Buy it, You Pay A Penalty... Sound Familar?
Man, How many times do I Have to Say it. Even the Supreme Court Justices Scoffed at the Mention of Reading That Mess Line by Line to Determine What Should or Should not be Done. At the Supreme Court Hearings the Attorney Rep. for Obama Care was Literally Laughed at and Schooled During the Hearing by the Court... Did you "Miss" all this, or Do you just Choose to ignore what dosen't fit your view of things...
Everybody Wants it, Does that Include the Following EveryBody's Below... Why are they Sueing if They Like It... I Don't Understand :confused: Is it Because They are Not Wise Like Obama?

Next weak will tell the Tale and I Think You already Know what will Happen... I am not Affiliated nor Support any Political Party... Someone that you Claim as Being so highly Educated (Harvard) should be Well Aware that Their was "Zero" Possibility of this Passing the Sniff Test Just based on the way they went about it alone... Many other Reasons I just don't like the guy, Mostly His Arrogance and Narcisism and the Fact that He Seams to Think He is above Reproach are just A Few, Legality and Constitutionality of the Obama Agenda are the Others... Time Will Tell the Tale if He is All You Seam To Believe... Personally Im Not Buyin' What Barack Obama's Sellin' Health Care or OtherWise...

The links provided are Support for the Reasons I Don't Adore Obama... Where There's Smoke, There's Fire Bro... Either That or Your Right and Everybody Else is Wrong...
That Would be alot of Explaining from you to All These People, See my Point Yet?"

sanvanalona said:

Hey socal, you spoke very strongly that this would not make it out of the supreme court. What do you think about this now? Have your opinions altered or are you still convinced in the unconstitutionality and that President Obama wasted his time with this?

Obviously, I am very happy about this. While like most U.S. laws this one is far from perfect, I see it as a great step in the right direction. I see that your last post asks for civility, and although we may have lacked in that department last time I would hope that we can converse in a good manner on this one.

Click to expand...

You get what you give... I really could care less about the "Way" it went, as much as the "Way" it was Done, and the Pressident (Is that spelled right?) it Sets... Forever! Do you Really have that much Trust in Your Government? It's A "Pandora's Box" that Opens the door to "More Control" with no limits what so ever... You OK with that? I'm not... Our Government Has Not Served us Well and they "All" need to be held Accountable, Remember when it was "We the People?" If things continue on the path we are on (Not refering to Obama) We will see the begining of civil unrest and the possibility of A revolution (All In) because that is in my opinion, the only way sweeping "Change" that is so Nessessaary will occur... To Each their Own... Read the Papers, watch the news or whatever everyone wishes to do but that changes nothing and neither will your vote (Dem/Rep) We're all just along for the ride wether you believe it or not is not my problem... nor concer. Be aware of what goes on around you because we are definately in for one Hell of A Ride... This post is an Example of that... Change is definately on the Horizon... One way or Another... Have A Great 4th

Hey there we go man, good 4th to you too socal420. I really do not understand where you are coming from. Try writing without all the caps and quotes, it makes the emphasis confusing which I don't think you are trying to do. Are you saying that the government is corrupt, republicans and democrats equally? If so would you speak directly about some republicans that you do not like? What exactly is being corrupted by the healthcare act? The way I see it we are finally holding the pharmaceutical companies and especially health insurance companies to some accountability. Should we have let them continue on their destructive path of forcing people to pay insurance but dropping said person whenever shit hits the fan? To me kind of the point of insurance. Is the act and President Obama for that matter corrupt because he wants millions more Americans to have insurance? That I don't agree with. Now the Citizens United ruling was the real opening of corruption in our country, and had the media, tea baggers, libertarians, and anybody who believes in democracy stood up against this with the fervor that they did with healthcare, maybe we would be more democratic and less corrupt.

Anyway, good luck on the 4th and in Mexico if that is where you do end up. Things should be changing down there with their new president openly working with the cartels, so maybe less violence.

Were always on the verge of revolution. Democracy is revolution.

Yall have a good 4th! hopefully I dont get run over by a drunk driver this year, lol.

Dirty White Boy said:

All I can say is its not trolling when I only post responses on one subject, Im sorry for being overly passionate.But a realist view can be harsh at times.

I do agree totally we need to stop funding the military, makes little sense, we could cut the budget in less than half and still have the most well funded military in the world by far. Ron Paul said something cool he said at a speech once that raising up the lowest class is more beneficial than bringing down the highest class.

If wed have passed the jobs bill like 2 years ago when it first was trying to get passed wed have unemployment under 6% trillions of dollars in revenue.......why did it not get passed though.....come on we all know why....

Click to expand...

That is when they put everything into Health Care... Remember... Now we have this wonderful thing that devides people instead of "Money" and "Jobs" that could pay for your health care... Plenty of people seemed to manage their lives and Health Care without big bro before this... and would still prefer to have that "Choice"

SoCal 420 said:

That is when they put everything into Health Care... Remember... Now we have this wonderful thing that devides people instead of "Money" and "Jobs" that could pay for your health care... Plenty of people seemed to manage their lives and Health Care without big bro before this... and would still prefer to have that "Choice"

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This is where we need to speak factually. The people you refer to will still have their choice. The mandate effects 6% of people, and if they choose not to obtain healthcare they pay a tax of 1%.....pretty reasonable. People can still go get whatever doctor or insurance company they want. That has not changed at all.

