Can anyone please tell me whats happening to my plants?

[YorkshireNewbie]

I used canna coco pro and added 30% perlite for these grows, because theyre apparently the best coco out there, but ive had nothing but problems with it.
I use canna calmag agent, and Hydrocrop Hydrosol powdered nutes.

The pH drift is a constant battle, and their last run offs were 6.5pH-7.0pH, but ive been feeding them consistently at 5.7pH.

They've grown okay, albeit with problems, but these past few days, since upping their dose as the pistils began to emerge and adding 0.25ml per litre of plant magic PK13/14, the leaves have begun to look properly weird.
The fingers of the leaves haven't spread out, but instead they've sort of stacked on top of one another in a weird pattern, and trying to identify this issue online is a pointless task. All i get back is tips for canoeing leaves, which they are NOT.

They're in week 5 of flowering, in a 1M² tent, in 5 litre pots under a maxibright 360.
feeding at 1.7ec, at 5.7pH, and getting 1.6 to 2.2ec back in run off. between 6.3ph (which isnt a huge concern) right through to one plant with 7.0pH(!!!!)

I'm following the feeding chart at 1.7EC.
I'm following the umols chart at 650.
I'm following the tent temps (24°c/19°c)
Humidity is a touch high at 60, but not a concern.
They've got space, food, watered twice every 3 days, nice temps, not bad humidity, good light, good airflow...

Whats going on???

 

[LoveGrowingIt]

I'm not seeing the problem you described. The settings are good, except the 19C (about 66F) seems a bit cold for early flower but it's in the normally recommended range.

 

[JIMKSI64]

I do not run coco but I hear stuff.
Coco, especially in flower likes to be fed daily and some growers do multiple fertigations every day.
You also appear to have a very conservative light setting for the week 5 flower and the plant appears to be stretched and not filling in indicating the p and k boost for flower may not be optimal but this can just be the feed rate.
Some coco guys should be along but you may want to hit those 3 horizontal bars and look for forums, then catagories, then look for grow diaries.
Once in diaries use the spyglass feature to tag words in your search like promix and your nutrition and anything else you want to look for. It will then like posts that hit your requests.
Some diaries are great with numbers and such and some are just a warning on what not to do. Both are important to new growers

 

[Ninjadogma]

I used canna coco pro and added 30% perlite for these grows, because theyre apparently the best coco out there, but ive had nothing but problems with it.
I use canna calmag agent, and Hydrocrop Hydrosol powdered nutes.

The pH drift is a constant battle, and their last run offs were 6.5pH-7.0pH, but ive been feeding them consistently at 5.7pH.

They've grown okay, albeit with problems, but these past few days, since upping their dose as the pistils began to emerge and adding 0.25ml per litre of plant magic PK13/14, the leaves have begun to look properly weird.
The fingers of the leaves haven't spread out, but instead they've sort of stacked on top of one another in a weird pattern, and trying to identify this issue online is a pointless task. All i get back is tips for canoeing leaves, which they are NOT.

They're in week 5 of flowering, in a 1M² tent, in 5 litre pots under a maxibright 360.
feeding at 1.7ec, at 5.7pH, and getting 1.6 to 2.2ec back in run off. between 6.3ph (which isnt a huge concern) right through to one plant with 7.0pH(!!!!)

I'm following the feeding chart at 1.7EC.
I'm following the umols chart at 650.
I'm following the tent temps (24°c/19°c)
Humidity is a touch high at 60, but not a concern.
They've got space, food, watered twice every 3 days, nice temps, not bad humidity, good light, good airflow...

Whats going on???


View attachment 2596287View attachment 2596299View attachment 2596287View attachment 2596299

I don't see any visible worrisome issues with the plant yet but that upward pH drift is definitely an issue. A solvable one though! I know you're using a buffered coco but it can still have issues with cation exchange, especially if it's not kept constantly moist. If you do even mild drybacks it can start pulling cal and mag out and swapping it out with potassium and sodium, and while it's happening, the environment goes alkaline. So make sure you keep that coco properly moist all the time. If you're worried about root oxygen, throw some more perlite in.

