I'm no longer allowed to log on a check your logs @ the coffeeshop. They had to stop me from yelling "C'mon... quit it!" at the screen.

No, but really. C'mon. Quit it. 'scuse the language, but damn. Seriously have outdone yourself. I'll be bouncing over to your 2013, as I'll get tix to any show you're having! The tomatoes are jaw dropping. Such great work.

Hope you're better than well!:D
LG

I'm amazed at your skills..so much care and attention to detail. I'm lovin it!

leadsled said:

coco coir is a soiless medium, You can call it hydro, and it can be treated like hydro or like soil as well.

But stating you cannot combine soil and coco is not entirely correct in my experience as well as others. Did you try it before and fail? Do you base that information on personal experience?

I bet $$ if you added peat or even soil to coco coir would work just fine. Even with your jacks feeding schedule.

I have also tested side by side and seen otherwise. salts vs organics, coco coir vs peat, amended coco coir vs not etc.

Click to expand...

Great point Leadsled, I don't think there are usually problems when hydroponic and soil based medias are mixed uniformly and then accounted for in watering/fertilization practices. This is commonly done by greenhouse growers who are (behind the times) still growing in soil, and are looking to increase the water holding capacity, air holding capacity, or drainage of their starting soil. But most growers have realized that a consistent source of soil media is not easy to come by on a commercial scale and have converted their facilities to run with hydroponic medias such as coco, peat, pearlite, rockwool, etc.

Your first sentence is really the only part of your comment that I have to dispute. As you stated, coco coir is a soilless medium. . . . so if you consult the definition of a hydroponic media, you really cannot argue in any way that it is anything but a hydroponic media. Hydroponics: The process of growing plants in sand, gravel, or liquid, with added nutrients but without soil. Sure, you can argue that because coco coir has a higher CEC than any other hydroponic media (usually very low or non existant in hydro medias, but high in soil/organic matter) it can be treated more like a soil by accounting for nutrients in the media that won't be instantly leached. . . but that is far beyond what a majority of cannabis growers are thinking about, or need to worry about, and still doesn't change the fact that cocos ideal pH for nutrient availability is in the Hydro pH range, not soil. The other point that could be made about coco, which differentiates it from most hydroponic medias like rockwool or pearlite, is that it is technically organic. . . but from a practical management standpoint, we can still treat it as an inert media like any other hydroponic option.

My response to Patanjali was more referring to the problems that can arrise when you begin a plant in, for example, a 1 gallon pot of pure coco coir or a 6" rockwool cube and then read some really great grow log online that shows off some awesome organic soil grow and you just can't wait until your next grow to give soil a try, so you decide to transplant a pure coco coir root ball into a 5 gallon pot of Fox Farms Ocean Forest soil based mix. . . .the pH and drainage problems that arrise from that lack of uniformity in your media are the ones I was trying to address in my original post.

Thanks so much for taking the time to critically read my posts Leadsled! You are one of few on this site that actively posts extremely helpful, research and experience based knowledge for the community at large!

flowamasta said:

nMeeks.................... lost for words,... am i dreaming? id like to think i am, but then again....

You sir, are a magician when it comes to growing. I understand that if you have some sort of hidden secret in the nutrition side of things towards feeding plants. But Man oh man. WWOoooow. Not normal, i mean that in the most positive way!! just incredible is putting it blunt!! I have NEVER seen ANY bud look ANYTHING like that!!!! The leaves!!! their curl!! Their frost!! the resin!! WHAT THE!!!!!???? How can i change my style of growing to produce something even close to that!!! Magician i tell ya.... Or you really have ALIEN GENETICS from an ALIEN PLANET. Really man.... Go and take a hard look at your pics. Cause they are 'Pure Sex' I wouldn't trim them AT ALL!!!! harness all that flavour 'imo' far out man, can i please save some of them pics?

You have a true gift. A gift in such a magical giving nature at that! I too know how hard it can be sometimes to get a good shot. You aced it.

