Probleems In Coco.

[Prevada 13]

Loool

Nice one bro ;).

 

[Srenots]

Hallo guys,

I have at the moment

5x purple wrack reserva privada seedlings
8x bubblegummer female seedlings
All is almost 2 weeks from sprout.
Water (start ec) is 0.4
I used to give just water and canna rhizotonic or plagron power roots thosefirst two weeks

First feed with canna start at 0.7 ec was yasterday


I check today and I found


Pr1View attachment 606635

Pr2
View attachment 606636

Pr3
View attachment 606637

Pr4

View attachment 606638
Bg1
View attachment 606639

Bg2
View attachment 606640

Can anybdoy tells me what is going on?

Thanks for all the help in advance..

you don't mix perlite in your coco? 75% coco to 25% perlite works good....

 

[Prevada 13]

you don't mix perlite in your coco? 75% coco to 25% perlite works good....

First run I used straight coco with hydro rockz on top when I induce flowering it helps keep evaporation alittle down works great.

Second run I add perlite, didnt see any difference honest, plus its too dusty and misy so am back on 100% coco with hydro rockz on top when ai start flower.

 

[Srenots]

ok, well what works for ya , use it bro...theres a million ways to grow....props..

 

[Prevada 13]

ok, well what works for ya , use it bro...theres a million ways to grow....props..

Yes bro, I know what you mean..

I like to defoliate and top etc alot of ppl will go against that.

Just whish I can get good advise regarding this cal\mag with or without RO.

Hopefully more ppl from the community will ingage in this thread.

Thank you for your advise as well srenitos..

Ill see how they will react by the next 3 days before I water again.

Cheers buddy and keep around.

Prevada13

 

[cemchris]

You are hand watering your seedlings correct? Usually when seedlings/clones are transplanted into solo cups and up they wont need to be watered for the first week or so. Def like you are seeing is usually having the watering out of wack when they are young. I never really have had to use calmg with coco when using tap water. Pretty much the most overused nutes. Most base nutes have 4% + in it. You are using calmg and epsom together? If so you are throwing your Mg ratio way out of wack. Shoot for 6:1 Ca/Mg or round there.

 

[Prevada 13]

You are hand watering your seedlings correct? Usually when seedlings/clones are transplanted into solo cups and up they wont need to be watered for the first week or so. Def like you are seeing is usually having the watering out of wack when they are young. I never really have had to use calmg with coco when using tap water. Pretty much the most overused nutes. Most base nutes have 4% + in it. You are using calmg and epsom together? If so you are throwing your Mg ratio way out of wack. Shoot for 6:1 Ca/Mg or round there.

Yes I hand water and only when the pots is almost dry.. I do that only in veg.

In flower i feed regulary as they drink much more.

 

[Prevada 13]

You are hand watering your seedlings correct? Usually when seedlings/clones are transplanted into solo cups and up they wont need to be watered for the first week or so. Def like you are seeing is usually having the watering out of wack when they are young. I never really have had to use calmg with coco when using tap water. Pretty much the most overused nutes. Most base nutes have 4% + in it. You are using calmg and epsom together? If so you are throwing your Mg ratio way out of wack. Shoot for 6:1 Ca/Mg or round there.

What I have done is basically giving the cal mag of water 200/250ppm

Then I have added 100ppm cal mag for one group

And 100 ppm of epson for the second group.

Wouldnt that be the best approach?!

Whats your recommendation?

 

[HugzAndNuggz]

me personally looks like they were to wet for a while.. if your using canna coco a&b i would cancel out the canna start its not really needed in coco id go straight into canna a&b at about 5 ml a gallon and work up from there.. they were wet in the beginning and now your seeing signs after the fact.. they are hungry.. id also with the small pots lift them before you water.. with coco sometimes it will look dry but be soaking wet still... it doesnt need water every day unless you are giving it just what it needs daily or you have a root structure that is allowing it to drink daily no matter how much water you put in it.. with canna coco base you do not need to add cal/mag or anything it has it in it 5% cal and 1 % mag.. wich is plenty i have grown with coco and the canna line a line time just recently switched out to try something new for a little bit but will prob go back when im done playing.... i havnt used a bottle calimagic in years while using canna coco line its not needed
schedule should go something like this for seedlings/clones onto flower
clone/seedlings 5 ml a gallon a&b 15 ml of rhizo
veg/mid veg 5 ml rhizo, 7/10 ml a gallon a&b manipulation if needed some might demand a little more calcium or magnesium so bump the base up maybe 1-2 ml at a time until defeciency is gone
flower/late flower 10/12 ml a gallon some could go to 14 ml if you are not seeing any kind of nitrogen curl, they demmand alot of nitrogen still in that first 2 weeks even on up to 3-4 weeks with some longer running strains,

