Schwer's First Grow Evah! Planning, Prep and Grow

[Smithers]

As for pullin em out and smoochin on em you can forget that in a few weeks, the less you do to em the less you’ll do to em. Nothin like those oh shit moments to make ya wanna turn back the clock about 30 seconds and not do that thing you just did, so far in, so close to the end, bam crash wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Yeah man, sketchy af moving plants around after the buds get real heavy and the stalks can barely hold them up while staying stationary. Harvest day a few months ago I “half” dropped one on the ground, soft landing. Would have been awful if it was any other day and it needed to go back in. Certainly possible to do maintenance, but be careful if they entangle together to any degree, esp near the end.

 

[Schwer]

I hear you guys loud and clear. I will reduce the number of times I take my plants out for a smooch to 10% of my previous average, and will therefore only smooch them twice per day going forward.

Day 45, Day 3 of Flower/Transition

I have some some questions today about defoliation and LST at this point in the grow (super early flower/veg to flower transition). I'll bold it below for anyone who doesn't care about the little updates.

I gave the tent 2 days on the 12/12 cycle without changing light intensity, so today I adjusted my lights back to ~20-24" above the canopy and increased average PPFD by ~50. Center of the tent is getting mid to high 500's and the the middle edges are getting high 400's to mid 500's (PPFD). Far edges are probably low 400's high 300's. I'll continue to increase that slowly until I get to around 800 or whatever the plants like best.

The plants need to be watered every two days now and it looks like they'll be due for one by this afternoon or evening. Per the Stoneington feed guide I should be adding in a bit less than a quarter cup of Fish Bone Meal as a top dress this first week. That stuff absolutely stinks btw. I might add it today, or wait until the next watering which will still be within the first week of flower.

Here's the crew as of this morning:

Defoliation Question:

I noticed some defoliation opportunities this morning and thought I would take care of those while I was in the tent for a watering later this afternoon. Then I started thinking about the plants going through this transition into the flower and wondered whether or not even a light defoliation would be a good idea at this point. I'd really like to do it because some bud sites are really being blocked right now, and then there are still some large leaves on the underside of the canopy that aren't getting much light anyway.

So I'm wondering whether I should...
1. Trim the leaves on top blocking bud sights
2. Trim the leaves blocking bud sites AND the lower fan leaves in the dark
3. Tuck leaves like its my job
4. Leave well enough alone for the time being

Some pics of my potential murder victims ...

No worries if no one has any definitive ideas. My default move will be twice daily tucking until I'm able to do a more serious defoliation... maybe.

 

[Lilolme]

I hear you guys loud and clear. I will reduce the number of times I take my plants out for a smooch to 10% of my previous average, and will therefore only smooch them twice per day going forward.

Day 45, Day 3 of Flower/Transition

I have some some questions today about defoliation and LST at this point in the grow (super early flower/veg to flower transition). I'll bold it below for anyone who doesn't care about the little updates.

I gave the tent 2 days on the 12/12 cycle without changing light intensity, so today I adjusted my lights back to ~20-24" above the canopy and increased average PPFD by ~50. Center of the tent is getting mid to high 500's and the the middle edges are getting high 400's to mid 500's (PPFD). Far edges are probably low 400's high 300's. I'll continue to increase that slowly until I get to around 800 or whatever the plants like best.

The plants need to be watered every two days now and it looks like they'll be due for one by this afternoon or evening. Per the Stoneington feed guide I should be adding in a bit less than a quarter cup of Fish Bone Meal as a top dress this first week. That stuff absolutely stinks btw. I might add it today, or wait until the next watering which will still be within the first week of flower.

Here's the crew as of this morning:

View attachment 1154291

Defoliation Question:

I noticed some defoliation opportunities this morning and thought I would take care of those while I was in the tent for a watering later this afternoon. Then I started thinking about the plants going through this transition into the flower and wondered whether or not even a light defoliation would be a good idea at this point. I'd really like to do it because some bud sites are really being blocked right now, and then there are still some large leaves on the underside of the canopy that aren't getting much light anyway.

