Yellowing tips!

Waxwingz · Apr 23, 2020

Hey everyone,

coming along with my first indoor grow. I have started to notice yellowing tips on some new growth. I’m aware if nute burn, but I haven’t added any extra nutrients. I’ve also within the last few days upgraded my lighting. Any advice or diagnostic would be awesome and greatly appreciated.

PS. These girls are growing in FFOF

Waxwingz · Apr 23, 2020

One more pic lol

Beachwalker · Apr 23, 2020

pH, ppm, runoff or slurry readings?

Are you letting those pots drain or are they sitting in their own water, I couldn't tell from the picture

Waxwingz · Apr 23, 2020

Tbh I haven’t had much run off at all, I had worried It was overwatered so I only give small amounts at a time. Definitely not enough to test ph and such. When I had watered her she became very droopy so I’ve been trying to avoid that. Been watering with rain water, to keep ph neutral. There are drain holes in the pots, but they are just sitting on the floor of the tent

visajoe1 · Apr 23, 2020

They are hot and leaves are struggling. Based on that pic (77F, 34%) your leaf VPD is running 1.8-2.1, you want to be about half that right now.

Can you get to 75F, 60-65% humidity? If you cant adjust environment quickly, dim your lights or use your old one. The extra light is forcing your leaves to work harder than they can hence your issues.

If you have a chance, check this thread out

VPD (vapor pressure deficit)

Ok i was gonna sit down and write out a whole article but i have been lazy so instead instead I'm going to copy paste because im lazy. This is not my work so let start. You may find this very long but its worth the read. Some may want to skip ahead. I have added here and there to what i feel is...

www.thcfarmer.com

Waxwingz · Apr 23, 2020

Well I adjusted things earlier and am maintaining 75f and 53 humidity. Have had differing heat suggestions. Trying for 75 with 55-60 humidity

Waxwingz · Apr 23, 2020

So even with an in-line fan I’m struggling to get below 77-76, any suggestions?

Waxwingz · Apr 23, 2020

Could I lower the inline?

Aqua Man · Apr 23, 2020

Check list

as @visajoe1 said keep VPD lower. Plants that small will have slower growth with a high VPD and stress.

Airflow so they can transpire properly. Make sure they are getting decent airflow. The underside of the leaf if more important to have airflow than the topside.

Do NOT over water let them dry out. I can say I'm pretty confident looking at those swollen heavy leaves this is the case. High root pressure and a poor VPD is the initial issue. This will lead to what looks like deficiencies because the plant is not taking up water and nutrients efficiently then added root pressure from over watering. I bet if you go peek in on those plants just before lights on you may see some guttation (almost like droplets of water on the edges of the leaves closer to the bottom of the plants.

This all is intertwined. Up the airflow (very important for proper transpiration, make sure the is indirect airflow across the top of the soil and through the plant. Not over top of the leaves) raise humidity to over 50% at least. Let them dry until the pots are alarmingly light. Back the light off a bit to reduce stress and give them 4-5 days to recover a bit. Then remove those leaves resting on the edges of the pot or soil.

Aqua Man · Apr 23, 2020

Waxwingz said:
So even with an in-line fan I’m struggling to get below 77-76, any suggestions?

Nothing wrong with 75-80 I run my room 80+ but have CO2. It's not your temps.

In order of importance.

Over watering... Stop and let them dry out.

Air flow... A must to get good airflow over the dirt and through the plant.

Humidity... Ideally about 60% about now. With fat dense indica leaves and the microclimate they make I would keep it there. Otherwise I would say 65%

Use humidity to steer VPD not temp.

Waxwingz · Apr 23, 2020

Aqua Man said:
Nothing wrong with 75-80 I run my room 80+ but have CO2. It's not your temps.

In order of importance.

Over watering... Stop and let them dry out.

Air flow... A must to get good airflow over the dirt and through the plant.

Humidity... Ideally about 60% about now. With fat dense indica leaves and the microclimate they make I would keep it there. Otherwise I would say 65%

Use humidity to steer VPD not temp.

Okay cool! thanks for the advice. I have two 6in fans in the 2x4 tent. I’ve redirected them to move more air around the plants. I have a 4 inch inline fan up top and the bottom air ports are still open to pull in fresh air and out warm. Any more suggestions would be awesome! Going to let them recoup for now, and skip the next watering. moved the light (MH sp250) up a few inches to about 27ish inches. Crossing my fingers, this is my first indoor grow, wanted a test run with some bag seed. Have some auto or plenty of fems for the next run!

Aqua Man · Apr 23, 2020

Waxwingz said:
Okay cool! thanks for the advice. I have two 6in fans in the 2x4 tent. I’ve redirected them to move more air around the plants. I have a 4 inch inline fan up top and the bottom air ports are still open to pull in fresh air and out warm. Any more suggestions would be awesome! Going to let them recoup for now, and skip the next watering. moved the light (MH sp250) up a few inches to about 27ish inches. Crossing my fingers, this is my first indoor grow, wanted a test run with some bag seed. Have some auto or plenty of fems for the next run!

Have to start somewhere. The added airflow will aid drastically in cooling the leaves and allowing them to transpire properly. Just try to avoid aggressive direct airflow. Oscillating fans are a good option in small spaces since it's not constantly blowing directly on the plants. So you can get away with a bit more.

Aqua Man · Apr 23, 2020

Probably the best thing you can do if possible is control the humidity of the room that the tent is in. This way it's pulling in air with the proper humidity and you can increase the exhaust fan without lowering the humidity to create more air exchange to keep temps where ya want and CO2 levels replenished.

Leaf temps are the most important not air temps. I would say for $15 buck you could pick up an IR temp gun but the prices if you can find one are stupid right now with this virus.

