Watts/lumens per square foot ?

[dankworth]

STRAIN.

SSSSHHHHHHH!!!!

(yeah the ones with the mad preflowers might have something to say bout this)
What?

 

[Capulator]

I hit 6oz off a plant that had about a gallon of root space and took up a little more than 1 sq. ft. It was the original AK-47.

 

[Capulator]

correction: floor space was less than a square foot, canopy was more like 16".

 

[CabinetGrown]

I'm running 600w in each of my 4x2 grow boxes which equates to 75w per sq ft...I LOVE IT! Typically pull over a P per box, per cycle and so long as I thin it out and trellis right, I don't end up with much larf. I out weigh my buddy who runs the typical 1000w over a 4x4 all the time, although he tends to slack which never helps.

 

[ttystikk]

I hit 6oz off a plant that had about a gallon of root space and took up a little more than 1 sq. ft. It was the original AK-47.

correction: floor space was less than a square foot, canopy was more like 16".

I'm running 600w in each of my 4x2 grow boxes which equates to 75w per sq ft...I LOVE IT! Typically pull over a P per box, per cycle and so long as I thin it out and trellis right, I don't end up with much larf. I out weigh my buddy who runs the typical 1000w over a 4x4 all the time, although he tends to slack which never helps.

These are impressive results, which serve to reinforce my suspicion that these kinds of numbers are very difficult to scale up. Believe me, I would like someone to show me proof of how I'm wrong, with pics of their setup- so I can do the same!

 

[Capulator]

These are impressive results, which serve to reinforce my suspicion that these kinds of numbers are very difficult to scale up. Believe me, I would like someone to show me proof of how I'm wrong, with pics of their setup- so I can do the same!

Like i said:

AK 47. You could do it all day with that plant (I wish I still had it). However, it also went almost 3 months. It's all about the strain. The strain will determine your yield with all other factors constant. You won't hit those numbers with some strains no matter how dialed you get it.

 

[Capulator]

HERE is the plant, and the system that grew it. Shity cell phone pics. System has since been refined much further. Plant was severely neglected at the point of picture since it went a full month over the rest. I was busy doing other things so I just let it go until it finished with almost no water changes and minimal care. It seemed like a waste to fill the whole tank for one plant. Could easily have done this at each site, and would have been quite the pull off of just 4 600's. Would have been worth the 3 months in the grand scheme of things. The average for this system is between 2 and 3 oscars per site.

 

[hogan400]

Strain! period.

I had a nl5 that smashed it but again, sea of green. Also I had some 11-12 weekers that killed it weight wise, but the extra few weeks to a month and pisses ME off.

I believe its possible for 2.5-3lbs per. Simply because 10 yrs ago, people talked shit on guys like Tom Hill when they claimed 5-10lb plants outdoors were possible, and now look. Its too easy. Exp and technique change....with new ideas and skills, plants will produce more....one thing is certain, prices will go down more..hahahah

 

[Capulator]

Strain! period.

I had a nl5 that smashed it but again, sea of green. Also I had some 11-12 weekers that killed it weight wise, but the extra few weeks to a month and pisses ME off.

I believe its possible for 2.5-3lbs per. Simply because 10 yrs ago, people talked shit on guys like Tom Hill when they claimed 5-10lb plants outdoors were possible, and now look. Its too easy. Exp and technique change....with new ideas and skills, plants will produce more....one thing is certain, prices will go down more..hahahah

It's still not easy to grow the kind trouble free. Love how many people think it's so easy.

Did any of you see green rush the documentary? It follows the lives of 3 outdoor growers. At the end, 1 crew doesn't meet expectations (budrot, water supply issues, etc), and the other 2 lose it all to rippers.

 

[outwest]

It's still not easy to grow the kind trouble free. Love how many people think it's so easy.

Did any of you see green rush the documentary? It follows the lives of 3 outdoor growers. At the end, 1 crew doesn't meet expectations (budrot, water supply issues, etc), and the other 2 lose it all to rippers.

I did see that. Kind of depressing actually. I remember about 25 years ago picking up movie called GanjaSaurus Rex at the local blockbuster. Super low budget out of The Emerald Triangle, kind of a fuck you to the Nancy Reagan ethos of the era.

outwest

 

[Capulator]

Do they actually platy that music through the whole movie?

What a piece of shit.

 

[ttystikk]

Like i said:

AK 47. You could do it all day with that plant (I wish I still had it). However, it also went almost 3 months. It's all about the strain. The strain will determine your yield with all other factors constant. You won't hit those numbers with some strains no matter how dialed you get it.

'The strain will determine your yield with all other factors constant.' Well yeah! ...and if you hold all other factors constant, ANY variable will do the same. I get your point. I also noticed that one plant had shadowed its two adjacent grow sites on that pipe, too.

Strain is an important piece of the puzzle. It's not the only piece. It is one more opportunity to put a weak link in the chain of maximum output... or a strong one.

 

[dankworth]

Distribution of mass along a bearing surface. Organizing the bearing surfaces, orienting them towards light correctly.
Vert with tall ceilings tends to get like 1.5/light because of this.

 

[Capulator]

That was the only plant in the system in that picture. when all the others are taken out thats what you have left. Normally it just looks like a sea of flowers.

my point is hitting 2/light is a lot easier with some strains than with others. Obviously there are lot of things that will increase yield:

1) experience.
2) experience.
3) luck.
4) experience and luck.

and then there's other shit too. temps, RH , and VPD, lumens, nutes and ratios, pH, media, IPM, etc...

