Green Giant
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Yeah but that bullpup is gonna put rounds down the street into the neighbors kitchen. Hell, maybe the raced-up glock too for that matter. Of course the right operator will place those tacks with precision, but for typical home defense situations it's not uncommon for combat-naive firearms owner (most of them) to be so disoriented as to put themselves/family/bystanders into even more danger, stray rounds being just one of many.If you are serious about being able to wreck shit.
El Cerebro, I cannot argue with any of your points.
I have to say that actually having to employ a firearm, even if only to brandish, is the last thing that any sensible person wants.
But then there are lots of dumbasses.
.243 or .243 AI in a long barreled bolt action with a 1 in 7 twist will go a mile before going transsonic, at a decent elevation on a warm day with 115 gr DTACs with a .585 BC.
With a Whidden bullet-pointing die, you could get the DTACs to a legitimate .6 BC.
Best thing one can do with a .308 parent case if one is going for trajectory.
Beats 6.5mm for long range performance.
I have seen .284s at .7+ BC I think.
.284 Shehane looks pretty neat.
What's his GA Precision guy was talking about dtacs out of his 26" barrel @ 3150.
JBM Ballistics shows 1 mile+ @ 2500 ft and 75 degrees before down to mach 1. Instability around 1200 fps, right?
Not like I could hit anything, but they could be lobbed in.
Best trajectory w/a.308 case, if the calc is accurate.
I think it was a 180 gr .284 I saw with the awesome BC, was it a Berger?
6mmbr.com was a fantastic resource for figures.
But you F-class types would know way more than I.
The beats 6.5 reference was only in terms of off the .308 parent case. Lower BC, higher speed. I used to be a big fan of the idea of 6.5, but trying to figure out some good long-range strategies that are very low on recoil. More well-aimed shots per unit of time type of thing.
Seeing how 6.5 grendel necked to 6mm is superior in many ways IMO to the original 6.5 grendel case.
Trajectory-wise, anyways.
Thanks for the insights, Bluenote.
Oh boy , another rifle nut. In retrospect my reply to you seemed a bit terse , apology for that , I sometimes see '.308' and get a bit pissy since some folks think it's the be-all end all.
And I shouldn't since of course it's right in their with 7.62 x 54 r and .30-06 ballistically. And yes it was the Berger at 180 , my goTo longrange slug choice in .284 , and you'll note Hardy , Ballard and others are tearing up F class with .284s , nice balance between 6.5 and .30 , better barrel life , less recoil than the stout .30s etc.etc.
And strangely enough , though I've experimented with a great many .284s/7mms I keep coming back to the basic 7mm Rem mag as the best overall compromise as regards the various applicable factors. A lot of folks have gone to the SAUM and the WSM , personally I don't see any great benefit over the 7mm rem-mag , I'm seeing similar velocities out of the same length barrels. The shorter action is a positive for some folks but for me " shrug"
And barrels in SAUM , WSM or 7mmSTW are gone a *lot* sooner than in 7mm rem-mg.
I think maybe I read something about the short, fat cases getting the same MV from less powder due to increased combustion efficiency or something. Can't remember where or anything.
At this point I would like a Kel-tec RFB with a 22" .243 barrel. It would suffice for long range, and be a good entry gun. Good for carrying into and out of buildings and vehicles, etc when compared directly to AR carbines.
Stan Crist had some things to say about a proposed "6mm optimum" cartridge, that would be just shy of a .243. 100 gr vld, .540 BC, 3000 fps, that sort of thing. .243 out of a semi-auto would probably run about those figures.
I know, I know, I just said Kel-tec. The shame.
7mm mag for sure would have the advantage of standardized and readily available brass and reloading equipment I bet.
I thought everybody had a clear understanding of the limitations of the .308 case lol.
155 gr Lapua at .508 seems the best arrangement. 155 Berger after being run through a bullet-pointing die is alleged to match that performance, and Bergers from what I read are more suitable for hunting than, for instance, that 155 Lapua. But don't know from experience.
that's a big closet there, hefty set of reloading toys, must be pretty organized to keep track of all that matched-brass
I didnt read all your other posts about guns, But I can tell you, You can in way have over 10 rounds in any gun in CA if you have a bullet button on it. Go to cal guns and use there flow charts to make sure you have your gun legal. If you get caught with a BB and a 20 round clip in it you will never be able to own a gun again, they will charge you with a assult weepon.Bullet button
Kel-tec RFB
8.1 lb 9.6 loaded 20 rd mag
.308
18" barrel
27.5" OAL
.
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