So I'm wondering whether I should...
1. Trim the leaves on top blocking bud sights
2. Trim the leaves blocking bud sites AND the lower fan leaves in the dark
3. Tuck leaves like its my job
4. Leave well enough alone for the time being

Some pics of my potential murder victims ...

View attachment 1154298
View attachment 1154297

No worries if no one has any definitive ideas. My default move will be twice daily tucking until I'm able to do a more serious defoliation... maybe.

I just pretend I’m a deer roamin through the foliage nibblin off a few leaves every day. If you have reason to remove it, remove it. Coverin up somethin I would rather see is my top reason for pluckin em. You still usin scissors or have you figured out to let your thumbnail grow out a little and just pinch em off?

 

[Lilolme]

Bout every 3 days I do a little pluck some leave a lot, long leggy lower leaves go, leaves growin towards the center go, big leaves up top go if they are blockin a future tasty nugget, I leave four big leaves at the top and snip them as the nugget gets taller and makes more leaves. You will develop a system

 

[SweetLeafGrow]

For my grow, which is still my first, I removed all leaves on the lower 1/3 of the plants and actually took fairly few of them off up higher. Not sure if that is the best way to do it or not but that was how I did it. There are a lot of flowers in the lower part, basically every node going down the branch, and most of them don't get a lot of light, but they are still doing fairly well, could be better I guess. I might have to try defoliating more next time and see if there is a difference. I did not want to remove leaves that are at the top of the flowers, or others so I basically just tucked them out of the way for flowers below. If I were to do a lot of leaf removal because of blocking light to the lower flowers, I would have had to take most of them off. I think they are important to keeping the photosynthesis going through flower so I left and tucked.

Like I said, I may try a different approach and see for myself if it helps or not. I've seen folks do it both ways.

BTW, your grow is coming right along and lookin good!

 

[Lilolme]

I kinda just sculpted the colas on this one as long as I could, there came a point when I was tyin the branches up instead of down and I couldn’t get to the back at all so I gave up and let her go, hittin it right now over a year later and got much more in jars still. The age old defoil argument is as strong as ever, there is no right or wrong just do your thing and if it don’t suit you do something else next time. Bet you didn’t know that by the end of this grow your gonna be happy its over I have done back to back and its a pain I needed a break. Took a year off

 

[Schwer]

Thanks guys, your advice and personal experience is very much appreciated. I'll go ahead and do some of that defoliation as planned when I water today (they didn't seem to need it yesterday), and I will do so with a little more confidence.

Bet you didn’t know that by the end of this grow your gonna be happy its over I have done back to back and its a pain I needed a break. Took a year off

You would be incorrect on that one, lol. I'm enjoying the grow very much but will be super glad when its over. I think I'd like to try one or two grows annually depending on what else I have going on, and not back-to-back if I can avoid it. That would probably be more than enough for the likes of me anyway.

 

[Smithers]

I hear you guys loud and clear. I will reduce the number of times I take my plants out for a smooch to 10% of my previous average, and will therefore only smooch them twice per day going forward.

Day 45, Day 3 of Flower/Transition

I have some some questions today about defoliation and LST at this point in the grow (super early flower/veg to flower transition). I'll bold it below for anyone who doesn't care about the little updates.

I gave the tent 2 days on the 12/12 cycle without changing light intensity, so today I adjusted my lights back to ~20-24" above the canopy and increased average PPFD by ~50. Center of the tent is getting mid to high 500's and the the middle edges are getting high 400's to mid 500's (PPFD). Far edges are probably low 400's high 300's. I'll continue to increase that slowly until I get to around 800 or whatever the plants like best.

The plants need to be watered every two days now and it looks like they'll be due for one by this afternoon or evening. Per the Stoneington feed guide I should be adding in a bit less than a quarter cup of Fish Bone Meal as a top dress this first week. That stuff absolutely stinks btw. I might add it today, or wait until the next watering which will still be within the first week of flower.