For what it's worth, peat is weird too. By nature it's acidic and so sometimes it's buffered with dolomite, and aggressive drybacks drive the pH up... but it comes back down so it's not something you want to chase and fix, the fix is to prevent it in the first place with less aggressive drybacks. And with coco, no drybacks.

 

[stanknkatz]

Try to keep your temps up a little above that 24c mark, and quit starving them. Fertigate them at least 2x a day every day. It's coco and you pretty much cannot over water in coco if that's what is holding you back. 5 weeks in flower I'd expect to see your buds way more developed, and I suspect it's because they're lacking food.

 

[LoveGrowingIt]

5 weeks in flower

The OP might mean 5 weeks from flipping the light.

 

[YorkshireNewbie]

I'm not seeing the problem you described. The settings are good, except the 19C (about 66F) seems a bit cold for early flower but it's in the normally recommended range.

Its those weird leaves mate. Thats whats concerning me. They dont look at all normal.

 

[YorkshireNewbie]

The OP might mean 5 weeks from flipping the light.

Sorry, you're absolutely right. Its five week from flipping to 12/12.
They were growing fine before the PK boost, although slowly but I schwazzed them a week back and theyve been slow to grow since too.
They shouldn't be hungry though. Their run off EC is equal to, or slightly higher, than the input feed.
Am I missing something?

 

[YorkshireNewbie]

Try to keep your temps up a little above that 24c mark, and quit starving them. Fertigate them at least 2x a day every day. It's coco and you pretty much cannot over water in coco if that's what is holding you back. 5 weeks in flower I'd expect to see your buds way more developed, and I suspect it's because they're lacking food. View attachment 2596382

This is the part which keeps tripping me up.
Whenever ive tried twice diary feeds, the coco always gets super algae coverage, and I think that fungus was what led, eventually, to my last crop contracting botyritis.
Naturally, ive developed a huge reluctance to water heavily, even though im aware it may be causing issues at the other end.

Their run off EC is pretty mich equal or slightly higher than their input EC, but these are grown from 15 year old white widow seeds, and im told theyre heavy feeders. Finding the right balance is tough, especially in Northern England where its freezing cold at this time of year with damn near 100% humidity. Its TOUGH, man.

 

[shooter64738]

I don't see any visible worrisome issues with the plant yet but that upward pH drift is definitely an issue. A solvable one though! I know you're using a buffered coco but it can still have issues with cation exchange, especially if it's not kept constantly moist. If you do even mild drybacks it can start pulling cal and mag out and swapping it out with potassium and sodium, and while it's happening, the environment goes alkaline. So make sure you keep that coco properly moist all the time. If you're worried about root oxygen, throw some more perlite in.

For what it's worth, peat is weird too. By nature it's acidic and so sometimes it's buffered with dolomite, and aggressive drybacks drive the pH up... but it comes back down so it's not something you want to chase and fix, the fix is to prevent it in the first place with less aggressive drybacks. And with coco, no drybacks.

I concur with this 100% when your coco dries too much you get cation issues. You're getting possibly close to lockout issues with your plants. I switched to coco a few years ago and I love it, but there was some 'differences' than with spil, this being one of them.

I have high alkaline well water and use phosphoric acid to bring my ph down. You might flush with water and try to get you coco ph down some.

I have also had some algae from time to time and I sprayed it with 3% peroxide solution. But these days I dont even do that. With your temp and humidity low your probably not at a high risk of fungus and bacteria. But a mild shot of peroxide once a week may help keep algae at bay if it worries you.

Try watering 4x per day in your coco, smaller amounts at a time. I dont water to run off either. I water to a point that I might see some run off in the pan and stop. If I get consistent large amounts of run off, I will cut back on water duration but not frequency.

 

[PlumberSoCal2]

I'm hearing recommendations all over the map here. In coco you fertigate 3 or more times a day with 10-20% runoff. Never allow the coco to dry out.

