Question about extremely hungry active hydroponic plants

[justinsloan]

I have a question about plants that would like to be extremely healthy and strong and fast growing, plants that just ingest nutrients like crazy, will the water go down in a hydroponics setup at a rapid rate if it is consuming nutrients so quickly? Or does the water level not go down? And if it does go down, what is the solution for something that's less that nutrient measurements so you can add water back to it with the nutrient level in the water that it needs? Because just adding water will dilute the amount of nutrients in the water. And for extremely hungry plants that want to strive to be their best, is changing the water once per week enough?

 

[Moe.Red]

I have a question about plants that would like to be extremely healthy and strong and fast growing, plants that just ingest nutrients like crazy, will the water go down in a hydroponics setup at a rapid rate if it is consuming nutrients so quickly? Or does the water level not go down? And if it does go down, what is the solution for something that's less that nutrient measurements so you can add water back to it with the nutrient level in the water that it needs? Because just adding water will dilute the amount of nutrients in the water. And for extremely hungry plants that want to strive to be their best, is changing the water once per week enough?

There are a few things to unpack there but let’s start here. Are you currently using hydro? What style?

Are you trying to fix something or just doing research?

 

[justinsloan]

There are a few things to unpack there but let’s start here. Are you currently using hydro? What style?

Are you trying to fix something or just doing research?

It is DWC with a reservoir drain system. It has the works thrown at it, I do not have it up yet, I am actually setting up the tent right now and am going to germinate within days, but I just wanted to be prepared because if all goes well, with literally almost every type of thing you can think of in the category of getting the most out of your hydro plants thrown at it, and I have read that people that tried that only had one problem and that was that they could not keep up with their plant because they did not understand how to handle such a hungry active plant.

 

[growsince79]

I have a question about plants that would like to be extremely healthy and strong and fast growing, plants that just ingest nutrients like crazy, will the water go down in a hydroponics setup at a rapid rate if it is consuming nutrients so quickly? Or does the water level not go down? And if it does go down, what is the solution for something that's less that nutrient measurements so you can add water back to it with the nutrient level in the water that it needs? Because just adding water will dilute the amount of nutrients in the water. And for extremely hungry plants that want to strive to be their best, is changing the water once per week enough?

I used to do ebb n flow; with 1000w hps in mid flower the res lost about 3 gallons/day

 

[justinsloan]

I used to do ebb n flow; with 1000w hps in mid flower the res lost about 3 gallons/day

How did you handle it? Do you just change the entire water at the end of the day and maybe check levels of everything through out? What do you do when it is taking water levels at that rate?

 

[Ponky]

I used to just change my water every 3 days with a fresh batch. Worked fine. Top ups were less effective I found. I used a drill mounted pump. Pumped out the water. Siphoned fresh mixed water back in.

 

[justinsloan]

So, you would let your water go down by 3 gallons and just leave it continuing to go down for 3 days, 9 gallons by that time? assuming you are talking maybe out of like a 25 gallon hydroponics kit altogether.

 

[Cashmeh]

one plant in a 4x4 under a 1000w hid. She eats and drinks a lot. Im almost a month into flower and i add around 5 to 8 gallons every 3 days. I then have testing equipment and top off with the nutrients that its consumed the most of. Ppms go from 900 down to around 850. . then I add the ro water bringing the ppms down to like 600 or 700. I then test nitrate, nitrite, calcium, mag, phosphate and potassium. I try to keep them all between 100-150 yet mag I keep around 50ppm.

I dont drain or dump anything. Its a 2 month res change in my flower room. So i change and clean it every grow. Waters clear. . no buildup on edges as level dropps. . pretty gravy. It aquaponic without filters. What I put in, it uses. By the end of the grow my goal is to have my ppms around 400.

 

[Ponky]

So, you would let your water go down by 3 gallons and just leave it continuing to go down for 3 days, 9 gallons by that time? assuming you are talking maybe out of like a 25 gallon hydroponics kit altogether.

For me the 3rd day i still had enough water in the bucket. If you transpire more go every 2 days. I didn't find a need to top up. I had each plant in its own bucket. I did do top ups for a while with the same system. And it wasn't worth it. Was way easier to replace. Kept the PH the same aswell.

 

[justinsloan]

And this is you looking at the main reservoir tank that does not have plants in it? So that would be 3 gallons out of all of your plants together for one day of consumption? It just seems to me that if it went down that per bucket that would be a problem. Because alot of the nutrients that I have do not measure with odd smaller amounts like 3 gallons.

