120-60-300-120-60-177.2 Nutrient Tutorial, or, My Thread Can Beat Up Your Thread.

[A1NUTRIENTS]

Props! That's how it's done on the synthetics side of the fence! Good Solid info here guys!

 

[dankworth]

damn this thread will beat up a lot of threads for sure....great info..

looks like beans of chemo x og kush aren't the easiest to find...

so you'll use this mix the whole way through flower,no boosters?

If you continue to google variations of search terms based around chemo x og kush, you will find it.
It would be impolite for me to say more out of respect for this place. I do not want to sound like I am spamming for anyone, just pointing out things as I see them.

I will of course be rocking the infamous hammerhead/moab combo in the last 2 weeks of feeding, as popularized by greenthumbdanny.
I am sure that my recipe is not perfect and will get fine-tuned over time.

I would like to remind everyone that I really don't know that much about the subject yet. So all the input from people is great.

 

[dankworth]

Props! That's how it's done on the synthetics side of the fence! Good Solid info here guys!

Thanks A1, I figured copying the formulas that the big kids were nice enough to kick down a few years ago is the best place to start. I have learned that when I emulate the successful actions of smart people, it improves my odds of success. And of appearing smart.

Really we should probably just thank JK right now.

Thanks, JK.

A1, the sulfur straight up causing the extra dankness is a great place to focus your effort. And I have witnessed firsthand the improvements in buds from using this new base instead of a 2-2-3 ratio(cns-17 coco/soil bloom). I think I would have been better suited to a 2-2-5(cns-17 hydro bloom) ratio if I had it to do over. This was in 1/4 coco 3/4 perlite hempy buckets. JK was right on about the N:K ratio for feeding a coco mix that is closer to straight hydro.
And I am sure my formula has disadvantages, potentially in terms of ph drift in a recirculating solution. I don't know any more than that right now.

 

[Jar Man]

What's up with the Molasses thing? Is it just a flavor enhancer or is there a benefit to potency and yield as well? Heard someone say it's a sulfur issue with Molasses.

 

[tokinupon1]

good thread dank! all this talk about the 6 pack around here I think im going to make a trip to the store.

 

[El Cerebro]

What's up with the Molasses thing? Is it just a flavor enhancer or is there a benefit to potency and yield as well? Heard someone say it's a sulfur issue with Molasses.

It's a source of mg and cal, and of course sulfur so long as you don't buy the kind that's unsul...

Other good threads here on molasses, one of them gets into this. [edit] There are some bullshit threads on it too, so you have to sift through a bit. Also check out J/K's comments on sugars..

 

[Donkdbz]

I will of course be rocking the infamous hammerhead/moab combo in the last 2 weeks of feeding, as popularized by greenthumbdanny.
I am sure that my recipe is not perfect and will get fine-tuned over time.

you have salts to do whatever you want with. hammerhead/moab is a waste of money.

moab is 90%mkp and 10%map
hammerhead is just potassium sulphate and mkp

if you wanna spike your PK just use a lil MKP and be done

 

[dankworth]

you have salts to do whatever you want with. hammerhead/moab is a waste of money.

moab is 90%mkp and 10%map
hammerhead is just potassium sulphate and mkp

if you wanna spike your PK just use a lil MKP and be done

Thanks Donkdbz, I do make my own hammerhead at this point, or rather incorporated it into my formula. Moab is the mkp &map, a pinch of B1, and an unspecified amount of triacontanol. I caused exactly the same behavior that I witnessed from the Moab when I added a bunch of alfalfa tea, which has the triacontanol, as well as all the aminos and nutrients.

Moab is not sold in OR, which is a clear red flag for an unlisted pgr being present. Then I saw the triacontanol rx from the tea, and I knew for sure.
I would like to know what their exact dosage is. I am stuck buying Moab until I can figure out the triacontanol content.

A bunch of alfalfa tea in wk 2-3 will put a halt to any vegging. Your plant will grow flowers NOW. And they will be like a week ahead on frostiness.

Moab, drip clean and Banana Manna are the only things left that I need to reverse engineer.

 

[Buddy Hemphill]

Thanks A1, I figured copying the formulas that the big kids were nice enough to kick down a few years ago is the best place to start. I have learned that when I emulate the successful actions of smart people, it improves my odds of success. And of appearing smart.

Really we should probably just thank JK right now.

Thanks, JK.

A1, the sulfur straight up causing the extra dankness is a great place to focus your effort. And I have witnessed firsthand the improvements in buds from using this new base instead of a 2-2-3 ratio(cns-17 coco/soil bloom). I think I would have been better suited to a 2-2-5(cns-17 hydro bloom) ratio if I had it to do over. This was in 1/4 coco 3/4 perlite hempy buckets. JK was right on about the N:K ratio for feeding a coco mix that is closer to straight hydro.
And I am sure my formula has disadvantages, potentially in terms of ph drift in a recirculating solution. I don't know any more than that right now.

JK is the man

Thanks Dank for posting your work. This is what I have been trying to figure out. This thread will be around for a while I bet.

props

 

[dankworth]

you have salts to do whatever you want with. hammerhead/moab is a waste of money.

moab is 90%mkp and 10%map
hammerhead is just potassium sulphate and mkp

if you wanna spike your PK just use a lil MKP and be done

You know, JK I think talked about how he would take his P from 60 to 90, and his K from 280 to 325 for 10 days around week 6. And he did well I recall.

I should do a 2-res room to see the results. I wonder also if the triacontanol in the moab causes the flowering period to take longer.

-thanks buddy, I was hoping that the form I put it in would make it click for people.

 

[Buddy Hemphill]

Moab, drip clean and Banana Manna are the only things left that I need to reverse engineer.

