What’s a basic NPK ratio for all stages of growth that’s better than no fertilization at all?

[Archie]

Now that Michigan has legalized recreational marijuana, I am trying my hand at growing some plants exclusively for personal consumption. I started my seeds (Colorado Bubba) via wetted, paper towel germination, planted seedlings in small paper cups, then transplanted into bigger pots of decent medium when they were about 3” tall. After 2 months of doing nothing but basic hydration ( top & bottom watering), they are about 2’ tall. Because of the atypical weather in Michigan’s Upper Peninsula, they have yet to reveal their sex, but I’m being patient. Having a basic certificate in Introduction to Horticulture, I know my chances at a better product should include fertilization. I know that there are several schools of thought concerning fertilization (e.g., at various stages of growth, etc.), but I am looking for a basic NPK ratio that is suitable for all stages. This is not because I’m lazy and looking for the easy way out, but rather because I don’t have the time to invest that career growers obviously do. As aforementioned, I am merely interested in producing a decent product for personal consumption with the exception of treating family & friends to a decent buzz. So, that being said in almost book length (lol), do you have any suggestions and, if so, providing a trusty purchasing source would be a plus. TIA

 

[cemchris]

2-1-3

 

[az2000]

I am looking for a basic NPK ratio that is suitable for all stages.

Many, many growers use 1-1-1 all the way through. (Example, Grow More - Sea Grow 16-16-16. Jack's Classic 20-20-20. MiracleGro Tomato 18-18-21).

Keep in mind that, after you do a simple ratio for awhile, you can customize the ratio very simply (without getting into franchised multi-bottle "lineups."). For example, you can mix MiracleGro All Purpose (24-8-16, or a ratio of 3-1-2) with an equal amount of Tomato to have a ratio 1.62-1-1.42. That's a decent veg ratio.

In flower, you can mix MiracleGro Bloom Booster (15-30-15, or ratio 1-2-1) to an equal amount of Tomato. That's ratio 1-1.45-1.09. That's pretty good for mid flower.

I don't think varying the ratio does much. I'm just saying, you can experiment this way without getting into a proprietary schedule. I have a spreadsheet which makes it easy (and safe) to mix things together. I can give it to you if you were interested in doing that. You can use things like fish emulsion to boost N in veg (the soil microbes love that stuff). Or, bat guano in flower to raise P. It doesn't have to be any particular product.

 

[Dirtbag]

Botanicare pbp grow or GH floranova grow both have decent ratios and are really simple to use one part fertilizers.

 

[Migrower]

There is actual evidence that the best ratio for cannabis (and a lot of other plant species 75%+) is 3-1-4. It was discovered and applied and is pretty much the bench mark for a steady feed. Ofcourse there are spikes of different elements at different times of growth for (optimal growing) But a man named Mel Frank has proven this ratio successfully many times over. This is a common ratio in the horticulture field and commercial cannabis.

 

[az2000]

There is actual evidence that the best ratio for cannabis (and a lot of other plant species 75%+) is 3-1-4. It was discovered and applied and is pretty much the bench mark for a steady feed. Ofcourse there are spikes of different elements at different times of growth for (optimal growing) But a man named Mel Frank has proven this ratio successfully many times over. This is a common ratio in the horticulture field and commercial cannabis.

Does any product have that ratio? I mean, for being a benchmark, I can't think of a single product that has that ratio. If it were that settled as the holy grail, you'd think it would be everywhere. I've unraveled some multi-bottle "lineup" schedules. I think GH Flora 3-part is the only one that came close to that ratio. But, just once in veg. And, just in one of the three "schedules" for Flora series.

It just seems odd that such a well-established ratio would be so not available in all the common proprietary "lineups" (and as a standalone, one-bottle product?).

 

[Archie]

Does any product have that ratio? I mean, for being a benchmark, I can't think of a single product that has that ratio. If it were that settled as the holy grail, you'd think it would be everywhere. I've unraveled some multi-bottle "lineup" schedules. I think GH Flora 3-part is the only one that came close to that ratio. But, just once in veg. And, just in one of the three "schedules" for Flora series.

It just seems odd that such a well-established ratio would be so not available in all the common proprietary "lineups" (and as a standalone, one-bottle product?).

I appreciate your “make it make sense” approach!

 

[Migrower]

Actually many nute company use this as they baseline . The ratio Npkmg values in bloom should look similar to 100-100-200-65(+30) silica 50 calcium 125. These targets are very closely achieved by gh floranova and flora series nutes. This also is commonly called the Lucas formula though Mel Frank(not real name) and Ed Rosenthal were the people who after many trials came to this conclusion. A man named Lucas made it popular.

 

[Migrower]

Also this is the recommendation for optimal growth by jacks hydro and printed on the container and website.

 

[Archie]

Wow...this was all very insightful information, to say the least...thank you all! As I mentioned, I am pretty old school at this. Like many of you, I’m sure, I come from a post Vietnam war era where “red & gold” were dominant and, because I loved it so, I was very reluctant to embrace “green.” Good thing I’m not too hardheaded—as it turns out, the “green” has become everything, and more, than the rare “Sincé & Hawaiian” we were willing to dig deeper in our pockets for...lol. Anyway, if I’m successful with this first outdoor crop, I’m considering an indoor crop through the winter. When and if my novice days are a thing of the past, I’ll post some pics and whatnot. Again, thanks a million!