if your using cannazym, boost, pk 13/14
zym i use 9 ml through veg up to 12 ml in the end of flower
boost i dont add until i actually see the bud sites at 9-12 ml a gallon depending on what week it is
pk i add 6ml gallon at week 4-6 depending on the strain it only gets it for 7 days and it is added when the buds itself start the first swell when the puff balls start stacking

i know you didnt ask for all that but canna does not need any extra cal mag products if you use coco ab that made for coco its designed to work great with it

 

[Prevada 13]

me personally looks like they were to wet for a while.. if your using canna coco a&b i would cancel out the canna start its not really needed in coco id go straight into canna a&b at about 5 ml a gallon and work up from there.. they were wet in the beginning and now your seeing signs after the fact.. they are hungry.. id also with the small pots lift them before you water.. with coco sometimes it will look dry but be soaking wet still... it doesnt need water every day unless you are giving it just what it needs daily or you have a root structure that is allowing it to drink daily no matter how much water you put in it.. with canna coco base you do not need to add cal/mag or anything it has it in it 5% cal and 1 % mag.. wich is plenty i have grown with coco and the canna line a line time just recently switched out to try something new for a little bit but will prob go back when im done playing.... i havnt used a bottle calimagic in years while using canna coco line its not needed
schedule should go something like this for seedlings/clones onto flower
clone/seedlings 5 ml a gallon a&b 15 ml of rhizo
veg/mid veg 5 ml rhizo, 7/10 ml a gallon a&b manipulation if needed some might demand a little more calcium or magnesium so bump the base up maybe 1-2 ml at a time until defeciency is gone
flower/late flower 10/12 ml a gallon some could go to 14 ml if you are not seeing any kind of nitrogen curl, they demmand alot of nitrogen still in that first 2 weeks even on up to 3-4 weeks with some longer running strains,

if your using cannazym, boost, pk 13/14
zym i use 9 ml through veg up to 12 ml in the end of flower
boost i dont add until i actually see the bud sites at 9-12 ml a gallon depending on what week it is
pk i add 6ml gallon at week 4-6 depending on the strain it only gets it for 7 days and it is added when the buds itself start the first swell when the puff balls start stacking

i know you didnt ask for all that but canna does not need any extra cal mag products if you use coco ab that made for coco its designed to work great with it

Thank you for the information, If you went through the whole post ull find that I use plagron nutes.

 

[Prevada 13]

Today no more signs of more damage..

I believe that the issue has stopped with both group one and group two!

However, they are not lush green!

Next feeding ill use my tap water and raise the ppm to 350, 0.5 ec and use 0.5 ec of canna start.

 

[Keekee]

I think hugz is right on this one.Very helpfully posting hugznnuggz

 

[cemchris]

What I have done is basically giving the cal mag of water 200/250ppm

Then I have added 100ppm cal mag for one group

And 100 ppm of epson for the second group.

Wouldnt that be the best approach?!

Whats your recommendation?

Are you using their Coco formula? Does the bottle happen to list the Mg content? Couldn't find it on their website. They listed CA at 4.5% for the Coco's. Also do any of your nutes already have silica in it? Too much silica (which usually has a lot of K in it) will lockout Ca and cause problems like you are seeing. If you continue seeing problems like this and are not using base nutes on the first water I would: 1- start using the base nutes from the first feed and on making sure they have exactly what they need. 2- with RO you "might" have to add a little calmg at the very beginning to offset coco locking those nutes up when it's fresh. That also comes down to the brand. This is something I never practice cause I usually hit them pretty hard day 1 and on. Might be something you are running into. Just don't play into all the witchcraft about coco. It's a medium like any other medium. Also remember K.I.S.S. Less is more.