You ever heard of this as a replacement for drip clean?

http://stores.familyhydroponics-boulder.com/-strse-38/Primordial-Solutions-Sea-Green/Detail.bok

I need to call these people and see what this stuff is.

I was told its an organic sub for DC.

 

[dankworth]

You ever heard of this as a replacement for drip clean?

http://stores.familyhydroponics-boulder.com/-strse-38/Primordial-Solutions-Sea-Green/Detail.bok

I need to call these people and see what this stuff is.

I was told its an organic sub for DC.

I do not believe that it would serve as a replacement for drip clean. It is bennies I believe. I have met the guy that made it.
It is in a liquid suspension. I still would use Cap's bennies myself.
As a matter of fact, it was the guy who made Sea Green who said something about drip clean coming from potassium hydroxide in a store where I saw him a little over a year ago.

My lack of a college education holds me back sometimes.

 

[Donkdbz]

You know, JK I think talked about how he would take his P from 60 to 90, and his K from 280 to 325 for 10 days around week 6. And he did well I recall.

I should do a 2-res room to see the results. I wonder also if the triacontanol in the moab causes the flowering period to take longer.

-thanks buddy, I was hoping that the form I put it in would make it click for people.

Theys is no triacontanol in Moab.

Tria is waxy and would float to the top. You would see it easily

 

[dankworth]

Do you have any guesses what the compound is in MOAB? There must be something I would think, otherwise it would be sold in OR.
I was so sure that it had to be triacontanol, after witnessing such a similar response with the alfalfa tea.
I will look into this further. Thanks Donkdbz. Any more input regarding this matter that you have would be great.

Edit- I see on the Cali fert database that their guaranteed analysis shows 62% p2o5, not the 52% claimed on the label. I wonder what the impact of that is. Besides having more p, of course.

Another edit- I see on the cali database that there is a 1-52-34 version of moab with no b1 that shows 1-52-34 values present.
And the other claimed 1-52-34 that has the .01% vitamin b1. That is the one that shows guaranteed analysis of 1-62-34.

I see a form of map that is 0-61.5-54. So there would have to be a 0-62-34 form of MKP to make this work out I think.
Anyone know anything about this?

 

[Quantrill]

MAP is monoammoniumphosphate so it has an N-P-K of somewhere close to 12-61-0, alittle variance do to purity can be expected.

MKP is 0-52-34 or a little variance due to purity.

Government run websites are prone to typos or flat out incorrect info.

I can't speak to the MOAB ingredients, but it would seem the 0-62-34 is wrong.

 

[Capulator]

MAP is monoammoniumphosphate so it has an N-P-K of somewhere close to 12-61-0, alittle variance do to purity can be expected.

MKP is 0-52-34 or a little variance due to purity.

Government run websites are prone to typos or flat out incorrect info.

I can't speak to the MOAB ingredients, but it would seem the 0-62-34 is wrong.

I would love for you to chime in more often here. Your knowledge is vast and I have learned quite a bit reading your posts on other threads. That is assuming this is the same Quantrill...

 

[Capulator]

Theys is no triacontanol in Moab.

Tria is waxy and would float to the top. You would see it easily

Calcium25 has tricontanol and there is nothing that floats to the surface when it is dissolved.

 

[dankworth]

MAP is monoammoniumphosphate so it has an N-P-K of somewhere close to 12-61-0, alittle variance do to purity can be expected.

MKP is 0-52-34 or a little variance due to purity.

Government run websites are prone to typos or flat out incorrect info.

I can't speak to the MOAB ingredients, but it would seem the 0-62-34 is wrong.

I had wondered if it was a typo at work. That would make more sense.
When I made alfalfa tea, and got the bigass triacontanol reaction, there had been no residue either, I would have taken notice.

As much as I have seen the 25 ppms of triacontanol mentioned in google searches, I am guessing that the max recommended dose of moab will give us 25 ppms of triacontanol. Just a guess.

Triacontanol promotes a certain type of bud structure, with the tufts or fingers that fill out. You guys know the look.

Now I wonder if I should just bump up my p and k slightly for 2 weeks with 25 ppm triacontanol, or reproduce the classic hammerhead/moab figures with the 25 ppms tria. Any opinions?

 

[El Cerebro]

Calcium25 has tricontanol and there is nothing that floats to the surface when it is dissolved.

No shit, do you know how much?

 

[Donkdbz]

This is mainly geared to big time growers or a few buddies going in on supplys to maximize funds in tough economic times

I recently went to a fertilizer manufaturing supply company and took along my trusty bottle of M**B which is a granular bloom booster. This is what they told me..........

I don't want to be sued so M**B will have to suffice I am sure some will guess and be so kind as to fill the other readers in

M**B consists of 3 ingredients which are listed on the package from largest proportion to least

1st is simply Mono-potassium phosphate which is known as MKP 0-52-34
it sells through fertilizer companies locally for 48.50 for 25kgs This 25kg bag is enough to make 27.53 1kg size containers of M**B

2nd is Mono-Ammonium Phosphate, which is known as MAP and is 11-52-34
This also sells through fertilizer companies locally for 110.00 for 25kgs
hopefully you can find it in a smaller quantity than I could as it is enough to make 275 1kg containers of M**B

lastly there is thiamine hydrochloride. online chemical lab supply places carry this. (Google is your friend)
I got this at 49.00 per 100 grams which is enough to make 100 1kg containers or M**B


for 1kg of M**B you use 905.19 grams of MKP
90.81 grams of MAP
1.0 grams of thiamine hydrochloride

this will give you 1-52-34 with a .01% thiamine hydrochloride


there ya go
he put wrong numbers on MAP though