A Match Made In Heaven: Dwc And Leds

[PhatNuggz]

It was tough deciding where to put this thread for the most views. In the end I want more HID/HPS/MH growers who are having problems with root rot and other diseases caused by water temps being too warm. All of which are virtually non-existent under LEDs. Why?

Is it because LEDs are not as good at penetrating? To answer that, the first thing to learn is not all LEDs are created equal. In fact, far from it.

The reason why so many cling to HID lighting is because of the fact that, even today, many leds are being sold as the better lighting choice because the green spectrum is not needed. THIS IS PURE BS. Buyer beware!

Unfortunately, growers buy into this pseudo-science without considering that white light has been used successfully for growing cannabis for many decades. All HPS ever needed was a bit of deep blue and far red to make it a complete light, but those are best isolated from the HPS

Adding to the problem is the fact that Red and Blue only (Blurple) LEDs are super cheap compared to highly engineered (and more expensive) LEDs that are white, or primarily white based. Heliospectra's www provides a great explanation.

OK, now back to the subject at hand- The primary reason for transitioning to LEDs is heat, which is the primary cause of root (and therefor plant) problems for hydro growers.

The reason is simple, HID lights radiate heat, whereas LEDs do not.

More later

 

[3N1GM4]

Leds still radiate heat but at a much smaller signature, leds are match heads compared to hps being camp fires. Cob leds dissapate heat much better than 3 and 5 watt leds due to the heat radiating surface of the led chip being attached directly to its own individual heat sync.

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[3N1GM4]

 

[PhatNuggz]

While I agree leds radiate 'some' heat, the result is inconsequential to heating hydro water inside the tote/tub/ container.

This is not the thread for all this ancillary led information, which comes off as a covert attempt to advertise your LED light.

I asked the mods to remove your lengthy replies, which have nothing to do with heat

As I closed my post more later, but the 'more' was about heat and its' negative affect on plant roots in hydro.

 

[motherlode]

seems to me his lengthy replies fit in fine with the thread - just because it contradicts your post doesnt give a mod cause to remove it - sorry you are SOL

 

[3N1GM4]

I wasnt trying to advertise a light, my tablet copied and pasted that wrong. I have owned more than one led and they do put off a considerable amount of heat, but I still like them.

 

[PhatNuggz]

Well, in spite of the mods comment, please ask them to remove them as they have NOTHING to do with radiating heat

Thanks

 

[PhatNuggz]

seems to me his lengthy replies fit in fine with the thread - just because it contradicts your post doesnt give a mod cause to remove it - sorry you are SOL

Seems to me you didn't read the 3 posts. Only his initial written comment applies!

See his reply. The photos and 2 follow up posts were not intentional, and have NOTHING to do with heat

 

[ken dog]

Regarding the OP..
I'm pretty sure that green light is not needed... Regarding the OP... I'm also not sure that heat from your lights is one of the primary causes of root rot.

 

[3N1GM4]

Heat radiates, period. Led lights heat up but the heat on a cob is more isolated, small heat signature with high lumen output.

From my understanding, green light is reflected off of the plants and is not absorbed. That is why people have green light in their flower rooms, to keep from herming their plants because the plants dont use the green light?

 

[3N1GM4]

Re: Green Light OK during Dark Period?

by Mr Obvious » Tue Jan 26, 2010 8:04 pm

Ok Aj,
I have followed your posts since ya got here,I have for the most part formed my opinion of what you are about.I see most of what you like to do is sling around your vast knowlege of C&P..I'm not saying you might not have some kowlege of your own,after all you have been growing commercially now since you were 6 years old.I can only assume that you are over 18 now,and should have been able to retain much experience in that time.On the other hand,most of us here are more interested in application,than theory.What I mean is that if something works,,and works repetedly,then,guess what,,it works,no matter what your theory suggests.

I won't go into your disregard for the people here who have proven thier knowlege and expertise with thier long term grows and grow threads.Now then,sometimes book sense is a good thing,don't get me wrong here.More to the point,,application is the proof we all look at.I have yet to see you mention any completed MJ grows on your part,and the simple truth of the matter is this,Unless you have experience growing MJ,ya can't have any idea where the differences of growing vegatebles and fruits differ from growing MJ.

Now then as far as the Green Light is concerned.I did an experiment some 2 years ago,with a 13watt cfl green in color.I ran this light during my indoor grows during lights out period while in flower.It ran when the HID's went off..I might add that this experiment went on through 3 complete 12/12 cycles,with different strains..I can atest to the fact that there was,and is,NO ADVERSE effect on the plants what so ever.While I didn't read this info in any book or webpage,,I learned it from first hand experience.

Now then the moral of the story is that although new around here,I'm sure ya have lot's of knowlege that could be useful to many of our members,and I am in noway telling you that you don't..What I am saying though is that as a new member ya realy should try not to have such attitude as I have seen in most all of your posts.People around here are more interested in what you can bring to the table than how much you think you can.

I don't mean to put you in a bad light,I am simply trying to give you some well deserved advice on how to become a valued member,rather than a member that other see as a pain in the ass wind bag.Try to put your knowlege to use in a productive manner and hang around awhile !

So with that said,,have a great day,and enjoy your stay here at the Planet,and remember this,,we don't have any room for "Drama" around here anymore.Please treat members and mods with the respect that you would like to receive and in turn your stay here could be enjoyable for all !
This is from mjgrowing.eu

 

[PhatNuggz]

Heat radiates, period. Led lights heat up but the heat on a cob is more isolated, small heat signature with high lumen output.

From my understanding, green light is reflected off of the plants and is not absorbed. That is why people have green light in their flower rooms, to keep from herming their plants because the plants dont use the green light?

