Eledin said:

No, that would be ridiculous and unnecessary since its not inside a pot and rain or watering washes it away. I reuse my soil so I have to flush it nonetheless, but this time I flushed mostly after the harvest, I did give them epsom salts and flawless finish before going to plain water for the last week or week and a half. Thats also my point, when you flush the leaves start yellowing sooner, I would want to know about that specifically, if flushing to force it to use the nutes from the leaves at the right time actually does something. Madbud posted a study made in coco perlite with specific nutes (no ingredient list, just npk ratio in their website so a bit dissapointed) and it didnt seem to make a difference, but I grow in coco peat and the runoff water comes really dark at the end of the harvest.

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You know rain water contains nutrients, right? Rain isn’t flushing the earth.

Flushing is 100% pointless unless you have a deficiency or toxicity.

Goodshit97 said:

All i know is i dont flush. Im not one for a debate on it either lol
It’s gone on too long imo and just needs to be forgotten lol.

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Things that work for some people don’t work for all people. Like you, I just do what works for me. I use organic dry amendments and see no value in flushing. Someone using salts might have different experiences and opinions on that. But yea definitely a dead horse for debate.

elusiveshame said:

You know rain water contains nutrients, right? Rain isn’t flushing the earth.

Flushing is 100% pointless unless you have a deficiency or toxicity.

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Man... rain water and watering do push the nutes down, specially rain water if it rains for a prolongued period I thought that was common knowledge. Rainwater might contain nutrients but is not a fertilizer because the ammount of micro and macro nutrients is not enough to be considered a fertilizer, light fertilizer at most. Do you think putting nutrients during months inside a pot without flushing is the same as outdoor? We are not gonna agree at all, so we can leave it how it is, agree to disagree. But if you do a quick google search you might wanna rethink about that.

Eledin said:

Man... rain water and watering do push the nutes down, specially rain water if it rains for a prolongued period I thought that was common knowledge. Rainwater might contain nutrients but is not a fertilizer because the ammount of micro and macro nutrients is not enough to be considered a fertilizer, light fertilizer at most. Do you think putting nutrients during months inside a pot without flushing is the same as outdoor? We are not gonna agree at all, so we can leave it how it is, agree to disagree. But if you do a quick google search you might wanna rethink about that.

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Maybe you should also do some googling as rainwater has all of the nutrients we feed them. How else do you think plants survived millions of years without human intervention? By flushing the earth? No. By replenishing it with nutrients required for plant life.

elusiveshame said:

Are There Nutrients in Rainwater? - Bite Sized Gardening

Are There Nutrients in Rainwater? Rainwater Has Many Benefits Over Tap Water. Including Major Plant Nutrients & An Ideal pH.

www.bitesizedgardening.co.uk

Maybe you should also do some googling as rainwater has all of the nutrients we feed them. How else do you think plants survived millions of years without human intervention? By flushing the earth? No. By replenishing it with nutrients required for plant life.

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Yeah, when did I say it doesnt contain nutrients? I said it contains micro and macro nutrients but comparing it to organic bottled nutrients is ridiculous simply because the ppm of your solution in water is way higher than the ppm of rain water. You asked for this:
"Heavy rains naturally flush salts deeper into soil. While you should be flushing salts from potted houseplants every 4 to 8 weeks throughout the year to prevent salt burn, and most potted plants outdoors every 6 to 12 weeks during dry weather, rainstorms provide an opportunity to flush all of your potted plants with minimal effort."
Rain in sufficient quantities can leach or wash out excess salts from the soil. Salts come from fertilizers, saline irrigation water and low rainfall. Salt-laden soils make it difficult for plant roots to take up water and nutrients because it creates a high osmotic pressure.
Rainwater is naturally soft, meaning it is free of many salts, minerals, and chemicals that can build up in soil, stems and leaves over time. Not only is it gentler on our plants, but it can also help flush out excess salts and chemicals in the soil, bringing your plant back to a healthier state.

Do you want me to keep going or is that enough?