But them buuuuuuuuuds.... Man! Take a LOOK!!! not normal..... Not normal..... how can i sleep now?? what an awesome living legend.

Click to expand...

:D:eek::) Thanks for making my day FM! I got to read your comment this morning before class and couldn't wait to get home an read it again, haha!

I think you have as good a grasp on keeping your plants happy as I do, honestly! Now you just need to get your hands on some of the genetics that keep making you drool so much! If you think I know something you don't, check back through my logs and take a look if we do things differently. . . but my nutrition program is about as simple as it can get (ppm based with almost no individual nutrient rate adjustments) and my watering is probably more often than most people, but coco can hold enough air that it doesn't cause problems.

I really really appreciate your support, and strongly encourage you to get some OGR gear if the opportunity ever presents itself!

P.S. I totally had a plan to leave a cola untrimmed, aside from removing any of the largest fan leaves. . . .but I got into a groove trimming and the next thing I knew there were no more colas to trim. . . bummer I won't get any of the dry untrimmed pictures I was fantasizing about, but life goes on.

Goodsen Cranium said:

I'm no longer allowed to log on a check your logs @ the coffeeshop. They had to stop me from yelling "C'mon... quit it!" at the screen.

No, but really. C'mon. Quit it. 'scuse the language, but damn. Seriously have outdone yourself. I'll be bouncing over to your 2013, as I'll get tix to any show you're having! The tomatoes are jaw dropping. Such great work.

Hope you're better than well!:D
LG

Click to expand...

Hahaha, nice Goods, that's a lesson I learned about my schools library also! Thanks so much for the kind words! I am usually a harsh critic of myself, so that seems to lead to me trying to top myself every grow (and grow log), intentionally or not. You will like the new log, it has a very tranquil vibe right now since it has mostly just been seedling pictures. The tomatoes are really fun to work with on the scale we have (I can imagine a hundred acres like the big commercial boys have wouldn't be as much fun and games), and now that I have my schedule settled a bit I am finding the time to keep things on track in there the way it should be! Have a great rest of your week LG!

SpittN4Cash said:

I'm amazed at your skills..so much care and attention to detail. I'm lovin it!

Click to expand...

I'm happy to amaze! Thanks for taking the time to check out my thread Cash, make sure you keep an eye out for updates in my new thread also, since this one is wrapping up shortly!

Wow bro The White leaning Alien looks unreal! I'm always impressed when I come check out your grows. I was checking out a few pages back that you extract your bho straight onto the parchment paper, is that correct? If so, do you transfer it to a different sheet after each step? Thanks bro

MrStonerMan said:

Wow bro The White leaning Alien looks unreal! I'm always impressed when I come check out your grows. I was checking out a few pages back that you extract your bho straight onto the parchment paper, is that correct? If so, do you transfer it to a different sheet after each step? Thanks bro

Click to expand...

Hey MrSM, the White leaner was probably the frostiest plant to ever grow in my garden! It has competition with a White leaning White Urkle I had, but this plant had so many trichomes it looked like soft fuzzy velvet when I was trimming it! For my BHO, I did blast straight onto parchment this time (although I will be doing a side by side comparison next time to see if there were any differences) and didn't notice any negatives in the final result, but the positives of not having to scrap were well worth the extra step to begin with IMO. I would recommend changing parchment after you finish with your hot water baths, because the edges of the parchment may get a few drops of water on them, which you wouldn't want to get into your oil. After that, I used the same piece of parchment throughout the vacuum purging process, although I did have to stop purging and consolidate the mass of oil about half way through the process, just to get residue off the sides and create a more even thickness for heating/vacuuming. Good luck, and remember to always be safe and never blast in an enclosed space or near any possible source of spark!

This post is WAY over due! I know a bunch of you guys asked me to describe the different flavors/smells I was getting after harvesting the Alien Grenades and Lemon Alien Dawg ladies a few months ago. . . and I told you to be patient and wait for the formal smoke report. . . . well I was a little too patient with my strain reviewer and he spaced out and forgot to send me his notes until this morning when I reminded him! My bad everyone, I know you have already forgotten about those old strains by now anyways, haha!