I apologize. Obviously, I have given too much credit regarding the knowledge of the readers here.

I'm not arguing that they don't radiate heat. My point.... IS... that they do not radiate enough heat directly AT the plants or hydro nutes to be problematic. Hope that clarifies it, cause frankly, I do not know how to make it any simplier for you

IME, > 80% of the LED heat exits up and away, via the heat sink. ALSO, today's' properly engineered LEDs provide ~ double the umoles of conventional HID bulbs at a low radiant temperature

Clearly, a match made in heaven for hydro growers

 

[Toaster79]

I apologize. Obviously, I have given too much credit regarding the knowledge of the readers here.

I'm not arguing that they don't radiate heat. My point.... IS... that they do not radiate enough heat directly AT the plants or hydro nutes to be problematic. Hope that clarifies it, cause frankly, I do not know how to make it any simplier for you

IME, > 80% of the LED heat exits up and away, via the heat sink. ALSO, today's' properly engineered LEDs provide ~ double the umoles of conventional HID bulbs at a low radiant temperature

Clearly, a match made in heaven for hydro growers

Well, unless those LEDs are packed in an enclosure with the tube attached to it and wented out of the grow space, they still put their heat off in the bloody room, don't they.

It's the fact that they don't put out IR part of spectrum for the emmited light to be absorbed by the plants or reservoirs like HPS do and MH don't.

Most efficient LEDs, being royal blue ones are at 50% at the moment in the lab. Real life aplications top out at 40-45% which means that a 1000W unit is still gonna serve you with 550-600W of heat.

Put a reflector or a collimating lens in front of your LED and I promise you your res will warm up and your plant will get burnt just like with a HPS, MH, CMH or any other bulb.

 

[ken dog]

Yes it will... It is an urban legend that leds don't produce much heat.

 

[Toaster79]

Yes it will... It is an urban legend that leds don't produce much heat.

Exactly.

 

[3N1GM4]

I apologize. Obviously, I have given too much credit regarding the knowledge of the readers here.

I'm not arguing that they don't radiate heat. My point.... IS... that they do not radiate enough heat directly AT the plants or hydro nutes to be problematic. Hope that clarifies it, cause frankly, I do not know how to make it any simplier for you

IME, > 80% of the LED heat exits up and away, via the heat sink. ALSO, today's' properly engineered LEDs provide ~ double the umoles of conventional HID bulbs at a low radiant temperature

Clearly, a match made in heaven for hydro growers

When you say I apologize it generally shouldnt be followed by an insult, you give the readers on here too little credit.

 

[PhatNuggz]

Re: Green Light OK during Dark Period?

by Mr Obvious » Tue Jan 26, 2010 8:04 pm

Ok Aj,
I have followed your posts since ya got here,I have for the most part formed my opinion of what you are about.I see most of what you like to do is sling around your vast knowlege of C&P..I'm not saying you might not have some kowlege of your own,after all you have been growing commercially now since you were 6 years old.I can only assume that you are over 18 now,and should have been able to retain much experience in that time.On the other hand,most of us here are more interested in application,than theory.What I mean is that if something works,,and works repetedly,then,guess what,,it works,no matter what your theory suggests.

I won't go into your disregard for the people here who have proven thier knowlege and expertise with thier long term grows and grow threads.Now then,sometimes book sense is a good thing,don't get me wrong here.More to the point,,application is the proof we all look at.I have yet to see you mention any completed MJ grows on your part,and the simple truth of the matter is this,Unless you have experience growing MJ,ya can't have any idea where the differences of growing vegatebles and fruits differ from growing MJ.

Now then as far as the Green Light is concerned.I did an experiment some 2 years ago,with a 13watt cfl green in color.I ran this light during my indoor grows during lights out period while in flower.It ran when the HID's went off..I might add that this experiment went on through 3 complete 12/12 cycles,with different strains..I can atest to the fact that there was,and is,NO ADVERSE effect on the plants what so ever.While I didn't read this info in any book or webpage,,I learned it from first hand experience.

Now then the moral of the story is that although new around here,I'm sure ya have lot's of knowlege that could be useful to many of our members,and I am in noway telling you that you don't..What I am saying though is that as a new member ya realy should try not to have such attitude as I have seen in most all of your posts.People around here are more interested in what you can bring to the table than how much you think you can.

I don't mean to put you in a bad light,I am simply trying to give you some well deserved advice on how to become a valued member,rather than a member that other see as a pain in the ass wind bag.Try to put your knowlege to use in a productive manner and hang around awhile !

So with that said,,have a great day,and enjoy your stay here at the Planet,and remember this,,we don't have any room for "Drama" around here anymore.Please treat members and mods with the respect that you would like to receive and in turn your stay here could be enjoyable for all !
This is from mjgrowing.eu

Your post clearly in the wrong thread. That's twice by you, which only furthers my point

 

[ken dog]

Your post clearly in the wrong thread, which only furthers my point

Actually, you brought it up in your opening post... The discussion about anything in the opening post, is on you.

 

[PhatNuggz]

Actually, you brought it up in your opening post... The discussion about anything in the opening post, is on you.

Shocked by your outside the box interpretation, I reread MY OP, and you know what, nowhere is there any mention of Re: Green Light OK during Dark Period?

It seems clear reading retention here is a testament to how poor the US education system is.

 

[We Solidarity]

@PhatNuggz I've cleaned this thread up fairly significantly- if you want to do a write up on led and temperature efficiency, in the HID forum, without debate, you can't leave it at "more later". Maybe write a word document and copy/paste it. This isn't a blog, it's a forum, where people can discuss and clarify for eachother with civility.