 

[Migrower]

If you’d like to know more I learned this first by greengenes Channel on YouTube and researched further. He has an older video uploaded months back that I first started to look into this.

 

[az2000]

Also this is the recommendation for optimal growth by jacks hydro and printed on the container and website.

Do you have a link? Here's a link to dozens of Jack' products. I don't see a single 3-1-4 on there. I didn't look that closely. But, it doesn't look like an established ratio. And, that coincides with what I've seen with the more boutique "lineups." I mean, if 3-1-4 were so well accepted, you'd think there would be tubs of the stuff sold everywhere. I can't think of *one*. I'm not sure bags of hydro products invalidate that observation (when hydro growers blend those bags to get their own nutrient profiles.).

 

[Migrower]

Check out greengenes YouTube video titled Jacks Hydro| Jacks 321| Universal Hydroponic Nutrients. It’ll show you better than I can tell you.

 

[az2000]

Check out greengenes YouTube video titled Jacks Hydro| Jacks 321| Universal Hydroponic Nutrients. It’ll show you better than I can tell you.

Thanks, I'll look at it. Maybe it's a great ratio. I'm not disputing that. Maybe I'll try it for a grow. My only point is: if it's really the established thing, well accepted by everyone, etc.... long-standing, etc.... it seems odd that there aren't a plethora of 3-1-4 ratio products on the shelf. Or, multi-bottle franchised schedules that produce it. Based on what's being sold, it doesn't seem like it's as well accepted as claimed. (But, that doesn't mean it's not good, and should be well-accepted, etc.).

 

[Migrower]

After seeing that a while back I started to research Mel Frank and knew of Ed. They pretty much wrote the book. I’m not using that exact ratio myself. Im using the gh floranova line. Which is close I read. I believe you might need raw elements weighing out each and mixing a proper way as to not effect some elements. Like silica mixed in well before others. There is a lot of discussion on the topic as is most feeding schedules but check it out let me know what you think. Google Mel Frank also there’s a lot of info.

 

[az2000]

After seeing that a while back I started to research Mel Frank and knew of Ed. They pretty much wrote the book. I’m not using that exact ratio myself. Im using the gh floranova line. Which is close I read. I believe you might need raw elements weighing out each and mixing a proper way as to not effect some elements. Like silica mixed in well before others. There is a lot of discussion on the topic as is most feeding schedules but check it out let me know what you think. Google Mel Frank also there’s a lot of info.

I wonder if 3-1-4 is more of a hydro thing? I remember a few years ago reading that 3-1-2 (veg) and 1-3-2 (flower) were the absolute best. But, then someone said that's for hydro. In soil, you wouldn't have those high ratios. That kind of matches what I've seen using a spreadsheet and varying my own ratios using generic stuff. In veg, I tend to be around 1.5-1-1.8. If I go above 2-1-1.8, it seems like I'm approaching N toxicity. I don't think I've ever done 3-1-2. Whenever I started going there, the plant looked like it was getting to much N. (But, maybe I should cut the strength. Maybe you feed lighter at those more pronounced ratios. But, I already feed lightly compared to what most people seem to do.).

 

[Migrower]

I wonder if 3-1-4 is more of a hydro thing? I remember a few years ago reading that 3-1-2 (veg) and 1-3-2 (flower) were the absolute best. But, then someone said that's for hydro. In soil, you wouldn't have those high ratios. That kind of matches what I've seen using a spreadsheet and varying my own ratios using generic stuff. In veg, I tend to be around 1.5-1-1.8. If I go above 2-1-1.8, it seems like I'm approaching N toxicity. I don't think I've ever done 3-1-2. Whenever I started going there, the plant looked like it was getting to much N. (But, maybe I should cut the strength. Maybe you feed lighter at those more pronounced ratios. But, I already feed lightly compared to what most people seem to do.).

I think these are definitely for hydro. Once you see the video it’ll be more explained

 

[Archie]

Again...WOW! You folks seem to really know your stuff! More than anything I appreciate the differing opinions that, unless considered, we wouldn’t be where we're at today, both medicinal and recreationally. It’s folks like you that are responsible for healing many ailments and giving Big Drug Companies a run for their money. I just hope our purpose stays “old soul” rather than “pocket deep!” Thanks for your contribution!

 

[Dirtbag]

The best explanation I've heard aboutthe difference between hydro vs soil nutes is true soil that has a clay content needs more P which is why soil formulas often have a higher P ratio.

But soiless mix like promix or other peat based soils dont have clay to bind up the P, and they dont have an affinity to bind it otherwise so it's not nearly as important to supplement. It's why I've been using grow ratio all the way through flower lately in promix with awesome results. It's nearly the same as hydro ratio bloom nutes.

Soil ratio NPK feeds should only be used on actual soil that will bind up P. Soiless peat based mixes perform better with Hydro ratios.

 

[cemchris]

Botanicare pbp grow or GH floranova grow both have decent ratios and are really simple to use one part fertilizers.

That is your simple answer for a 1 and done