Mospeada · Apr 23, 2020

Seeing as no cannabis related nutes that I know of contain Nickel...It could be a deficiency.

Nickel Deficiency
Minor nickel deficiency displays no visual symptoms, but can reduce growth and yield of plants. Significant nickel deficiency will display visual symptoms typically in the old leaves of the plants as nickel is a mobile element. Deficiency symptoms in legumes are exhibited as whole leaf chlorosis along with necrotic leaf tips (caused by the accumulation of toxic levels of urea). In woody ornamentals, symptoms occur in the spring in new emerging growth and may include shortened internodes (giving a rosetting appearance to the plant), weak shoot growth, death of terminal buds and eventual death of shoots and branches. In pecans, the symptoms are similar to woody ornamentals, but also include decreased expansion of the leaf blade and necrosis of the leaf tips. The leaves develop a condition called “mouse-ear” in which the leaflets are small with rounded tips vs. long and pointed.

It is an essential element, that is undisputed, however; I've seen zero work or tests done on cannabis plants for grows that have Nickel and grows that don't.

Aqua Man · Apr 23, 2020

Mospeada said:
Seeing as no cannabis related nutes that I know of contain Nickel...It could be a deficiency.

Nickel Deficiency
Minor nickel deficiency displays no visual symptoms, but can reduce growth and yield of plants. Significant nickel deficiency will display visual symptoms typically in the old leaves of the plants as nickel is a mobile element. Deficiency symptoms in legumes are exhibited as whole leaf chlorosis along with necrotic leaf tips (caused by the accumulation of toxic levels of urea). In woody ornamentals, symptoms occur in the spring in new emerging growth and may include shortened internodes (giving a rosetting appearance to the plant), weak shoot growth, death of terminal buds and eventual death of shoots and branches. In pecans, the symptoms are similar to woody ornamentals, but also include decreased expansion of the leaf blade and necrosis of the leaf tips. The leaves develop a condition called “mouse-ear” in which the leaflets are small with rounded tips vs. long and pointed.

It is an essential element, that is undisputed, however; I've seen zero work or tests done on cannabis plants for grows that have Nickel and grows that don't.

You could be right... There is definately one or more deficiencies. So then we have to look at the reason for the deficiency. I can say from experience 99% of the time it not from lack of the actual nutrient but usually because of a nutrient uptake issue most often transpiration issue which could be from environment (including ph and salinity), roots, leaves and the odd time other nutrients.

Beachwalker · Apr 24, 2020

Aqua Man said:
You could be right... There is definately one or more deficiencies. So then we have to look at the reason for the deficiency. I can say from experience 99% of the time it not from lack of the actual nutrient but usually because of a nutrient uptake issue most often transpiration issue which could be from environment (including ph and salinity), roots, leaves and the odd time other nutrients.

I believe op's issue is, and I asked op to provide his pH, PPM and a few other simple readings which op has not provided, so I won't continue in the thread:

But whereas you're starting to get into soil I wanted to share with you what I believe his issue is, & why, but as I expected you've already nailed it above;

op has not been taking running off, and he's got a salt build-up. It's likely affecting soil pH in the root zone, I've done it too, particularly when I just keep pouring water & nutrients into a neglected plant and not properly running off, which is what op's already admitted to above

Plant's starting to show a few deficiencies (or excesses) leading to a lockout; The yellow circles are the beginning of a lockout which was my first clue, the red circles point to over-watering, or in this particular instance improper watering, also notice the overall color.

Adieu Mon Ami, sympa de vous voir de retour! ✌

Waxwingz · Apr 24, 2020

Damn! Lol

Aqua Man · Apr 24, 2020

Beachwalker said:
I believe op's issue is, and I asked op to provide his pH, PPM and a few other simple readings which op has not provided, so I won't continue in the thread:

But whereas you're starting to get into soil I wanted to share with you what I believe his issue is, & why, but as I expected you've already nailed it above;

op has not been taking running off, and he's got a salt build-up. It's likely affecting soil pH in the root zone, I've done it too, particularly when I just keep pouring water & nutrients into a neglected plant and not properly running off, which is what op's already admitted to above

Plant's starting to show a few deficiencies (or excesses) leading to a lockout; The yellow circles are the beginning of a lockout which was my first clue, the red circles point to over-watering, or in this particular instance improper watering, also notice the overall color.

Adieu Mon Ami, sympa de vous voir de retour! ✌

View attachment 965472

But he hasn't added any nutrients to create that buildup

Anthem · Apr 24, 2020

It looks to be over watering. Rarely will a plant develop a micro nutrient deficiency in good soil which judging by the picture the soil looks to be good stuff. The largest concern I see it the pots are on the bottom of the tent and I see no drain holes. I assume there are some drain holes. If it was my grow I would do as aqua man explained and NOT water until the pots are really light. Secondly I would add at least 1/2" of clearance between the bottom of the pot and the tent floor. This is easily accomplished by cut 1" x 2" wood strips and placing under the pots. This helps with air flow, drainage and oxygen uptake in the root zone.
You are experiencing one of the most common challenges with growing in soil. Just let the plant dry out and it will bounce right back like nothing happened.

Beachwalker · Apr 24, 2020

Aqua Man said:
But he hasn't added any nutrients to create that buildup

oic, when he said extra nutes I assumed he was adding some newts just not extra LOL regardless He/she needs to do a slurry test, also the red circles imo show over watering so it could be an early root issue, either way he's got to start getting run off, and watering using a proper wet/dry cycle

@Aqua Man, Instead of soil have you considered promix?

Yellowing tips!

Yellowing tips!

Waxwingz

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Yellowing tips!

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