Photon app settings and DLI in flower

[lockedshed]

Hi, I have just realised that you have to change the settings in the photon app......I know sorry.

It might explain why im nearly weeks 3 flower with no signs of buds growth?
Ive had it at 67% and its a 730w light so they must of been getting a decent amount of light.
My DLI at that setting was about 63 and ppfd was around 730.


Ive had it set at 24 hours when im 12/12, I've not used a diffuser (read i dont need one on android/Samsung s21) and although im not sure what the default 'source' light is selected, it was probably wrong and I clicked a different one in the menu so I have no idea what it was.

So, I have a Mars hydro fc6500 evo.
According to.google:

The FC6500 EVO is not a standard 3500K "white" light; it uses a specialized mix of 3000K, 5000K, and 660nm Deep Red diodes.
It has around 1530 diodes.

It tells me to select LED - full spectrum, but that is not an option in the photon app.

Also, what DLI/ppfd do you run in early/mid/late flower.

Been seeing charts where people turn it down for flower, which is the opposite of what i thought.

Any help would be great

 

[JIMKSI64]

Ok. First you will need the manufacturers ppfd map so you can see how far off it is.
My selection of 3500k was 5 % off from the map.
It( photon) has a calibration feature. Find out how far off it is and calibrate it up and down till you run out of patience and say it's close enough.
Always use the hot spot to set up but also check the whole map after done. See how weak the corners of the tent are.

 

[lockedshed]

Ok. First you will need the manufacturers ppfd map so you can see how far off it is.
My selection of 3500k was 5 % off from the map.
It( photon) has a calibration feature. Find out how far off it is and calibrate it up and down till you run out of patience and say it's close enough.
Always use the hot spot to set up but also check the whole map after done. See how weak the corners of the tent are..

How do i know which setting in the app to select for my source?

I've attatched the manufacturers map.
Is it measured at 6 and 12 inches?
How does that show me how far I'm off sorry? Is it if I hold my phone 6 and 12 inches away?

My light is located at the top of my tent, just under my inline and has never moved from that position, I just increased the intensity.

If I'm using the wrong settings how could I get close to the picture?

I'll try measuring at 9pm when the lights come on.

 

[JIMKSI64]

Yes. You look at the map and read the legend. It has the hight of the map and the settings on the lights. If it has no mention of power settings assume 100% just pick 3500k and see how far it is off. At 12 inches down look for the highest reading you can find.
When I did light testing I moved the tool across a false bottom of the tent with the panel 20 inches away as the manufacturer has a map for that. My app let me make a grid and snap a trigger and build a par map that was very close. Just choose par map and make a grid and find the highest reading in each grid and poof a file you can print.
This is the tool I use and the app I use.
https://www.amazon.com/UNI-T-Illuminance-Photography-Photometer-Measurement/dp/B09PDGX69B

You choose the sensor or the phones camera and follow directions. You can see I have the lux tool chosen. Just like your phone the tool measures lux and converts.
It ain't perfect but it's good enough

 

[lockedshed]

Yes. You look at the map and read the legend. It has the hight of the map and the settings on the lights. If it has no mention of power settings assume 100% just pick 3500k and see how far it is off. At 12 inches down look for the highest reading you can find.
When I did light testing I moved the tool across a false bottom of the tent with the panel 20 inches away as the manufacturer has a map for that. My app let me make a grid and snap a trigger and build a par map that was very close. Just choose par map and make a grid and find the highest reading in each grid and poof a file you can print.
This is the tool I use and the app I use.
https://www.amazon.com/UNI-T-Illuminance-Photography-Photometer-Measurement/dp/B09PDGX69B
View attachment 2628690
You choose the sensor or the phones camera and follow directions. You can see I have the lux tool chosen. Just like your phone the tool measures lux and converts.
It ain't perfect but it's good enough

I'll be honest, its a little confusing.
I'm overwhelmed in life atm and this growing and learning about each thing is pretty insane, and I've spent a fortune already.

