Cheap alternatives to overpriced hydroponic nutrients

[organicness]

Ah.... that's perfect. Thank you a million times over.

 

[max_well]

calmag percentages

thanks for all the info Snowblind
I'm curious about the ingredients of calmag.
Label says 3.2% calcium, %2.0 nitrogen, 1.2 Mg derived from the sources you stated, Calcium Nitrate, Mag Nitrate, (and also Fe EDTA).

How could the N/Ca ratio be this high using Nitrate as calcium and magnesium sources? CalNit alone gives a 1.2 Ca to 1 N ratio of ppm, and the use of Mag Nitrate as a Mg source will also contribute to N... so how could the ratio end up as 3.2 to 2?
thanks for any insights!

 

[skywalkerOG]

Just finished this Chem-T using only jacks per Snow Blinds instructions. Results are world class.

 

[Capulator]

3.0 grams/ gal of hydro comes out to 680 ppm on a .7 conversion = .97 EC
1.0 grams of epsom salt comes out to 120 ppm= .17 EC
1.8 grams of cal nitrate comes out to 330 ppm =.47 EC

This was all measured after I added each to 100 gallons of demineralized (RO) water in the order above, and waiting for EC to stabilize before adding each additional part.

Total EC using demineralized (RO) water= 1.61

I measured it all out with my triple beam to the tenth of a gram.

As it turns out:

1/8 tsp of hydro = 1 gram
1/8 tsp of CaNO3= .9 grams
1/8 tsp of epsom = .5 grams

So if you don't have a scale, I imagine you can use this to get to where you need to be.

I had been using skywalkers formula, which was giving me different numbers:

500 ppm or .71 EC hydro
70 ppm or .1 EC Mg
200ppm or .29 EC CaNO3
Total ppm/EC= 770/ 1.1EC

My plants look a little hungry for N and maybe too much P for this formula. Switching tomorrow to SB's formula to see if there will be any visible difference within the week.

Will check ratios later to see if there is any difference, or if I was just feeding with a less concentrated mix.

 

[Capulator]

Just finished this Chem-T using only jacks per Snow Blinds instructions. Results are world class.

Skywalker those looks delicious. Nice job with the jacks.

 

[Snowblind]

My ratios, which are not really mine will not leave your plants hungry for N! That I can promise you. Even in late flower plants will be green!!!


I dont think plants like the P to be much higher than 40ppm....


You guys want some Jacks pictures in this thread?


Maybe we should just start a Jacks/Crop King thread.......

To me using Jacks or a comparable formula is one step away from mixing your own nutes.....

 

[H3AD_CAS3]

IMHO...A Jacks/CK thread would def be an asset to our community...Especially one that is pic laden.

My ratios, which are not really mine will not leave your plants hungry for N! That I can promise you. Even in late flower plants will be green!!!


I dont think plants like the P to be much higher than 40ppm....


You guys want some Jacks pictures in this thread?


Maybe we should just start a Jacks/Crop King thread.......

To me using Jacks or a comparable formula is one step away from mixing your own nutes.....

 

[Snowblind]

Ive been wanting to start one up...maybe ill do it...

 

[Capulator]

SB,

Did your EC come close to what I listed above when you were using the jacks hydro mix?

I got 1.6, hihger than what yosemite sam was running. I belive he said he was trying to get down to 1.1, but was running at 1.5 all the way through.

 

[Snowblind]

I think my ec is around 1.6 too? Yosemite was not adding epsoms for his plants. He is a very good grower and a very smart, bright guy. He is also a member here but does not post a whole lot. Perhaps without the epsoms the ec would be a little lower. 1.6 is lower than most feeds from most people.

 

[skywalkerOG]

I think my ec is around 1.6 too? Yosemite was not adding epsoms for his plants. He is a very good grower and a very smart, bright guy. He is also a member here but does not post a whole lot. Perhaps without the epsoms the ec would be a little lower. 1.6 is lower than most feeds from most people.

I started mine out feeding .9EC of Hydro and .6EC of Cal-Nitrate. That was based on the instructions from icmag. Starting about week 2 of flower I changed it to .7, .1, .3.

I made the mistake of adding the epsom after the cal-nitrate and definitely saw the fallout.

