(Fatman's) DIY nutrient mixing guide

[REGISTRD]

it takes MINUTES to measure out salts and add them to water. i can tweak a formula on the computer and mix up a different batch a few minutes later. you don't have to let this stuff ferment, or age, or sit. it's faster to mix my own, than to drive across town to buy nutes...and it's probably cheaper than the gasoline i burn.

maybe you just need more knowledge, and try it yourself.

thats what im talking about... it is this easy once your at that point....
Hey crys are u letting them dissolve for any amount of time before you feed? I been letting em dissolve overningt seperatly.
But this has me thinking I could take a 5 gal buket fill it with water add my salts per my res. throw it in my res add the rest of the water and call it a day.. What do you all think?
Thatd be actually as fast or FASTER than mixing commercial nutes per each bottle.. :thinking

 

[REGISTRD]

I didnt start out to save money, was just trying to figure out which brand bottled nutes to go with, and sort of got sucked in.

Shows your willing to learn then.. Shit i have old partners that swear by AN. yet I ask them whats NPK and they have NO clue... lol...

 

[Spaceman3]

This thread is great, with lots of interesting information. I grow in soil, and at the moment I'm on a very tight budget. I can buy the trace elements ready mixed very cheaply, and the other ingredients are cheap too. I would like to make a liquid feed that I can dilute, hopefully to match the Bio bizz range of nutes. Their NPK is as follows:

NPK 8-2-6 (Grow)

NPK 2-6-3.5 (Bloom)

Would it be possible for me to make a concentrated liquid feed, that I can dilute when I water my plants (they are in soil)?

What would I have to do differently, and what kind of concentrations would I need (metric measurements would be great! :D ) From reading the whole thread, people have hinted that the pH maybe a problem, but surely theres a way to balance it?

Sorry to bump my own post, but has anyone had any experience of mixing their own nutes for soil growing?

We soil growers get just as screwed as hydro growers when it comes to nutes, so it would be great to find a solution :)

 

[Crysmatic]

thats what im talking about... it is this easy once your at that point....
Hey crys are u letting them dissolve for any amount of time before you feed? I been letting em dissolve overningt seperatly.
But this has me thinking I could take a 5 gal buket fill it with water add my salts per my res. throw it in my res add the rest of the water and call it a day.. What do you all think?
Thatd be actually as fast or FASTER than mixing commercial nutes per each bottle.. :thinking

i make a/b solutions. i used to measure all the salts into a cup, and dump them in cold water...and i had precipitate. precipitate isn't a problem - just shake before you add to your res - adding it to a larger volume dissolves the precipitate. now i add one chemical at a time to lukewarm water and let dissolve fully before adding the next. before i feed my plants, i add part a, stir for 10 seconds, then add part b.

it sounds like you're saying: add the total salts for a 50gal res into a 5 gal bucket...and then dump into the 50 gal res. that's fine. why not just make 5 gal of a/b solution? imo, it's a little more work up front, and makes life easier down the road. it also keeps you from measuring out the salts wrong, or differently each res change. hth

 

[PuFFnNugg]

Any information on what nute delivery system is being used in conjuction with these fert programs. I know fatman said aero...What about average number of days in flower? Do the fert programs like fatmans with high ppm of N in flower take longer to ripen? Any info you can post about the delivery system and aggressiveness (number of days flowering) with your fert programs would be helpful. Thanks guys

 

[squarepusher]

hey square did you ever build fatmans system??

I got the parts ordered, its on my immediately to do list :)

Gunna start tinkering with some medium pressure tub aero hopefully real soon :party0044:

 

[Seamaiden]

Sorry to bump my own post, but has anyone had any experience of mixing their own nutes for soil growing?

We soil growers get just as screwed as hydro growers when it comes to nutes, so it would be great to find a solution :)

I'm kind of doing it right now, except it's a friend of mine who's doing the nute mixing. You can do it, don't be afraid.