 

[justinsloan]

one plant in a 4x4 under a 1000w hid. She eats and drinks a lot. Im almost a month into flower and i add around 5 to 8 gallons every 3 days. I then have testing equipment and top off with the nutrients that its consumed the most of. Ppms go from 900 down to around 850. . then I add the ro water bringing the ppms down to like 600 or 700. I then test nitrate, nitrite, calcium, mag, phosphate and potassium. I try to keep them all between 100-150 yet mag I keep around 50ppm.

I dont drain or dump anything. Its a 2 month res change in my flower room. So i change and clean it every grow. Waters clear. . no buildup on edges as level dropps. . pretty gravy. It aquaponic without filters. What I put in, it uses. By the end of the grow my goal is to have my ppms around 400.

How much do you top off? And you do not get nutrient block not changing your water? I would always change my water especially in an extreme setup where it grows so fast, as ponky said, every 3 days or so. I am just worried about being able to keep up with the plants and I planned on changing the water once a week, maybe to start out with that is what I will do because it really should not consuming so much till the vegetative state. Then start every three days maybe.

 

[Cashmeh]

How much do you top off? And you do not get nutrient block not changing your water? I would always change my water especially in an extreme setup where it grows so fast, as ponky said, every 3 days or so. I am just worried about being able to keep up with the plants and I planned on changing the water once a week, maybe to start out with that is what I will do because it really should not consuming so much till the vegetative state. Then start every three days maybe.

In an aquarium setup like aquaponics with fish you dont really need to do full res changes. I dont add corrosives to my pot. I dont need enzymes to rebond molecules because im not destroying cell walls and creating plasma that needs rebonded.

For example there is a method called biofloc in shrimp farming where microbes are used to control ammonia levels instead of filters. They go 3 months with 0 water changes.

As long as your nutrients are bioavailable and your rootzone is clean, it will be able to eat just fine. Its very hard to underfeed in active hydro. Its either not eating, eating, or eating too much. If its eating to little, its because we didnt monitor feed levels.

Systems that use corrosives cannot function like mine, neither can any aquaponics system function when corrosives are added. When you add corrosives your destroy the micro organisms that were feeding off your nutrients. When they are destroyed they leave their discombobulated plasma floating around, which is why sterile guys have to do frequent res changes. Enzymes are quite tricky and only bond when the correct molecules are present and vice versa. Eventually. . you will have to dump.

Big differences between my live grow vs a sterile grow.

 

[justinsloan]

In an aquarium setup like aquaponics with fish you dont really need to do full res changes. I dont add corrosives to my pot. I dont need enzymes to rebond molecules because im not destroying cell walls and creating plasma that needs rebonded.

For example there is a method called biofloc in shrimp farming where microbes are used to control ammonia levels instead of filters. They go 3 months with 0 water changes.

As long as your nutrients are bioavailable and your rootzone is clean, it will be able to eat just fine. Its very hard to underfeed in active hydro. Its either not eating, eating, or eating too much. If its eating to little, its because we didnt monitor feed levels.

Systems that use corrosives cannot function like mine, neither can any aquaponics system function when corrosives are added. When you add corrosives your destroy the micro organisms that were feeding off your nutrients. When they are destroyed they leave their discombobulated plasma floating around, which is why sterile guys have to do frequent res changes. Enzymes are quite tricky and only bond when the correct molecules are present and vice versa. Eventually. . you will have to dump.

Big differences between my live grow vs a sterile grow.

That is really cool, do you think it puts out better results than DWC?

 

[Cashmeh]

That is really cool, do you think it puts out better results than DWC?

Ive never ran sterile. But both sterile and live are two different ways to run hydro, both are principles applied to dwc and rdwc. I run an active hydro system, rdwc to be specific. I then run a live environment where i add microbes to help keep the roots clean. .which in turn keeps the water clean.

Live vs sterile he asks. . which is better lol. . well its highly debated and very few of us run live systems. They are so customizable that it makes it hard to say whats best for who.

I run it because it allows for warmer water temps. From my experience running low/mid 70s speeds up most if not all marijuana's strains metabolism. Its also very beneficial in combating foreign pathogens, the microbes simulate probiotics which are not found in sterile systems.

Ill let the others explain why sterile systems are better. I cant lol. . cause i cant stand our war on microbes. . but thats another argument. . lets just say it can be challenging in both sterile and live systems.

 

[Dr.Green55]

That is really cool, do you think it puts out better results than DWC?

The biggest difference between the too is operator and his/her knowledge. 2 different ways to skin a cat but looking for the same end results. fundamentally there different and going to be run different so if you understand one way more so then the other you'll do better with the one you know, but regardless mo matter which one you run if your not producing a high brix, high terp/ cannabinoid plant you have work to do. just because your plant looks good your buds look nice etc doesn't mean the end product is, the proof is in the brix, terp/ cannabinoid etc.