Well thats where the argument comes in.

So they say... Do you see the future? How can you possibly predict how this will unfold? Good or bad... To Much Trust. We fund the government remember? You think through their XLNT handling of our money... Everything will unfold exactly as they say it will... Just like S.S.I.? or they will mismanage our money same as they have and currently do. Why would they change A good thing? Devide people, push the agenda, one or the other. Keeps our polititions happy, working and rolling in dough... More jobs for them less for us. You ever look at government jobs compaired to the private sector? If you work for the government your not hurting. More Gov. programs = more Gov. jobs... They care for their own. We are no longer considered part of their own, we are walking ATM's

SoCal 420 said:

So they say... Do you see the future? How can you possibly predict how this will unfold? Good or bad...

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I can judge this only off of similarities from the past. Social security, medicare, medicaid, pel grants, and basically all other social programs that get sold by the right to the populace as the end of democracy, but they never are and in fact strengthen our democracy by taking care of the weakest among us.

Gotta say you are down 1 right now for forecasting, remember the certainty over the supreme court decision. Not that I wasn't surprised by Roberts though, caught most off guard.

If I remember right, the supreme court was getting slamed by the admin. before they even arrived at A decision... They (Dems.) were even unshure if it would fly and as stated under the commerce clause it was determined unconstitional and was therefore reworded as A "Tax" in order to be passed into law. Either way the end result is Down 1 (The People) Kudos to you sanvanalona... and for the record my comments were not directed at anybody in general, simply opinions, Insulting others directly dosen't help further the discussion... weather I agree with you or any other person is not relevent.

Hey man you were the one that spoke with certainty about the outcome of the Affordable Care Act and then after being wrong asked me if I could see the future right? You have to at least see the irony in that. I agree we should try not to insult one another as that leaves the argument moot, oftentimes. I would like to see a factual based argument though. What is the relevance about Obama slamming the supreme court, all progressive Presidents do. Shit FDR added justices to slap the court and stop his New Deal from going through.

And your foresight involved the court rewording and passing it? What I said is that it was unconstitional... As the court also stated and hence the nesessitty to reword/modify the law from the way it was written. My comment of "Seeing the future " was in reply to your statement of the cost of ACA. and how great it would be for everyone, something that is yet to occur and is therefor an unknown... Nothing more than that. Obama slamming the court as well as others (Don't know the names and don't care) seamed to project A level of uncertinity weather what he did would be deemed as constitional or not... and the debate will go on...

No I had no foresight into this, and to be honest you said:
"Next weak will tell the Tale and I Think You already Know what will Happen"
"Someone that you Claim as Being so highly Educated (Harvard) should be Well Aware that Their was "Zero" Possibility of this Passing the Sniff Test Just based on the way they went about it alone"

So that said yes you I think you claimed to know that the supreme court would knock this down, and honestly I didn't argue that point because I agreed with you but just did not claim that I knew what was going to happen. Thats all. :)

I think everyone was surprised that Justice Roberts would be the deciding vote. It was his way of leaving a mark on the supreme court, but I am sure there were many reasons that have yet to surfaced too. Anyhow, I have been looking at my past posts and need to apologize for being rude, calling you names and the lot as I know that is not the way to have a conversation.

What do you think about politics in general? Are both parties corrupt to you? One more than the other? What I am asking is what exactly are your political ideologies?

Corruption is rampant, no one is held responsible. Streamlineing big bro and eliminating wastefull spending would be A great place to start. Free up taxpayer money to be spent elsewhere, Education, Infastructure, Border Security to name A few. Immigration Reform, Get it done, there is no excuse. Rep. Senator Marco Rubio (Sorry I can't control who says what) stated recently that republicans and democrats have no skin in this game because it is more valuable as A political tool left unsolved... I believe this to be true, Sound to far right? Congress is A joke and A total insult to the intelegence of the american people. There is no excuse for the actions we have seen over the past few years especially. No results, No pay, no vacation, period. Fail to promote A bipartisan congress and participate in that which you were elected to do , your fired via the american people, reguardless of the length of your term, period. Stonewalling and partisan action will be considered A blatant disreguard of your responsibility to the american people and after consideration / confirmation of such via An impartial jurry of your pears shall result in your imediate dismissal... With out Pay! You are failing to preform the job that you were elected to do. Remember the special "Super Commitie" "Gang of Six" what A joke! Just A few of my Wacked Out Ideas that will never see the day of light because those that are "Large and very much In Charge" make all the rules and decide their own pay... Does this even seem remotely fair to the American people in any way shape or form?
I would like to see fundamental change that would offer immediate and noticeable results in A short amount of time... It is what is Nessessary. That is my opinion of A Great Leader and one that still eludes us at this time in my humble opinion.

P.S. Don't sweat the appologie, people are commited to their beliefs. I would prefer to break that mold (Speaking of Self)