What ppfd/DLI should I then aim for in your experience or opinion after ive set this up? Week 3 flower

 

[Grownsince95]

You're not 3 weeks in flower my brother. I think you may be counting from when you flipped the light to 12/12

 

[Grownsince95]

We were just talking about this in another thread you posted about defoliation. You should be about 3-5 days away from flower day 1.

If you just keep all your questions about the same plants in one thread it's much easier for us to help you out and catch these things.

 

[Grownsince95]

I'll be honest, its a little confusing.
I'm overwhelmed in life atm and this growing and learning about each thing is pretty insane, and I've spent a fortune already.

What ppfd/DLI should I then aim for in your experience or opinion after ive set this up? Week 3 flower

You are 100% correct, it can be overwhelming and confusing. The other side of that coin is, it seems you are also putting a lot of pressure on yourself. Your plants are doing great. Take a deep breath and remind yourself to only focus on the basics and let the plants do the hard work.

You don't have to stress about DLI if you don't have the bandwidth, it takes 30 seconds to look up the recommended settings for your light. You also don't really have to spend another dime until it's time for more food and depending on the prices where you are, this run should "pay" for your whole setup.

Hang in there bud because I'm not gonna lie, it gets harder the rest of the way until you burp your last jar. You're in a good place to get the help you need with the growing stuff, hopefully you have a good support system for the life bullshit, I know how that goes

 

[lockedshed]

You are 100% correct, it can be overwhelming and confusing. The other side of that coin is, it seems you are also putting a lot of pressure on yourself. Your plants are doing great. Take a deep breath and remind yourself to only focus on the basics and let the plants do the hard work.

You don't have to stress about DLI if you don't have the bandwidth, it takes 30 seconds to look up the recommended settings for your light. You also don't really have to spend another dime until it's time for more food and depending on the prices where you are, this run should "pay" for your whole setup.

Hang in there bud because I'm not gonna lie, it gets harder the rest of the way until you burp your last jar. You're in a good place to get the help you need with the growing stuff, hopefully you have a good support system for the life bullshit, I know how that goes

Thanks for the kind words and help.
I'm preparing myself for whats to come.
The only thing i didn't get was the 30 seconds to look up the light settings.
I've spent all day trying to figure out about what DLI and ppfd I should be running at my stage of growth with my light, and how to use the photone app.
Mars hydro have a map but that doesn't help with my situation? and Google says 75% early flower, 100% layer on at 12 - 18 inches.
That would surly be way too much.
Ive read that dli should be lower than veg, again that's conflicting.
Other people tell me different.
You said 3000k plus 10% 660 and Jim said 3500k, thats just two opinions out of many.
Sorry if im rambling, Ive got to go and tackle this in a minute.
You've been great

 

[Grownsince95]

Thanks for the kind words and help.
I'm preparing myself for whats to come.
The only thing i didn't get was the 30 seconds to look up the light settings.
I've spent all day trying to figure out about what DLI and ppfd I should be running at my stage of growth with my light, and how to use the photone app.
Mars hydro have a map but that doesn't help with my situation? and Google says 75% early flower, 100% layer on at 12 - 18 inches.
That would surly be way too much.
Ive read that dli should be lower than veg, again that's conflicting.
Other people tell me different.
You said 3000k plus 10% 660 and Jim said 3500k, thats just two opinions out of many.
Sorry if im rambling, Ive got to go and tackle this in a minute.
You've been great

Your light uses 3000 K diodes it's not a matter of opinion.

DLI can go down in flower if you don't increase the output of the light 1.5x.

With 6 hrs less light (from 18 to 12) a day, if you were running 600 umols in veg, in flower you need 900 umols to keep DLI equal. If you want to bring the juice you go higher to 1100. If your light was too strong in veg and you can't turn it up more than 1.5x, your plants will have a lower DLI in flower. This is not optimal.

 

[Grownsince95]

You have a big powerful light. Hang it high and blast it. It has much better penetration into the canopy at high output.

800 umols at 36" is not the same as 800 umols at 24". Only the very top of the plant is at 800. For every inch you drop, the umols get lower. 12" down in the canopy the plant 36" away is getting more light. Something like 450 umols vs 350. The drop off the next 12" is even more dramatic.

