Spectrum King Leds - Anybod Using These?

[Wisher619]

@Djloud
i believe you will be pleasantly suprised at the results comparitive to the SK...I do like the SK...but I am starting to realize that the owner isnt....how do I say this ....maybe as honest as he states.....point 1 ....the LED's that he has been running against...are literally bottom of the garbage pale.....In one of his videos he states that with the illumitex I believe he couldnt find any specs on how far to hang above canopy and he states that the company has no info....On there website it states specifically for cannabis 18-24" above canopy.....when he does light test he only test below center....never on the outer edges where there is significant dropoff on many lights but for some....not so much...he acts like he dosnt know much but at the same time super arrogant like he knows everything.....There are alot of people out there that know what they are doing....one of the reasons why that company hasnt been as big a hit as it should already be....
IMO....if they were really as badass as stated...the entire community would be on board

 

[basseye]

What page is it on

the last page.
@tags420 said this right after posting pics of a real nice commercial op so maybe you got mezmerized like i did lol.

"Before SK's mkr upgrade they were using second bin xbd's. Owner showed the invoice for the chips. So I can only believe they are using second bin mkr's now too unless shown otherwise.
But let's assume the are using top bin mkr 4k's..."H4".
Go the to cree's PCT and compare across the board any cree chips you want
http://pct.cree.com/dt/index.html

SK uses hlg240-36's and runs 8 parallel strings per driver at ~850ma/string a
SK with H4's at that current will hit ~125lm/w.
While the top bin cobs(3070 and 3590) are doing ~160-172lm/w at the base value level 1400ma.
Similar QER(quantum efficiency rating) including sk's monos making lumens comparisons fair.
Long story short...about 25-35% improvement over the SK...for half the cost per watt at the retail level, then being able to DIY for less is where the argument against SK comes from. And like I mentioned, it's unsure about what bins sk uses and could be an even bigger difference.

And at the end of the day for the average joe...they can DIY a light and save even more and get even better performance per their dollar.

SK is good and they work, but there is better and cheaper led's plus hps is still a ahead of SK."

 

[Wisher619]

@Djloud
was just wondering...what hps lights are you running with your SK's....from the reflection on the wall and the coloration...it seems to be a few
I would like to see someone run them solo to see what they do....like isolation booth with no other light sources.....
@km1....since you have the sk anyways....I would run it supplemental with you hps....see what that does for you....I would think major frost with monster colas

 

[Djloud]

@Djloud
i believe you will be pleasantly suprised at the results comparitive to the SK...I do like the SK...but I am starting to realize that the owner isnt....how do I say this ....maybe as honest as he states.....point 1 ....the LED's that he has been running against...are literally bottom of the garbage pale.....In one of his videos he states that with the illumitex I believe he couldnt find any specs on how far to hang above canopy and he states that the company has no info....On there website it states specifically for cannabis 18-24" above canopy.....when he does light test he only test below center....never on the outer edges where there is significant dropoff on many lights but for some....not so much...he acts like he dosnt know much but at the same time super arrogant like he knows everything.....There are alot of people out there that know what they are doing....one of the reasons why that company hasnt been as big a hit as it should already be....
IMO....if they were really as badass as stated...the entire community would be on board

I have a lux meter and at canopy level u get at least 50000 lux anywhere in the 4x4. In the middle u get over 70000 and this is well over 2 ft. If u take a lux meter to a 400+ at 18 inches it reads about 120000 lux so they did not lie about there intensity. This light is so bright if u have it 18 inches from canopy u risk bleaching

 

[Djloud]

I have a lux meter and at canopy level u get at least 50000 lux anywhere in the 4x4. In the middle u get over 70000 and this is well over 2 ft. If u take a lux meter to a 400+ at 18 inches it reads about 120000 lux so they did not lie about there intensity. This light is so bright if u have it 18 inches from canopy u risk bleaching

The only thing i dont like is the fact that its round. U do get a dim spot at the middle at the rear. But even the buds in that area are developing very well

 

[Wisher619]

@Djloud
I also see you are running hps
I never said they lie about there #'s he just tries to discredit other companys with fudgy measurements.....showing his hand under a light dosnt tell me how many photons are actually reaching the plant
Photons matter much more then lumens or lux...those measurements matter for hps maybe but not for led....
I am in no way trying to discredit SK....but I would like them to run a test similar to this

since he has all the equipment
sticking your hand under a light and saying "look at my hand it looks and feels like the sun" dosnt really mean shit honestly
you see there is this reverse square law deal blah blah blah

 

[tags420]

@Djloud
I believe he ment 4x8
12 cxb would be way more then needed for a 4x4
6 cob per 4x4

Sounds right to me im going to build one and put it aginst my sks should be fun

No, I did mean that is what should be used to replace a gavita. That is the bar set now days, and 700w of high efficiency(50%+) is still needed.
It's not a choice thing...it's what it actually takes to create the same amount of photons with 50-60% cobs.