I will refresh everyone's memory with a couple pictures for each genotype to go along with the review. Keep in mind that this review was written by a friend of mine who is a professional vintner (wine maker) and has a very sensitive pallet for organoleptic properties! His wording has not be changed at all from what he sent me. I also think it is important to note that the samples I gave him were cured in large jars by me for only 1 week before they were in his hands, and he told me they were stored in smaller nug sized jars for another 3-4 weeks before he wrote the reviews. In the future I will be completely curing the nugs myself before handing them over, like I have done in past grows last year.





LAD #1:

LAD #1:
nose: lime, anise, clove, lavender

dry hit: lime, straw, fresh cut grass.

smoke: white pepper, lime, cedar, smooth









LAD # 2:

LAD # 2:
nose: myer lemon, pine, fresh lumber

dry hit: Pine, citrus, cedar, forest

smoke: Full bodied, strong pine, quality taste.








LAD #4:

LAD #4:
nose: pine, straw, lemon peel, moss

Dry Hit: cedar, straw, dried herbs

smoke: mellow flavor, subtle hints of white pepper light citrus.








LAD #5:

LAD #5:
nose: Lemon Peel. Cut Cedar, White Pepper

Dry hit: Myer Lemon, Mild cigar, Fresh sage

Smoke: Spicy upfront flavor, muted tobacco. Not my favorite








AGR #3:

AGR #3:
nose: pinsol, lumber, tar, lavender

dry hit: pine, lime, floral

smoke: Fresh herbs, straw, cedar. A bit sharp










AGR #4:

AGR #4:
nose: lime, lavender, moss

dry hit: pepper, dried herb, mild citrus, not my fav

Smoke: Piney in the beginning then falls short. Harsh smoke.








Thanks to everyone who has stuck with the thread since these plants were growing! I hope that you all enjoy the smoke reports, and don't miss the update coming later tonight that will include pre-harvest pictures of the remaining WiFi Alien and AGVs that are getting trimmed this weekend!



-Meeks:D

Good Evening Farmers! It's later than I expected to get these photos sorted and uploaded, but here are the pictures I liked from earlier this afternoon before harvest! The Alien Grapevine shown extensively is a great yielder and smells INCREDIBLE! Very strong berry flavor was overwhelming during trimming! The photos don't show it very well, but the purple coloring is also great on this genotype! I think this plant is definitely the keeper out of the 4 Grapevines I had going!


White Fire Alien - OGRaskal Seeds
(Fire Leaner)















Alien Grapevine - Alien Genetics
(Keeper Berry Genotype)
















Thanks as always for viewing/reading my log! Have a great weekend everyone!

-Meeks:cool:

Beautifu Meeks, another grow for the books!

What's makes the grapevine's leafs curl so much?

GR33NL3AF said:

Beautifu Meeks, another grow for the books!

What's makes the grapevine's leafs curl so much?

Click to expand...

Great question GL, I was hoping someone would ask that because there is a vocab word I have been trying to learn for the curling for a couple years now, and it finally got mentioned in one of my classes with the scientific term I was looking for!

Early on in flowering I was still using the Jacks 3-2-1 ratio, which in my system resulted in a nutrient lockout this grow for some reason, most likely the high K amounts combined with the entirely Nitrate source of nitrogen lead to a high media pH and slight salt toxicity at the same time . . . Unfortunately, I was home for vacation at the proper timing to have corrected this before symptoms began to show more severely. . .

When I returned, the problem was becoming apparent and I spent a week or so working to correct it with flushes and a new nutrient regime. During that time, I also chose to try something I hadn't tried before (stupid idea) which was to vent out the air from my grow room and bring in some new fresh air from outside during the lights on period. . . .

You might be saying, 'doesn't everyone do that?' . . . but no, I run a sealed environment, so usually there is no air exchange between my grow room and the outside environment (except for my separately sealed air cooled hoods). For this reason, I wasn't used to thinking about the fact that it was barely 50 degrees outside when I was bringing air in, and my plants were used to 77 degree days and 66 degree nights. . . .