Here's the crew as of this morning:

View attachment 1154291

Defoliation Question:

I noticed some defoliation opportunities this morning and thought I would take care of those while I was in the tent for a watering later this afternoon. Then I started thinking about the plants going through this transition into the flower and wondered whether or not even a light defoliation would be a good idea at this point. I'd really like to do it because some bud sites are really being blocked right now, and then there are still some large leaves on the underside of the canopy that aren't getting much light anyway.

So I'm wondering whether I should...
1. Trim the leaves on top blocking bud sights
2. Trim the leaves blocking bud sites AND the lower fan leaves in the dark
3. Tuck leaves like its my job
4. Leave well enough alone for the time being

Some pics of my potential murder victims ...

View attachment 1154298
View attachment 1154297

No worries if no one has any definitive ideas. My default move will be twice daily tucking until I'm able to do a more serious defoliation... maybe.

I defoliate A LOT more than average I think. I’m brutal, learned from db’s threads how he do. Tucking for me is situational and I do that a lot in veg to avoid hurting a young plant. I start to pull leaves increasingly towards end of veg, and tucking is a good practice the full run but after stretch the growth is way way slower and I rarely need to. Mine sort of just sit there gaining weight. I’ve heard after 2-3 weeks in flower it’s better to stop pulling leaves (sure this is debated) so I thin out anything that is in the way pretty hard approaching flip, then a week or so in anything that catches my attention. To be noted, I grow way taller plants that aren’t dense to begin with.

I also take off what will become popcorn buds, and thin up the low branches for airflow.

Gotta say I really like your marked up pictures. I love the info a simple doodle overlay can convey. I’d trim all the leaves you marked in red, just me tho.

 

[Smithers]

Thanks guys, your advice and personal experience is very much appreciated. I'll go ahead and do some of that defoliation as planned when I water today (they didn't seem to need it yesterday), and I will do so with a little more confidence.



You would be incorrect on that one, lol. I'm enjoying the grow very much but will be super glad when its over. I think I'd like to try one or two grows annually depending on what else I have going on, and not back-to-back if I can avoid it. That would probably be more than enough for the likes of me anyway.

Also, I’ve heard that it’s better to water at lights on instead of in the afternoon or evening. Depends on what works for your schedule. Your afternoon might be lights on, but yeah.

 

[FourPlants]

So happy I don't have to even consider how much or when to water. All I haz to do is steer the dingy

 

[Lilolme]

Thanks guys, your advice and personal experience is very much appreciated. I'll go ahead and do some of that defoliation as planned when I water today (they didn't seem to need it yesterday), and I will do so with a little more confidence.



You would be incorrect on that one, lol. I'm enjoying the grow very much but will be super glad when its over. I think I'd like to try one or two grows annually depending on what else I have going on, and not back-to-back if I can avoid it. That would probably be more than enough for the likes of me anyway.

I prefer the winter months, I aint got a lot to do outside, don’t have to worry bout the fungus gnats so much, much cooler obviously easier to deal with the heat from the lights, way less humidity, its much easier to add humidity than it is to remove it, don’t have to worry about light infiltration from windows and such which I have in my intended dedicated room that I haven’t even started on yet. My last grow was done in March so I would get goin in early October. May have to heat the room I can do that with an electric heater the room is very well insulated. Just a thought

 

[Schwer]

Thanks again, guys!

I watered and defoliated this morning, and I was very liberal with the ole sterilized scissors (nails aren't long enough for the pinch). Despite my plants being very short I was able to clear out enough from the bottom and center to improve airflow beneath the canopy by about 1000%. I also took out a large number of center-growing fan leaves that were blocking middle branches and potential sites. I'm certain that airflow and light coverage improved, I just hope I didn't take off enough to shock them or otherwise piss them off because my defoliation pile seemed huge!