EXAMPLE
-phillips bulb(DE's) running 1150w(over boost) at 40% efficient with a QER(amount of photons per radiant watt of the specific spectrum) of 4.63 will produce 2129µmol PPF

-12 [email protected]/63w...750w total at 53% efficient with a QER of 4.65 will produce 1848µmols PPF

The led is still producing ~12% less light at the base value of the light engines(bulb or cobs).
The next is to take into account that the best reflector in the hps world are only emitting 79-81% of the initial PPF(cite:Utah state). Reflective losses as well as the bulb blocking light. With no glass I might add.
That brings the DE to 1724µmols total system PPF emitted in use

LEDs are directional and don't suffer so much loss. LED's do have their taxes though. Lens and/or reflector taxes usually around 6-8% to as low as 4%
So brings the led down to 1737µmols total system PPF emitted in use

Now the LED will maintain over 95% of it's output over 5yr realistically with great operating temps that can be achieved. HPS does not have the longevity in use with heat. But DE's are a big step up for life time from what I have seen.
Long story short...that is why I said 12 cobs. It's is the best while being affordable and actually doing what it needs to...outright beat a DE system in all senses of the word beat.
And of course it is dimmable from 100-10% so if you only want to compete with actual 1k(not super boost) ~600w will do.

If soeone is happy with what they are doing with less, like DJ and 400w, then they will be more than pleased with 400w of true top efficiency/output. But science says more is beneficial.

@tags420
nice to meet you as well....sorry wasnt beating around the bush as I didnt know you were he.....in any case Congratulations and good prosperity on the light venture and I will be purchasing one in the near future....as soon as I can accumulate enough money....

oh and I was just looking up the 3590 and cree states that it runs at a solid state 13,200 lm ....I know you dont like to measure in lm but for anyone running HPS....one COB running 13,00 lm and you are gonna be running say 8 at close to 60% efficient....to me....is insane

All good man. I was an apprentice to a professor greengenes(gg's garden was our collective), he called me little GG, but tags was what I was way before any grow forums and used for a while on them. Eventually he dubbed me the GG and the garden, so then I went with it and it was a better alias. But here was already taken, and the guy is very cool and been around long time, so I will always be tags420 here.

They don't do 13000lm where we run them...more like 8000. And it is intense, but spreading them allows it. No radiant heat per say too makes it happen. But once you get a ton of light (1000ppfd) you don't run them that close and is just like any kind of fixture producing that much light. 24-30" ideally.

 

[Wisher619]

absolutely...Tags I was wondering about the footprint of each cob as i was curious as to when laying them out for a panel did you specifically measure the foot print and overlap of each cob to produce the highest amount of coverage with the furthest amount of spread before light break...or more importantly.....have you ever measured a single cob with lens as to what the footprint is....which I would assume would more accurately help to establish how many per panel and at what placement to create the best spread with the highest degree on illumination..if that makes sense???was only wondering because I see a lot of people cramming a shit load onto a single panel but I don't believe that more is more....I would think that if you used the single cob footprint and overlapped each footprint by a certain margin it would create the most bang for buck...or am I wrong on this......I would like to build for my self a small diy maybe 2 cob panel but was wondering about this.....

yeah 13,000 I believe is close to max but I don't believe that would be sustainable in the longevity of the cob etc.....better soft and safe correct.

 

[Djloud]

@Djloud
I also see you are running hps
I never said they lie about there #'s he just tries to discredit other companys with fudgy measurements.....showing his hand under a light dosnt tell me how many photons are actually reaching the plant
Photons matter much more then lumens or lux...those measurements matter for hps maybe but not for led....
I am in no way trying to discredit SK....but I would like them to run a test similar to this

since he has all the equipment
sticking your hand under a light and saying "look at my hand it looks and feels like the sun" dosnt really mean shit honestly
you see there is this reverse square law deal blah blah blah

@Djloud
I also see you are running hps
I never said they lie about there #'s he just tries to discredit other companys with fudgy measurements.....showing his hand under a light dosnt tell me how many photons are actually reaching the plant
Photons matter much more then lumens or lux...those measurements matter for hps maybe but not for led....
I am in no way trying to discredit SK....but I would like them to run a test similar to this

since he has all the equipment
sticking your hand under a light and saying "look at my hand it looks and feels like the sun" dosnt really mean shit honestly
you see there is this reverse square law deal blah blah blah

Without the hps on. That hps is not influenceing the sk pkants

 

[Wisher619]

the only problem I have is that any time you run 2 differ lights in the same room it will always influence...if you were to run the SK in a isolation booth...things may be differ.....just food for thought...in no way doubting you.....just trying to enlighten to the possibility.....the only time I have seen anyone having successful runs on strictly led would be Realstyles Tags420 and growmou5..........with no undue influence to speak of i.e. anything else running in the same room....if I can see the hps bouncing off the back wall...i am sure your plants can more then pick up those photons

one reason I have a problem with John Berfelo's youtube grows...if you know who that is... he has a SK400 a cmh315 and a gavita in the same room...dosnt work...just below the light may be only one light but those photons are bouncing everywhere....this isn't pinpoint laser we are talking here you know what I mean...just food for thought...not trying to be a dick