How high above the canopy is it now, and what power setting?

 

[lockedshed]

You have a big powerful light. Hang it high and blast it. It has much better penetration into the canopy at high output.

800 umols at 36" is not the same as 800 umols at 24". Only the very top of the plant is at 800. For every inch you drop, the umols get lower. 12" down in the canopy the plant 36" away is getting more light. Something like 450 umols vs 350. The drop off the next 12" is even more dramatic.

How high above the canopy is it now, and what power setting?

I counted flowering from 12/12 flip. What day should I count from?

My light is 26 inches from the canopy.

I changed the setting in photone app to 12 hours and 3000K + 10% 660.
I've attatched a picture of the app.
That score is about 26 inches from the light at canopy level.
The light is at 80% - 691 ppfd and 30 DLI.
Does seem better than my previous measurements and should I go higher?
I was nervous to go too high intensity incase it effected nute uptake or burned them.

Thanks for all of the help

 

[Grownsince95]

I counted flowering from 12/12 flip. What day should I count from?

My light is 26 inches from the canopy.

I changed the setting in photone app to 12 hours and 3000K + 10% 660.
I've attatched a picture of the app.
That score is about 26 inches from the light at canopy level.
The light is at 80% - 691 ppfd and 30 DLI.
Does seem better than my previous measurements and should I go higher?
I was nervous to go too high intensity incase it effected nute uptake or burned them.

Thanks for all of the help

You're in a good place! You now want to gradually ramp up that DLI to hit 40 in peak flower. Do it in steps.

Start counting flower days when you look at the top of the plant and it looks like a bunch of white buttons on top of the branches. There should be enough white pistils to make a nice contrast and stand out.

 

[lockedshed]

You're in a good place! You now want to gradually ramp up that DLI to hit 40 in peak flower. Do it in steps.

Start counting flower days when you look at the top of the plant and it looks like a bunch of white buttons on top of the branches. There should be enough white pistils to make a nice contrast and stand out.

To get up to 40 DLI later in flower, I'd have to go up to 100% maybe, is that ok to run max for 12 hours with all of my other equipment running?
It'll put off some heat to.

So when I switched the lights to 12/12, the past 3 weeks have been veg still, and will be until the white pistils appear?
That means its been 9 weeks of veg?

 

[Grownsince95]

To get up to 40 DLI later in flower, I'd have to go up to 100% maybe, is that ok to run max for 12 hours with all of my other equipment running?
It'll put off some heat to.

So when I switched the lights to 12/12, the past 3 weeks have been veg still, and will be until the white pistils appear?
That means its been 9 weeks of veg?

So go to 90% and 35 DLI. Still acceptable. Whatever you're comfortable with. The light is safe though.

 

[MercDod]

How to Measure Light With Photone

Get started on measuring light with Photone

growlightmeter.com

 

[JIMKSI64]

I would also remind the grower that the light recommendations especially at the high side are for spot on enviroment and a good nutrition balance with proper watering.
Any one of these stool legs gets kicked out the numbers change.
Watch the plants. Do they have a table level presentation? Does the presentation go 3 or 4 levs down with only the lowers maybe sagging a little.
Are they curling up and the tips turning color? Are they twisting up with new growth or the top pistle bunches getting pale and dry looking.
Do you get limp leafs from to long a dryback ( soil )
Any of these will need a change in light to avoid damage to plant.
Do not drive 40 DLI off a cliff if your plants speed limit is 34 DLI.

 

[Grownsince95]

I would also remind the grower that the light recommendations especially at the high side are for spot on enviroment and a good nutrition balance with proper watering.
Any one of these stool legs gets kicked out the numbers change.
Watch the plants. Do they have a table level presentation? Does the presentation go 3 or 4 levs down with only the lowers maybe sagging a little.
Are they curling up and the tips turning color? Are they twisting up with new growth or the top pistle bunches getting pale and dry looking.
Do you get limp leafs from to long a dryback ( soil )
Any of these will need a change in light to avoid damage to plant.
Do not drive 40 DLI off a cliff if your plants speed limit is 34 DLI.