 

[MeJuana]

Any information on what nute delivery system is being used in conjuction with these fert programs. I know fatman said aero...What about average number of days in flower? Do the fert programs like fatmans with high ppm of N in flower take longer to ripen? Any info you can post about the delivery system and aggressiveness (number of days flowering) with your fert programs would be helpful. Thanks guys

Hey brother we are using many different ratios, there is no standard. Say a guy bought the whole line of Advanced Nutrients, he has a high pressure aero system and a dirt garden going. What in his nutrients will change? Application rate/strength and that is it heck I even use Hydro nutes on my soil plants. Choosing your growing system is for you. Deciding when to cut N out of late flowering plants and etc we will probably talk about on here but you can learn a lot looking at the reversed engineered formulas being posted too.

 

[squarepusher]

I'm kind of doing it right now, except it's a friend of mine who's doing the nute mixing. You can do it, don't be afraid.

soil should be the same really, no? Except you want ammonium nitrogen instead of nitrate nitrogen ?

 

[Crysmatic]

Sorry to bump my own post, but has anyone had any experience of mixing their own nutes for soil growing?

We soil growers get just as screwed as hydro growers when it comes to nutes, so it would be great to find a solution :)

just use at the same rate as you're using biobizz nutes.

their grow is basically 3-1-2. their flower is a little tricky to copy.

if you're using chemical ferts, why not go to soiless/coco?

fyi, a rule of thumb when mixing salts is least soluble to most soluble. e.g. potassium nitrate is dissolved before calcium nitrate.

The solubility is @ 25C. Solubility increases with higher temp, decreases with lower temp. i didn't find the solubility of iron eddha.

Boric acid 57 g/L
Zinc sulfate 220 g/L
MKP 220 g/L
Epsom salts 255 g/L
Copper sulfate 320 g/L
Potassium nitrate 360 g/L
Manganese sulfate 393 g/L
Calcium nitrate 1290 g/L

 

[Seamaiden]

soil should be the same really, no? Except you want ammonium nitrogen instead of nitrate nitrogen ?

Yeah, well, it really depends on what you're trying to do. I... I honestly don't remember any recommendation regarding N forms other than be wary of urea.

And if you're talking about NO3 nitrate nitrogen, that's what you usually end up with in a fish tank, and we probably both know people who've rocked the fishy aquaponics or used their old aquarium water on their soil girls. I call it "soft" nitrogen, because it's ready to go on to be broken down further into oxygen and nitrogen, but in aquaria that requires a super low flow through an anaerobic bed--risky with fish and risky with Mary in my experience.

Outside of that the issue is organic vs chemical salt, and I believe that a balance may be achieved if one is very, very careful. I will see with some girls this year, at the very least. Kinda too bad it takes a whole season to find out, though.

 

[Spaceman3]

just use at the same rate as you're using biobizz nutes.

their grow is basically 3-1-2. their flower is a little tricky to copy.

if you're using chemical ferts, why not go to soiless/coco?

fyi, a rule of thumb when mixing salts is least soluble to most soluble. e.g. potassium nitrate is dissolved before calcium nitrate.

The solubility is @ 25C. Solubility increases with higher temp, decreases with lower temp. i didn't find the solubility of iron eddha.

Boric acid 57 g/L
Zinc sulfate 220 g/L
MKP 220 g/L
Epsom salts 255 g/L
Copper sulfate 320 g/L
Potassium nitrate 360 g/L
Manganese sulfate 393 g/L
Calcium nitrate 1290 g/L

Afaik I will need MPK, Calcium Nitrate and Potassium Sulphate to formulate my required NPK. Also I will also need some additional magnesium via Magnesium Sulfate and trace elements.

I can get everything cheaply and easily and I can also get the trace ready mixed, but my main concern is the calcium nitrate as it deteriorates in air? I'm also a little unsure about the Iron Chelate, as I'm not sure what quantities I need, and as it can be used as a weedkiller it worries me! I dont even fully understand what the Iron Chelate is for! Would this stuff work? :




I can do the math to the get required NPK, but if I premix a concentrated solution, will anything happen to it if its sat there for upto 3 months? I've also read that the ph can be a problem?

 

[Crysmatic]

the NPK is 2-4-10 with 1.9% sulfur, and ingredients are Monopotassium phosphate, potassium nitrate, potassium sulphate and the other main ingredient which is 95% of the formula, water!

whenever they list sulfur, it's coming from epsom salts. for every 1% sulfur, there's 0.75% magnesium. in this case there's 0.75 x 1.9% = 1.4% magnesium which they don't list!