 

[Djloud]

the only problem I have is that any time you run 2 differ lights in the same room it will always influence...if you were to run the SK in a isolation booth...things may be differ.....just food for thought...in no way doubting you.....just trying to enlighten to the possibility.....the only time I have seen anyone having successful runs on strictly led would be Realstyles Tags420 and growmou5..........with no undue influence to speak of i.e. anything else running in the same room....if I can see the hps bouncing off the back wall...i am sure your plants can more then pick up those photons

one reason I have a problem with John Berfelo's youtube grows...if you know who that is... he has a SK400 a cmh315 and a gavita in the same room...dosnt work...just below the light may be only one light but those photons are bouncing everywhere....this isn't pinpoint laser we are talking here you know what I mean...just food for thought...not trying to be a dick

I have 2 sk side by side and one gavita going the other way in the room. It could possibly influence one light but what about the light not getting any hps light. Them are the buds closest in my pics. They are all sk. I promise. That gavita is way too far away to make a diff on the sk plants. Its hard to tell from the pic. Ill have to take more pics i guess

 

[Djloud]

I have 2 sk side by side and one gavita going the other way in the room. It could possibly influence one light but what about the light not getting any hps light. Them are the buds closest in my pics. They are all sk. I promise. That gavita is way too far away to make a diff on the sk plants. Its hard to tell from the pic. Ill have to take more pics i guess

In my opinion john berfello is not a good representation of what an sk can do

 

[Djloud]

the only problem I have is that any time you run 2 differ lights in the same room it will always influence...if you were to run the SK in a isolation booth...things may be differ.....just food for thought...in no way doubting you.....just trying to enlighten to the possibility.....the only time I have seen anyone having successful runs on strictly led would be Realstyles Tags420 and growmou5..........with no undue influence to speak of i.e. anything else running in the same room....if I can see the hps bouncing off the back wall...i am sure your plants can more then pick up those photons

one reason I have a problem with John Berfelo's youtube grows...if you know who that is... he has a SK400 a cmh315 and a gavita in the same room...dosnt work...just below the light may be only one light but those photons are bouncing everywhere....this isn't pinpoint laser we are talking here you know what I mean...just food for thought...not trying to be a dick

Hps off

 

[REALSTYLES]

Hps off

After checking the spreadsheet the SK is at most 35% efficient and on a side note I've met Brandon from Spectrum King at a Max Yield indoor expo last year. I know where SK is I used to go to high school down the street from where they are at right now lol

this is one plant 8oz after drying

 

[Wisher619]

@REALSTYLES
that is with your cob grow correct?
by they way....do you happen to know the individual footprint per cob??

 

[REALSTYLES]

@REALSTYLES
that is with your cob grow correct?
by they way....do you happen to know the individual footprint per cob??

Yes from my panel and it's hard to say how many sq ft per cob because you can use 10w per sq ft to veg and 25w to bloom it's up to how you want your setup.

 

[Wisher619]

yeah I was just wondering you to go about measuring light output per sqft.....because when building a panel I didnt want to just slap a bunch of cobs on a panel....I wanted to space them correctly in order to get the best output per foorprint if that makes sense...example....someone can throw like 10 cob on a 24"x48" panel or you could throw 5 on there and be more efficient if the placement of each cob was correct for the footprint of each cob....allowing space per cob to maximize just before light diminish.....because I know that when you reach a certain saturation point of light....the rest is wasted energy

 

[Djloud]

After checking the spreadsheet the SK is at most 35% efficient and on a side note I've met Brandon from Spectrum King at a Max Yield indoor expo last year. I know where SK is I used to go to high school down the street from where they are at right now lol

this is one plant 8oz after drying
View attachment 574080
View attachment 574081

There is no way an sk is only 35% efficient. I have a light meter and it puts out a ton of light.

 

[tags420]

There is no way an sk is only 35% efficient. I have a light meter and it puts out a ton of light.

I already broke down the best case scenario for an SK in post 229.

If you want to see it from SK themselves, it's even worse. 88Tsp/101Tj is not good.

Two wattages shown...44(page5)1 and 453(page15) so I will do them both...they have 91% drivers
441 x 1.09=404w from the leds
453 x 1.09=415w from the leds

Page 10 shows the radiant watts(light energy emitted) at operating temp of 121w

121÷404= 29.95% efficient
121÷415=29.1% efficient

Take off the lens and at best is
121 x 1.06=128...÷404=31%
128÷415=30%

 

[Wisher619]

@tags420
I am wondering if you could help me with this question.....what is the optimal footprint of a single 3590....so when building a light bar there is a base calculation for placement of each COB....
I understand the thermal output and the necessity for a certain surface area for heat dispersion for each to run optimal....what would the maximum space between each cob be for maximum light spread per bar without creating hot spots or dim areas

Thank you in advance