But then I come back an hour later and I see about 20 more I'd like to pluck off. I won't though... my scissors have been holstered.

Holy hell, you can almost see the other side of the tent!

I said I wasn't going to do anymore LST but I did do some gentle tie downs here-or-there just to get more light and space where I felt like it was needed.

Water today was 3.5 liters per pot of RO mixed mixed with some magnesium sulfate at 1 teaspoon per gallon. I had a little more runoff than I wanted today so I'm going to back off to 3 liters each again at the next watering. It wasn't a lot of runoff, but I'm aiming for just a few drops here or there. I also decided to top dress with about 1/5 cup per plant of CoM Fish Bone Meal per the Stoneington feed guide. I was going to wait but then read that fish bone meal is more of a slow-release fert so adding now seemed reasonable.

Temps have risen in the tent due to increased wattage on the LED's and maybe the added LED height heating more of the tent. Average daytime tent temps had been 80F, and today I saw them reach 86F (leaf temps ~82F at that time). I've adjusted the lung room a little to keep the tent temp closer to 82F. Humidity has been pretty easy to keep between 55 and 65%.

I really appreciate everyone's advice and comments on this little journey. Helps more than you know!

 

[Lilolme]

Thanks again, guys!

I watered and defoliated this morning, and I was very liberal with the ole sterilized scissors (nails aren't long enough for the pinch). Despite my plants being very short I was able to clear out enough from the bottom and center to improve airflow beneath the canopy by about 1000%. I also took out a large number of center-growing fan leaves that were blocking middle branches and potential sites. I'm certain that airflow and light coverage improved, I just hope I didn't take off enough to shock them or otherwise piss them off because my defoliation pile seemed huge!

But then I come back an hour later and I see about 20 more I'd like to pluck off. I won't though... my scissors have been holstered.

View attachment 1154613

Holy hell, you can almost see the other side of the tent!

View attachment 1154614


I said I wasn't going to do anymore LST but I did do some gentle tie downs here-or-there just to get more light and space where I felt like it was needed.

Water today was 3.5 liters per pot of RO mixed mixed with some magnesium sulfate at 1 teaspoon per gallon. I had a little more runoff than I wanted today so I'm going to back off to 3 liters each again at the next watering. It wasn't a lot of runoff, but I'm aiming for just a few drops here or there. I also decided to top dress with about 1/5 cup per plant of CoM Fish Bone Meal per the Stoneington feed guide. I was going to wait but then read that fish bone meal is more of a slow-release fert so adding now seemed reasonable.

Temps have risen in the tent due to increased wattage on the LED's and maybe the added LED height heating more of the tent. Average daytime tent temps had been 80F, and today I saw them reach 86F (leaf temps ~82F at that time). I've adjusted the lung room a little to keep the tent temp closer to 82F. Humidity has been pretty easy to keep between 55 and 65%.

I really appreciate everyone's advice and comments on this little journey. Helps more than you know!

Your gonna get to see how strong they are when they start pullin on the ties reachin for the light

 

[Schwer]

Your gonna get to see how strong they are when they start pullin on the ties reachin for the light

?

 

[SweetLeafGrow]

I also decided to top dress with about 1/5 cup per plant of CoM Fish Bone Meal per the Stoneington feed guide. I was going to wait but then read that fish bone meal is more of a slow-release fert so adding now seemed reasonable.

I think this was a good decision. I have read nothing but good about using the fish bone meal.

I think I said this before, but in case I didn't, my original plan was to use the whole Coast of Maine line for my grow. I found a deal on the Stonington Platinum organic soil so I bought 4 bags. But when I tried to order the recommended amendments they have for this soil, they were unavailable or at a way inflated price I was unwilling to pay. I did end up getting some organic fish bone meal that I used in lieu of their fish bone meal blend. I pretty much followed their directions for it, except I was a week late getting the last top dressing toward the end of flower. In spite of that error, the flowers are maturing well and swelling fairly well in the last week or so before harvest. And it doesn't appear adding it late did any damage whatsoever, only helped so far from what I can see.