 

[Prevada 13]

It seems that no body really reads the whole posts, and everybody just write what works for them or say just general info regarding cultivation in coco but no body really knows what plants need in coco..

Are you using their Coco formula? Does the bottle happen to list the Mg content? Couldn't find it on their website. They listed CA at 4.5% for the Coco's. Also do any of your nutes already have silica in it? Too much silica (which usually has a lot of K in it) will lockout Ca and cause problems like you are seeing. If you continue seeing problems like this and are not using base nutes on the first water I would: 1- start using the base nutes from the first feed and on making sure they have exactly what they need. 2- with RO you "might" have to add a little calmg at the very beginning to offset coco locking those nutes up when it's fresh. That also comes down to the brand. This is something I never practice cause I usually hit them pretty hard day 1 and on. Might be something you are running into. Just don't play into all the witchcraft about coco. It's a medium like any other medium. Also remember K.I.S.S. Less is more.

Thanks alot for your comments, I mean no insult to any body but
It seems that no body really reads the whole posts except you , and everybody just give some jeudges and write what works for them or say just general info regarding cultivation in coco but no body really knows what plants need to be coco and no body can define the probleems when it happens in coco except if its very obvious cal or mag for sure (can be my case but the symptomos are mixed between dien tips in some plants, some other get looks alike mag, some other one get narcotic dots like cal etc)..

Am not an experience grower but am also not a newbie. Am not overwatering and I watch all the other factors....

Indeed the silica might be a factor ill stop this for now, thank you for reminding me by the silica thing..

Here is some pics of the nuets I usualy use, however I used just canna start till now.
Coco A

4.5% calcium
Coco B

(they dont mention how much mg exactly is in)
Whats strange that they advise ph of 5.5 on thier website! I really doubt if I SHOULD adjust my ph to 5.5!

Also this is a good read from canna website

What is the difference between soft/hard and/or bad water and what can you do about it?
Soft water has an EC level of below 0.4. With CANNA CALMAG AGENT you can raise your EC level to 0.4.

Normal water has an EC level between 0.4 and 0.7. It contains calcium, magnesium and bicarbonate to stabilise the pH. All CANNA products are designed to work best with this type of water.

Hard water (EC>0.8) contains more calcium and magnesium than the plant can handle. When you’re growing plants, the best way to treat this kind of water is to use a reverse osmosis filter and then mix your hard water with the R.O. water, until you reach an EC level of 0.4. Or, more easily, you can use 100% R.O. water and then use CANNA CALMAG AGENT to raise your EC level to 0.4.

Bad water (EC>0.8) contains mainly sodium and chloride. These two elements block the uptake of nutrients and can even become toxic to your plants. With a reverse osmosis filter, you can remove both these elements. But making a mixture of R.O. water and bad water will not bring in enough calcium and magnesium, only bicarbonate to stabilise the pH. Make a mixture of R.O water with the bad water until you reach an EC of 0.2 and then add CANNA CALMAG Agent to this water until you reach an EC level of 0.4, or use 100% R.O. water in combination with CANNA CALMAG AGENT until you reach EC level 0.4

How can you test the difference between hard water and bad water?
The best way to find out is to:

1. ask your water supplier
2. have your water analysed (done by an official laboratory)

You can also test the water yourself using an EC meter and 2 small tests based on colour indication. First, measure the EC to be sure it is notSOFT or NORMAL water:

• EC 0.0-0.3: the water is SOFT
• EC 0.4-0.7: the water is Normal

** conclusion.

Thier nutes suppose to work within the 0.4 and 0.7 ec

If some strains require more cal mag and I see guys who hit thier ppm of cal mag to 250 and some others up to 350 ppm of cal mag..

And since I raised my base for the two groups to 350ppm of cal mag the probleem has stopped,While I have increased the total ec to 1 instead of the 0.7 ec first feeding!

Thats why I doubt now should I continue with the 350 cal mag next feeding also or drop it to 250 ppm and give an ec of 1 again?