Growing in coco is the easiest way to grow but until you understand that coco is basically inert and does not act like soil you'll have issues. The only real negative is dealing with all the waste water. Lawn, flowerbeds or sewer. Back off the Ca to half from mid flower on.

Fertigate fertigate fertigate and see what happens

 

[Ninjadogma]

I'm hearing recommendations all over the map here. In coco you fertigate 3 or more times a day with 10-20% runoff. Never allow the coco to dry out.

Growing in coco is the easiest way to grow but until you understand that coco is basically inert and does not act like soil you'll have issues. The only real negative is dealing with all the waste water. Lawn, flowerbeds or sewer. Back off the Ca to half from mid flower on.

Fertigate fertigate fertigate and see what happens

If no nutrients in the mix, Watergate Watergate Watergate

And that right there is the real reason I don't grow in coco. I want a personal life outside of growing cannabis.

 

[PlumberSoCal2]

If no nutrients in the mix, Watergate Watergate Watergate

And that right there is the real reason I don't grow in coco. I want a personal life outside of growing cannabis.

Yup, it's a chore but there are ways to automate the fertigations. I plan on running to the mountains several times this year so I've got to get the auto fert set up again.

 

[stanknkatz]

This is the part which keeps tripping me up.
Whenever ive tried twice diary feeds, the coco always gets super algae coverage, and I think that fungus was what led, eventually, to my last crop contracting botyritis.
Naturally, ive developed a huge reluctance to water heavily, even though im aware it may be causing issues at the other end.

Their run off EC is pretty mich equal or slightly higher than their input EC, but these are grown from 15 year old white widow seeds, and im told theyre heavy feeders. Finding the right balance is tough, especially in Northern England where its freezing cold at this time of year with damn near 100% humidity. Its TOUGH, man.

This might clear things up a bit for you. Or make it clear as mud. Lots of good info for growing in coco on this site.

How to Manage Run-off EC - Coco For Cannabis

Learn how to manage Elelctrical Conductivity (EC) in your coco grow. Simple instructions how to control EC to maximize growth & keep plants happy & healthy!

www.cocoforcannabis.com

 

[YorkshireNewbie]

I concur with this 100% when your coco dries too much you get cation issues. You're getting possibly close to lockout issues with your plants. I switched to coco a few years ago and I love it, but there was some 'differences' than with spil, this being one of them.

I have high alkaline well water and use phosphoric acid to bring my ph down. You might flush with water and try to get you coco ph down some.

I have also had some algae from time to time and I sprayed it with 3% peroxide solution. But these days I dont even do that. With your temp and humidity low your probably not at a high risk of fungus and bacteria. But a mild shot of peroxide once a week may help keep algae at bay if it worries you.

Try watering 4x per day in your coco, smaller amounts at a time. I dont water to run off either. I water to a point that I might see some run off in the pan and stop. If I get consistent large amounts of run off, I will cut back on water duration but not frequency.

I really appreciate the way you explained this. It makes it easy for my scatterbrain to understand whats happening.

Ive just bought an automatic watering kit in response to you guys' suggestions.
Its been something ive felt ive needed for a while, but was hoping to avoid the expense.
its becoming untenable, however, to keep watering 15 plants by hand in two cramped tents, so ive bitten the bullet and bought the kit.
Res, pump, lines and air stones.

Fingers crossed that helps solve it.

I really appreciate you guys, man.
I only started this growing game about 6 months ago so having your guys experience is class.

 

[carlosescobar]

those temps are a bit low , if your room is 20-24 oC the soil will be around 17-19 oc and the plant will probably grow very slow. Ive got some struggling seedlings at the moment and as soon as i put a heater in there and the soil temp goes up to 23 they thrive , . Im thinking of getting one of these heaters ,(£15 dunelm/BandM) i did have a greenhouse heater in there last year but the electric bills doubled .

 

[Redneckx]

Sup guys! Haven't been around for year...was quit busy and stopped smoking for a couple of month, als was done with growing for a time as well, but didn't get rid of it and just love to grow, because never really had any huge problems.
Smoking made me kinda depressed and mad.