I sorta took a gamble with it because I have been using the Roots Organics Terp Tea line up. But after studying their protocol, I decided the fish bone meal was necessary at the end of flower to get the best results. I had also done a top dressing at the same time you are in my grow, right before I flipped if I remember right, 2 top dressing in total for the whole grow. I have heard you can over do it so less is most likely more. I used 1/4 cup in 5 gal pots.

 

[Schwer]

@SweetLeafGrow Thanks for that info, especially the bit about it being possible to overdo it with the FBM. I didn't know if that was the case or not so I used about 2/3 of a quarter cup per 3 gal pot. Glad I did!

Also, if my grow ends up looking 1/10 as good as yours I'll be happy

 

[Schwer]

I'd be curious to know what you guys think of this apparent continued mag deficiency.

History: We diagnosed this as an apparent mag deficiency about two weeks ago, likely because I use RO water that I make here at home. To combat the issue I've been adding a teaspoon of mag sulfate (epsom salts) per gallon of RO at every watering since that time.

As of now all three of the Blackberry Kush's still look about like this. The GDP's look better but they're showing signs on their lower fan leaves (thanks to whoever linked that info about nute mobility/immobility btw). I'm not sure if I should try adding a little more mag sulfate at my next watering or if the continued mag deficiency in spite of my efforts is morel likely a sign of a mild intake or root issue. I'm not too concerned because the plants are still stretching and are otherwise looking healthy. I'd still like to do right by them though.

Looking up possible solutions now...

 

[SweetLeafGrow]

I'd be curious to know what you guys think of this apparent continued mag deficiency.

View attachment 1155625

History: We diagnosed this as an apparent mag deficiency about two weeks ago, likely because I use RO water that I make here at home. To combat the issue I've been adding a teaspoon of mag sulfate (epsom salts) per gallon of RO at every watering since that time.

As of now all three of the Blackberry Kush's still look about like this. The GDP's look better but they're showing signs on their lower fan leaves (thanks to whoever linked that info about nute mobility/immobility btw). I'm not sure if I should try adding a little more mag sulfate at my next watering or if the continued mag deficiency in spite of my efforts is morel likely a sign of a mild intake or root issue. I'm not too concerned because the plants are still stretching and are otherwise looking healthy. I'd still like to do right by them though.

Looking up possible solutions now...

Are you giving calcium too? If not, you should incorporate that too.

Are we talking the old leaves here? I know when I had this problem, the leaves never did fully recover back to normal look but new growth did not have the same issues from then on out. How does the new growth look?

 

[Schwer]

Are you giving calcium too? If not, you should incorporate that too.

Are we talking the old leaves here? I know when I had this problem, the leaves never did fully recover back to normal look but new growth did not have the same issues from then on out. How does the new growth look?

That pic pretty much shows it all. The big fan leaf on the left is older growth, the light green leaves on the right are the new new growth, but you can see that the fan leaves just prior to the new growth are also impacted.

I don't do anything for cal. I figured if I didn't see any particular signs of a cal deficiency there was no need to add the cal. Now that I think of it, its not too much of a stretch to assume to the two are intrinsically related seeing as how they're usually mentioned together.

 

[Lilolme]

That pic pretty much shows it all. The big fan leaf on the left is older growth, the light green leaves on the right are the new new growth, but you can see that the fan leaves just prior to the new growth are also impacted.

I don't do anything for cal. I figured if I didn't see any particular signs of a cal deficiency there was no need to add the cal. Now that I think of it, its not too much of a stretch to assume to the two are intrinsically related seeing as how they're usually mentioned together.

I boost mine with cal/mag everytime even waterin my spring water ppm runs pretty low 30 ppm ish right now, I always bring my mix up with cal/mag to about 200ppm before I add nutes as well as just waterin