Should I continue still canna start or transfer to plagron coco?

 

[Prevada 13]

Oh I forgot to mention that the first I got the GDP it has slight mg def.

I have feed it 1.5 ec with 230ppm cal/mag base after RO
Silica
Plagron aB
And punch of mag

She for sure has improved and growing..

Some pics

Pw 1

Pw2

Pw3

Tips are yellowing and start getten yellow between viens

Pw 4

Pw 5

All

Am not sure but ai would say that the group that toke extra mag has done alittle better and the ones who toke extra cal alittle worse
And tgey show more yellow between viens and looks like more mag def

Extra cal

Extra mag

 

[cemchris]

Try just using the epsom and not the calmg. Give it a try and start hitting the nutes day 1 with a little of epsom see if that helps. Other then that man you are on the right track for looking at the pics of the last run.

 

[Prevada 13]

Try just using the epsom and not the calmg. Give it a try and start hitting the nutes day 1 with a little of epsom see if that helps. Other then that man you are on the right track for looking at the pics of the last run.

Can you please check this out

In here its mentioned that the water suppose to be 0.5 ms/cm

Does that means 0.5 ec?
250ppm?

My tap water is exactly 180ppm or alittle bit under 0.4 ec what equals 0.4 ec

Do you think that I should add 70ppm of mag to my tab water to reach 0.5 ec before I add my base nutes?

Also the ph they recommend 5.5

Should I stick to my 5.8 or should I go this low as per thier recommendation?

Thanks for help bro.

 

[cemchris]

5.5 is a little weird for coco. I would stick to what you are using. Yeah try adding the epsom to hit that target and see if they pull out. Trail and error.

 

[HugzAndNuggz]

yeah sorry i didnt read anymore of the posts just the first one you put up the question that was at hand.. i seen canna start and plagron roots nothing else stated until further into the post.... plagron looks like is about the same as canna line for coco i checked out there website.. they want you to run a very high ec 1.5 from the very beginning imo thats a little warm.. i do usually hit with at least 1 ec in coco and only give them just enough water the first couple times walk the roots so it fills your container up then you can water until runoff.. i do let my ph fluctuate from 5.5-5.9.. i dont use r/0 water alot anymore when my tap comes out at .1-.2 ec so its even lower than yours... i dont add calcium or magnesium when i am running a coco formula no need they have more added to the bases just for that reason..

compositionCocos A: Water, calcium nitrate, magnesium nitrate, potassium nitrate. NPK-fertilizer (4-0-1). 3.9% Total nitrogen (N) of which 3.9% nitrate nitrogen (NO 3 ), 1% water-soluble potassium oxide (K 2 O), 4.5% of calcium (Ca).
Cocos B: Water, magnesiumulfaat, magnesium nitrate, mono-potassium phosphate, phosphoric acid. NPK fertilizer (1-4-2). 1% Total nitrogen (N) including 1% nitrate nitrogen (NO 3 ), 4.1% of water-soluble phosphorus pentoxide (P 2 O 5 ), 2.4% water-soluble potassium oxide (K 2 O). Information for users USA, on heavy metals, please click here .

to me it looks like all that calcium and magnesium your adding is overkill and could potentially be locking things out its a coco formula it has plenty of calcium and magnesium in it if used correctly..


heres an image that help me determine issues when i started with coco i mean the chart can be for anything but it does help

noticing from this chart calcium and potassium are both needed to uptake magnesium.. you need nitrogen to keep the potassium and magnesium uptakes going strong...
so me personally with your replies to everyone id cut out the cal mag cause your ec of your water is already at .4 unless your gonna use r/0 water wich you could add back about .1-.2 ec of cal mag but honestly not needed from my experience.. and get your EC needed from your base nutrients your lacking your MAIN npk ratios.. i went through the same trials and errors like this... just my opinion but i believe you have a heavy water hand and your npk is out of wack.. i know i did not anymore though i give them what they need daily until the roots are expanded enough so i can add until runoff and come back in the next day and it need to be watered again

 

[HugzAndNuggz]

isn't the ratio for calcium-magnesium a 3-1? so with one being to high or to low could cause issues couldn't it?