 

[Crysmatic]

i made up budboy's concentrated clearex last week...and today i noticed mold on the inside of the bottle. maybe clearex is so diluted because it doesn't have enough sugar to feed mold? maybe they use a chemical/fungicide that they don't list? is it perhaps my cane sugar, vs granulated sugar? should it be refridgerated?

it seems easier to add sugar straight to my mixing bucket. 1 tsp/20L...

 

[MeJuana]

I'm also a little unsure about the Iron Chelate, as I'm not sure what quantities I need, and as it can be used as a weedkiller it worries me! I dont even fully understand what the Iron Chelate is for! Would this stuff work?

It's a little important you understand what's up with iron and why we have to wrap it in something

http://allhydroponics.blogspot.com/2010/08/iron-sources-in-hydroponics-which-one.html

 

[budboy299]

I just found that out too crysmatic...about the clearex developing mold. I guess in the inert ingredients they probably have put a preservative in there to keep it clean. I'm thinking that you are right about simply adding the dry ingredients straight to your nutrient tank in order to avoid this.

Also a neat trick I just figured out....
When weighing out your sodium molybdate which usually runs about .08grams for a 4L concentrate, it is hard to get the weight right because my scale only reads to .1

What I do now is combine 250ml of water to 1.0 grams of sodium molybdate. Then I simply draw off 20 ml of the mixture for my solution. The leftovers I divide up into 20ml amounts and add each to a bit of water in an icecube tray and freeze. Then I place the cubes all together in a ziplock bag for future use. Warning though...make sure you mark everything for safety sake!!

I use alot of ferts because I use them in my flower gardens at home, so I don't mind mixing up quite a bit of this at a time. -BB

 

[PuFFnNugg]

I'm gonna get rid of my old stuff before I start mixing my own. using Gh three part gonna need to add P, I'm thinking Potassium Sulphate. Also I don't see anyone using it in their recipes, but if i could add Potassium Magnesium Sulphate it would save me having to buy more sweet which is expensive. Could I use Potassium Sulphate and Epson Salts or would that add Sulphur twice? Is there anything that is nothing but Potassium?

Yes it is apparent that there is no correct formula for MJ nutes yet, and that it would varie with different strains anyhow. But in the copy of Fatman's post it said that if u lower your Mg/Cal ratio you could increase the amount of nutes your plants intake. That was on a Drain to Waste system with low ppm though. So thats what I'm wondering if everyone that is designing there nutes with low Ca/Mg running similar aero systems. There is great info on this thread just saying it would be more helpful to know delivery system, tds run, and days in flower.

 

[MeJuana]

I am no expert here is what I came up for Potassium products, I found Potassium Silicate very personally interesting, now I am off searching for it.. LOL

potassium chloride (KCl)
potassium monobasic phosphate(KH2PO4)
potassium dibasic phosphate(K2H2PO4)
potassium magnesium sulfate (K2SO4 ○ 2MgSO4)
potassium nitrate (KNO3)
potassium sulfate (K2SO4)
potassium hydroxide(KOH)
potassium carbonate (K2CO3)
potassium silicate (K2SiO3)

Edit: I fixed the chemistry symbols on some elements.

Edit Edit: Again not an expert just playing with ideas here, you verify on you own :D

 

[PuFFnNugg]

Yeah potassium silicate is a good one, silicate is a bloom enhancer on its own. I've used it for years, it's great for raising ph as well. I would mix it in first or dilute the crap out of it when adding to res, it will lock up nutes if not.

Is it safe to assume that Potassium Chloride or any Chloride will kill Microbes/Beneficials?

I was looking at K-Mag for sale and a bunch have Chloride in them. Does all Potassium Magnesium Sulfate have Chloride?

Any other salts that usually have Chloride added to them?

 

[MeJuana]

I would be concerned about the chlorine level which I couldn't figure out what Potassium Chlorides working numbers are.. If I remember right fatman said 2 ppm chlorine, however chlorine tends to evap off right? hmm