Now since a good week stumbling around here again, loved all the folks here and now reading all the Coco stuff makes me feel, I gotta tell my shit to it

So I had around 4 runs with Coco, feeling pretty well with it and never go back to peat!
Hearing all the Coco science and knowledge from professional home growers are probably the best way to Coco.

But for me to be said I treat Coco like soil, ever had and maybe will because i'm a lazy fuck who don't own a drip sys yet. Did regular feedings from top without run off, now I just soak my pots in a big bucket.
Growing with atami coco b'cuzz(pink label), which is washed and buffed and now trying the brown one with lower EC, both without perlite or stuff, just some clays at the bottom of my air pots.

I give them a proper dryback ~3 days in 5l- 12,5l pots. Never had an issue. Even now starting the fourth week from flip, 3 plants(two in 5l, one in 12,5l)
Feeding Mega Crop(2 part) which I love to use, last run with just one part of it(part a) and during flower some PK boost 50/30 and Bud candy from AN.
I think it's even possible to just grow with part a without additives and just tab water.
Also grew some nice buds with full organic liquids, some worm castings, same drybacks and no Problems.
Just can't recommend canna Coco professional, used the first time and had a ton of gnats.

Now all that said, it's not necessary to water them that often! Doesn't mean it's best to treat Coco like that. But I never have problems and good outcome.

4 days ago, 18 days from flip.

Cheers everyone

 

[carlosescobar]

Sorry, you're absolutely right. Its five week from flipping to 12/12.
They were growing fine before the PK boost, although slowly but I schwazzed them a week back and theyve been slow to grow since too.
They shouldn't be hungry though. Their run off EC is equal to, or slightly higher, than the input feed.
Am I missing something?

they might have got a bit too much P/K , ive only used it once (after the guy in the shop told me to be careful with it) i gave it 2mls and the leaves started curling , i think salts had built up and the PK tipped it over the edge.
ive just bought one of these heaters from b and m and its perfect. thermal cut off so i can set the temp, 2 speed fan, AND it swivels 360 degrees! and i can plug it in at the wall

 

[Ninjadogma]

those temps are a bit low , if your room is 20-24 oC the soil will be around 17-19 oc and the plant will probably grow very slow. Ive got some struggling seedlings at the moment and as soon as i put a heater in there and the soil temp goes up to 23 they thrive , . Im thinking of getting one of these heaters ,(£15 dunelm/BandM) i did have a greenhouse heater in there last year but the electric bills doubled .

A lot of extra energy used heating the air just to heat the soil. The above ground part of the plant doesn't mind the cold, they look happy in the sun even with temps in the 40's but you want to keep those root temps above 60° and the real sweet zone is low 70's. You can use a seed mat or a heated plant pot, the heated pots run about $100. You can also wrap a pot with a weather resistent electric blanket. I don't know about the heated pots but the blankets and seed mats don't use much wattage. The mats are only about 20w and blankets have about a 100w draw, shouldn't break the bank the way a room heater with a 1500w draw would.

 

[PlumberSoCal2]

I really appreciate the way you explained this. It makes it easy for my scatterbrain to understand whats happening.

Ive just bought an automatic watering kit in response to you guys' suggestions.
Its been something ive felt ive needed for a while, but was hoping to avoid the expense.
its becoming untenable, however, to keep watering 15 plants by hand in two cramped tents, so ive bitten the bullet and bought the kit.
Res, pump, lines and air stones.

Fingers crossed that helps solve it.

I really appreciate you guys, man.
I only started this growing game about 6 months ago so having your guys experience is class.

Never allow the plants to sit in the waste water.

On a side note when I made the switch to coco I bought all the electronic testers. They're all sitting in a box that I haven't opened in 5 years. I don't bother testing anything anymore. If you fertigate 3 - 5 x's a day you won't have any issues.

15 whole plants? I use to auto fertigate 4-5 dozen in my small greenhouse. My large greenhouse even more, and of course before I set up the auto watering I was fertigating BY HAND while running a small plumbing repair business and still getting in 3 x's a day, most days