Also its not just about the system, there is so many other other factors that go into play, environment, lighting, temps, medium nutrients and ratio's, defol techniques etc, the list goes on, they all have a hand in your final product.

I ran RDWC for years, I ran it sterile, where i added microbes and enzymes, and I also ran it in very clean environment with straight well water where I never added nothing but nutes, and each one always ran as good as my weakest link.

From my experience if all your limiting factors were dialed in as optimal as you could get them, 66 F to 74 F made very little difference in growth or anything really, applied nutrients/ ratio's alone played a much bigger role in plant morphology, health, brix terp etc. environment, lighting temps, defoliation, medium etc play a big part in nutrient ratio's

personally for me I'd rather run sterile and spray fulvic, kelp's etc.

 

[Cashmeh]

The biggest difference between the too is operator and his/her knowledge. 2 different ways to skin a cat but looking for the same end results. fundamentally there different and going to be run different so if you understand one way more so then the other you'll do better with the one you know, but regardless mo matter which one you run if your not producing a high brix, high terp/ cannabinoid plant you have work to do. just because your plant looks good your buds look nice etc doesn't mean the end product is, the proof is in the brix, terp/ cannabinoid etc.

Also its not just about the system, there is so many other other factors that go into play, environment, lighting, temps, medium nutrients and ratio's, defol techniques etc, the list goes on, they all have a hand in your final product.

I ran RDWC for years, I ran it sterile, where i added microbes and enzymes, and I also ran it in very clean environment with straight well water where I never added nothing but nutes, and each one always ran as good as my weakest link.

From my experience if all your limiting factors were dialed in as optimal as you could get them, 66 F to 74 F made very little difference in growth or anything really, applied nutrients/ ratio's alone played a much bigger role in plant morphology, health, brix terp etc. environment, lighting temps, defoliation, medium etc play a big part in nutrient ratio's

personally for me I'd rather run sterile and spray fulvic, kelp's etc.

I would disagree with the 66 to 74 growth rates. For anyone who does side by side, its drastically noticable. I want people to run clones and see for themselves. If I turned my water temps down from their 74f yo 66f lol. . they wouldnt grow anymore. .i tried it. . i had to add a heater.

Also you cant run bbs in a sterile systems, i think you meant to say live.

 

[freezeland2]

How did you handle it? Do you just change the entire water at the end of the day and maybe check levels of everything through out? What do you do when it is taking water levels at that rate?

When I ran hydro I had an auto float to maintain reservoir level. It also had a monitoring system to maintain EC and ph values. Depending on how many plants your running they will suck a reservoir down if they are transpiring heavily.

 

[justinsloan]

Yeah, that is what I am def expecting. I am stuck between topping and changing waters. I am using about 3 different types of root enhancers and cleaners, then with flushers and stuff like that, so I would imagine it will be pretty busy. I am doing 4 plants in a 4x4. And yeah, there is nothing I can think of that is not a part of a category that buffs of hydroponics plants that I missed. Topping is more difficult of the nutrient levels are low because of nutrient measurements, normally they measure in bigger sizes than a top off.

 

[Dr.Green55]

I would disagree with the 66 to 74 growth rates. For anyone who does side by side, its drastically noticable. I want people to run clones and see for themselves. If I turned my water temps down from their 74f yo 66f lol. . they wouldnt grow anymore. .i tried it. . i had to add a heater.

Also you cant run bbs in a sterile systems, i think you meant to say live.

And thats the difference in growers you had to add a heater and I added chillers, some of the biggest best grows I ever seen was 66-68F, but if i'm running at 66 apposed 70 0r 74, it doesn't mean everything else stays the same, why should it, So again if your limiting factors are optimized for you growing conditions there will be very ;little difference at all, so a side x side is bunk. if you don't change your parameters, I also run 2 EC from clone to finish, It doesn't mean everyone else is going to.

 

[freezeland2]

Yeah, that is what I am def expecting. I am stuck between topping and changing waters. I am using about 3 different types of root enhancers and cleaners, then with flushers and stuff like that, so I would imagine it will be pretty busy. I am doing 4 plants in a 4x4. And yeah, there is nothing I can think of that is not a part of a category that buffs of hydroponics plants that I missed. Topping is more difficult of the nutrient levels are low because of nutrient measurements, normally they measure in bigger sizes than a top off.

That’s what the auto monitoring system is for. It maintains EC and ph values at what ever you set them at.