EDIT: Ill put another one so you understand where do plants really get most of their food. Add to those other delightful things rainwater and soil and decomposing microorganisms (the soil is alive full of microorganisms eating and pooping)
"In the wild, plants would suck up nutrients from the soil. Those nutrients get constantly refreshed with rotting plant matter, animal/insect droppings and other delightful things."
Why do you think they used to rotate crops in the soil? And why our current methods by using harmful chemical pesticides that kill the good soil microorganisms make the soil non fertile? Rainwater is not nearly enough.

elusiveshame said:

Are There Nutrients in Rainwater? - Bite Sized Gardening

Are There Nutrients in Rainwater? Rainwater Has Many Benefits Over Tap Water. Including Major Plant Nutrients & An Ideal pH.

www.bitesizedgardening.co.uk

Maybe you should also do some googling as rainwater has all of the nutrients we feed them. How else do you think plants survived millions of years without human intervention? By flushing the earth? No. By replenishing it with nutrients required for plant life.

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My rainwater is always under 5ppm. My plants can't live on that. In my outdoor garden it works great.

This is what our ancestors did in order to keep the soil fertile, they teached me this in school when I was a kid.

Also are we talking about trees in the middle of the forest or a plantation because those are 2 different things. In plantations you use fertilizers, wether it is organically in the soil with castings and compost or with liquid fertilizers like big crop fields in the food industry, they all use them because the soil is poisoned with pesticides and the natural food chain is broken, but with organic growing you gotta take care of your soil.

Eledin said:

EDIT: Ill put another one so you understand where do plants really get most of their food. Add to those other delightful things rainwater and soil and decomposing microorganisms (the soil is alive full of microorganisms eating and pooping)
"In the wild, plants would suck up nutrients from the soil. Those nutrients get constantly refreshed with rotting plant matter, animal/insect droppings and other delightful things."

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Obviously plants absorb nutrients through soil. I never said they didn’t

Rain water isn’t washing your actual ground to the point of “flushing it”. That was my point. For the exact reasons you listed. I didn’t think I had to mention that since, ya know, common knowledge. You still need water for that ecosystem to thrive. That water needs to feed those organisms.

If you’re outside in a pot (obviously you’re not going to have that ecosystem in there as you would directly in the earth), which isn’t what I was talking about.

growsince79 said:

My rainwater is always under 5ppm. My plants can't live on that. In my outdoor garden it works great.

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Haha I wasn’t saying you could have plants survive solely on rainwater in pots. Outdoors directly in the ground is what I’m referring to.

elusiveshame said:

Obviously plants absorb nutrients through soil. I never said they didn’t

Rain water isn’t washing your actual ground to the point of “flushing it”. That was my point. For the exact reasons you listed. I didn’t think I had to mention that since, ya know, common knowledge. You still need water for that ecosystem to thrive. That water needs to feed those organisms.

If you’re outside in a pot (obviously you’re not going to have that ecosystem in there as you would directly in the earth), which isn’t what I was talking about.


Haha I wasn’t saying you could have plants survive solely on rainwater in pots. Outdoors directly in the ground is what I’m referring to.

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Only the first example uses poted plants outside. You are backpedaling on some of your statements like plants in the wild surviving on rainwater because it has nutrients. Im gonna leave it like it is I think I made enough points to prove what Im saying. The links I posted can and are also applied to household gardens. Also you can have life in a potted soil thats why people add trichoderma and mycorrhizae and the bacillus bacteria in their organic grows, because they break down the organic material for the plant, they protect them from larvae munching on the roots, stress, better auto inmunity and keep the soil healthy overall for the plant. Some of them are already present in the composted material or the castings if theyre fairly fresh and stored with proper humidity. They can lay dormant too and be activated once you start watering.
EDIT: Have you ever had or worked in an outside garden? Because I have and all of this is common knowledge. It was a food garden, not a weed "garden", but since we are talking about plants in general Id like to know. The more rain the more salts that will go lower in the soil away from the roots. Its like watering with very low nutes until runoff (how much depends on how much it rains), never said it would leave the soil empty of anything, but if you fertilized the day before and it rains for an entire day you might wanna think about fertilizing again soon. Thats not so much of a problem with organics because the organic material wont move down as easily until it is decomposed by the microorganisms or worms at which point the plant takes it.