Did I say experience?

 

[outwest]

That was the only plant in the system in that picture. when all the others are taken out thats what you have left. Normally it just looks like a sea of flowers.

my point is hitting 2/light is a lot easier with some strains than with others. Obviously there are lot of things that will increase yield:

1) experience.
2) experience.
3) luck.
4) experience and luck.

and then there's other shit too. temps, RH , and VPD, lumens, nutes and ratios, pH, media, IPM, etc...

Did I say experience?

You left Cap's Bennies off that list. If you haven't tried them out, they're awesome. ;)

outwest

 

[dankworth]

Hey Cap can you explain all that stuff real quick? Joke.

It helps to be able to do all the research, homework and studying.

For that, may I recommend black-market prescription stimulants, and having a neurological disorder that allows you to care less about other things so you can care more about this one.

Because otherwise there will not be enough dopamine to go around to keep your ass from getting sick of the research grind.

Oh and like Cap, build and run a bunch of your own different nutrient delivery systems. It will give you lots of...what's the word again, Cap?

 

[ttystikk]

my point is hitting 2/light is a lot easier with some strains than with others.

I wasn't disagreeing with this. Strain can be a strong link in the chain leading to 2lbs/1000w, or it can be a limiting factor.

I'm still looking for a pheno- of any strain- that will produce like this and simultaneously be of high quality.

 

[El Cerebro]

here's the $25 quantum meter rental I mentioned before:

 

[Capulator]

I am sittin watchin this last round of plants just crawl along, not fattin up or finishin like I usually like so start thinkin about other current setups and past setups for answers. So I start figurin my watts per sq.ft on a bunch of my different setups and this what i got..

#1 setup is (2)600w over a 3x3 table or 1200w/ 9 sq.ft. = 133 watts per sq.ft. or 19,556 lumens/sq.ft. with this setup I can easily pull 3-3.25lbs from 9-16 plants on the 3x3.This is my all time favorite setup for yield, density, finish time, potency all that good stuff. Dual bulb hood used in a 3x3 Hydrohut tent.

#2 (1) 1000w over a 3x3 table or 1000w/ 9 sq.ft. = 111 watts per sq.ft. or 16,111 lumens per sq.ft. perfect for single bulb single hood setup and or in a tent.

#3 (3) 1000w over (2) 3x6 tables or 3000w / 32 sq.ft. = 83 watts per sq.ft. or 13,594 lumens per sq.ft.. This setup is on movers and does alright but could use another 1k to really kickit into gear, but overall decent.

#4 (1) 1000w over a 4x4 table or 1000w / 16 sq.ft. = 63 watts per sq.ft. or 9063 lumens per sq.ft. To me this setup is right at the edge of what you need to really kick it out like on a 3x3. I really like the 3x3 tables instead of the 4x4 all the way around.

#5 (2) 1000w over (2)3x6 and (2)3x3 or 2000w per 54 sq.ft. = 37 watts per sq.ft. or 5370 lumens per sq.ft.. This sucks bigtime, movers almost make it more painful because of the shadow dancin..lack of cash has dictated this setup but still it sucks.

#6 (3) 1000w over a 11x14 room on movers or 3000w / 154 sq.ft. or 19 watts per sq.ft. or 2825 lumens per sq.ft. this is at a buddy of mines and he is complaining about yield, density, and finish times. this setup is doin just well enough to piss you off, not really crawlin but not cruizin either. I am tryin to get 6-8k in there for he real kickin flower action.

So I was curious what everybody else was doin and experiencin..

The sun is roughly 100w per sq.ft. full tilt so that is my basic minimum benchmark for my indoor satisfaction..

Mo lumens, mo wattage, mo betta..

Tex

back on topic. I just re read the first post and we are way off.

Tex,

I like the #1 setup. That sounds like a recipe for success with a 600 hps and a 600 MH in the same hood. When you say you are illuminating a 3x3 table, doesnt your canopy end up being bigger than that? My tables are 3x12, and I run 4 hoods above them. My canopy ends up being more of a 4 x 14 though once the screen is in and the supports are in place.

Im doing around 50-60 watts per square foot in this case, but it doesnt seem that this analysis takes in to consideration the distance from the bulb? Or does it? My 600's get about a foot from the hood as they are air cooled, and seems like here you would have more lumens. When I put my meter there it shows between 80-100k on ushio digis. The ushio super red 600's do 97k initial lumens (). Over a 3x3 this would be 10,000 lumens per sq. ft.

Running 2 of these in a dual fixture hood would be some insane light (2ok lumens per sq. ft.). I think I am going to try this for a comparison since I now have a new AC that can keep up with an extra light.

Regarding light bleaching... Does anyone have a guess as to WHY tips of buds close to light get bleached. I am feeling this run that it is actually a lack of nutes making it to the tip, and not necessarily light or heat related. Thoughts on this?

 

[ttystikk]

here's the $25 quantum meter rental I mentioned before:

Thank you. With my ongoing lighting project, I might as well just buy one. So I will. :cool: I will likely throw extra coin at a unit that logs data, that feature will be hard to do without. Some of these even have custom mounts, to ensure the data gathered isn't affected by placement inconsistencies.