With CES I feed at 1.9 in flower and 2.0 in veg. So this 1.1 EC has me very excited.

The nute burn came on mine from a full dose of jacks at week 6 when they started to swell.

 

[Capulator]

I started mine out feeding .9EC of Hydro and .6EC of Cal-Nitrate. That was based on the instructions from icmag. Starting about week 2 of flower I changed it to .7, .1, .3.

I made the mistake of adding the epsom after the cal-nitrate and definitely saw the fallout.

With CES I feed at 1.9 in flower and 2.0 in veg. So this 1.1 EC has me very excited.

The nute burn came on mine from a full dose of jacks at week 6 when they started to swell.

Whats CES?

 

[Snowblind]

For the people who are new to this thread plz follow this order when mixing Jacks Hydroponic.....I mix in orange 5 gallon buckets from home depot. I use a 50 gallon black active aqua reso, which is much better than the 40 gallon white botties. I short fill this reso with about 30 gallons of water......


I add 50ml or a little more of DMZ and dump that in the water....

1)Always mix up the Jacks with a large quantity of water and add that to your reso first, I do this with 5 gallons of water and stir it around let it sit stir it some more and then dump it in.

2) mix the epsoms next with some water and add that to your reso.....once again I do this in a dedicated 5 gallon bucket

3) mix the CalNitrate last with water and add last to the reso.....again I have a seperate bucket for mixing this up and then I dump it in the reso last, always last........


Then I top off the reso to 50 gallons and add some ph down........this seems to work ok for me and forms a solution without flocculation.


Calcium does not like to be mixed with Phosphorus and especially Sulphur.

I will talk about this more later....

 

[motherlode]

For the people who are new to this thread plz follow this order when mixing Jacks Hydroponic.....I mix in orange 5 gallon buckets from home depot. I use a 50 gallon black active aqua reso, which is much better than the 40 gallon white botties. I short fill this with about 30 gallons of water......


I add 50ml or a little more of DMZ and dump that in the water....

1)Always mix up the Jacks with a large quantity of water and add that to your reso first, I do this with 5 gallons of water and stir it around let it sit stir it some more and then dump it in.

2) mix the epsoms next with some water and add that to your reso.....once again I do this in a dedicated 5 gallon bucket

3) mix the CalNitrate last with water and add last to the reso.....again I have a seperate bucket for mixing this up and then I dump it in the reso last, always last........


Then I top off the reso to 50 gallons and add some ph down........this seems to work ok for me and forms a solution without flocculation.


Calcium does not like to be mixed with Phosphorus and especially Sulphur.

I will talk about this more later....

thats the shit - way to break it down and thx for sharing

this is a kick ass thread

 

[organicness]

Started using jack's this mornin'! Thanks all for the hard work thus far. I'm very excited about it.

 

[max_well]

thanks for all your insights Snowblind.
Do you have thoughts on making stock solutions for ease of use? Maybe dissolve ~3X g of Jack's in a gallon of water, and then ~2X g of CalNit in a separate gallon, so that adding equal volume from each to your rez will give you ~target ppm? Max solubility of Jack's in hot water is given as 3 lb per gallon, but it seems wise to reduce that significantly, so that batches are used more quickly. epsom could also be dilluted too of course.

For the people who are new to this thread plz follow this order when mixing Jacks Hydroponic.....I mix in orange 5 gallon buckets from home depot. I use a 50 gallon black active aqua reso, which is much better than the 40 gallon white botties. I short fill this with about 30 gallons of water......


I add 50ml or a little more of DMZ and dump that in the water....

1)Always mix up the Jacks with a large quantity of water and add that to your reso first, I do this with 5 gallons of water and stir it around let it sit stir it some more and then dump it in.

2) mix the epsoms next with some water and add that to your reso.....once again I do this in a dedicated 5 gallon bucket

3) mix the CalNitrate last with water and add last to the reso.....again I have a seperate bucket for mixing this up and then I dump it in the reso last, always last........


Then I top off the reso to 50 gallons and add some ph down........this seems to work ok for me and forms a solution without flocculation.


Calcium does not like to be mixed with Phosphorus and especially Sulphur.

I will talk about this more later....

 

[Capulator]

FROM THE SITE:

TRADITIONAL HYDROPONIC FORMULAS
A traditional hydroponic two-part fertility system uses a combination of Jack’s Professional Hydroponic 5-12-26 and Jack’s Professional Calcium Nitrate 15.5-0-0, this system can be easily customized to fit your operation, whether you grow 2 or 20,000 hydroponic plants. For a traditional system follow the special mixing directions below.
SPECIAL MIXING DIRECTIONS FOR TRADITIONAL NUTRIENTS

Jack’s Hydroponic formulation and Jack’s Calcium Nitrate are packaged separately, and require a little special attention when mixing - in order to avoid forming a precipitant in the tank. These products must be dissolved either in a two tank system or in dilute (or Ready-to-Use) quantities. Following these specific stepwise directions is vital, along with the knowledge that these items should NEVER be mixed in a concentrate tank together.

On a small scale, the easiest way to use our Jack’s Hydroponic System is to create a ready-to-use solution by combining ½ teaspoon of each formulation per gallon of water - just make sure you do not combine them in any stronger concentrations or the materials will solidify and drop to the bottom of the solution. Also, be sure to aerate the solution with a bubbler or change the solution every other day to maintain proper oxygen levels.

Note: An alternative to mixing the products together is to apply them separately, using one at a time and alternating them every other feeding. This will assure that your plants are receiving the ideal levels of nutrients.
NEW – COMPLETE, ONE BAG FORMULAS

The research and development team at JR Peters has developed several new products that deliver all the essential elements for hydroponically grown crops with the ease and innovation of a one bag blend. These high quality and extremely soluble nutrient blends deliver the optimum balance of macro, secondary and micronutrients that can be mixed together in ready to use or concentrated form.

The strength of the fertilizer solution should be determined by the amount of Nitrogen in the formula. Directions for each blend can be found on the bag, and should always be referenced with specific nutrient targets for the crops you are growing.

These specialized products are available directly through JR Peters Inc. on our website HERE. Products are available in 1lb, 5lb and 25lb containers. Feel free to place your order directly online or call the lab directly to order.

 

[Capulator]

I have mine pre measured in tupperwares. Just marked the container of where I need to be for all three products, and filled them up. I have 3 small canisters that are RTU for each feeding. This way I dont have to weigh them out each time. I just grab the jacks hydro, blend with warm RO water, then add to res. next, epsom. Finally, cal nitrate. I turn a high powered pump on in the res to circulate the water quickly.

See my calcs in previous post to see the EC you should be at per SBs numbers @ 80%.

My plants look healthy still, and the leaves ARE tough to pull off, even when they are yellow and spent.

 

[Capulator]

SB,

See these pics, and notice the leaf curl and soem yellowing of the leaves as well. I think I was feeding too light at weeks 1 and 2. The picture of one plant you can see the downward curl. The other, no curl... super healthy. Half of the plants (same strain), got downward curl, and the other half look great. Same system, same row even. I am thinking maybe they just werent as healthy to begin with. Its pretty interesting.

You can also see some yellowing of leaves in the group shot (interveinal chlorosis) which looks like N deficiency.

weeks 1 and 2 I was at 1.1 EC. Changed the water yesterday to 1.6 EC. We will see how they look today.

 

[Snowblind]

Lets see how they do. Im sure the 1.6 ec wont leave a N deficiency. If it does a little more Ca Nitrate will solve that problem. 110-125 ppm of N is usually plenty of N for most people. Its Mg that I feel my plants have always needed a touch more of in many formulas.

The root systems are probably a little different on each plant. Some of your plants can uptake the nutes readily the others maybe not quite so much that have the downward curl. I wish we could see all the roots on every plant. Its really the root zone that matters. Everything else, the green growth up top, is an extension of the roots.

Ive always thought it was high P that caused most of the downward curl I see in plants. I could be wrong. The problem should not get any worse. Im excited to see how the plants respond to the formula. Ill try get some more pictures up of my plants in the TarDawg thread.

I dont mix them up in concentrates for mixing. I just weigh them out each time and mix. I do it will my reso is draining so I dont mind.

If you were to combine your stock solution of CaNo3 with the epsom stock solution in a glass together you would see the fallout from flocculation.


There should be no cloudiness or fallout in your reso for the new people reading this! If there is you are doing something wrong.