Here's where what I recently learned comes into play.

Plants respond massively to Day and Night temperatures. . . duh. . . but what I only loosely understood until now is that there is a concept called DIF that is very important for growers to control! DIF refers to the difference between the day and night temperature, and that means there can be both a +DIF (day time temp was higher than night time temp) and also a -DIF (night time temp was higher than day time temp).

The effects of a +DIF is going to be taller plants and much better carbohydrate (energy) storage, versus the effects of a -DIF are going to be shorter plants and less energy storage. These are factors that some growers would like to control, and therefore will manipulate their DIF to suit the crop growing needs. . .

But I didn't really understand that yet, and I also didn't know the big consequence that I was risking by doing it semi-unintentionally!

The combination of the minor salt/pH stress on the plants, combined with a single day of -DIF (my nights were 66 and I was bringing in 50 degree air during one morning) resulted in severe leaf Epinasty on the two plants directly in the air flow from the outside vent!

Epinasty is the term I have been hunting for for a while now, and is heavily linked with DIF! I have seen many many growers ask what it was technically called when they see their leaves get the claw look to them. . . well here it is!

Epinasty is the result of part of the leaf growing faster than another, usually the top side growing faster than the bottom, resulting in an unsightly downward leaf curl!

Two of my Alien Grapevine plants got epinasty on practically every leaf they had at the time and the result of that over the next month+ was that as the leaves recovered, they tended to reverse their curl and ended up looking like they had clawed upwards by the end of the grow.




. . . .long enough answer for you? haha!

-Meeks

That's insane - I eagerly await responses like this. So detailed and answered precisely. Thanks Meeks!

Sexy ladies! im looking forward to seeing mine done.. LAD is a huge bitch! Might want to take it easy looks like your gonna burn that room down!

GR33NL3AF said:

That's insane - I eagerly await responses like this. So detailed and answered precisely. Thanks Meeks!

Click to expand...

Always happy to help!

bonkia said:

Sexy ladies! im looking forward to seeing mine done.. LAD is a huge bitch! Might want to take it easy looks like your gonna burn that room down!

Click to expand...

There are definitely some big ladies to be found in the LAD packs! Only my White Urkle has equaled their size. My room was made to handle all this fire, no way I'm gonna take it easy this year ;)










Hey Farmers, I have a little pre-game entertainment for you. A couple photos I managed to snap during trimming yesterday. All the WiFi Alien (fire leaning) branches came out with top shelf buds from 12-20" long! Here's a bunch hanging on a line after getting manicured:









This genotype will be run on a 10 week schedule when grown in the future, but I couldn't run the power for just one plant to go longer this round, which is why you can tell it looks a bit premature.








-Meeks:D

In my opinion That leaf curl is probably contributed by the mass of resin production!!! A scientific explanation most probably, I think pulling the freezing air in has resulted in even more potency by slightly stressing the plant carefully so she could ripen more magically :) subconsciously maybe the ganja gods allowed you to let this happen ;) Honestly man i haven't seen resin like that on the edge of FAN LEAVES!!!! To get that, the resin has got to be OVER-FLOWING and have nowhere to grow!! to end up on the leaves and stems!!?? The plant in my opinion had little toxicity or if it did, you have uncovered a resin production secret. I can't see a 3-2-1 ratio locking out any essential nutes... just my thoughts ;) You have such a splendid harvest in your srms, you must be overwhelmed with the most amazing aromas and energies. I REEEEEALY get into the aromas, like they lift your spirits and help ingest all of the spices

I try to shock my plants at close to harvest time by throwing bags of ice in the res during night times, i swear her vigor increases and her trichomes gleam with shininess!! I believe that climate plays more of a role with potency than any nutrient regime can :)

Awesome work nMeeks!! outstanding!!! I close my eyes and dreeeeeam of such magical variety!! My Lady calls you a 'Ganja God' :) and not many shock her when it comes to growing the erb.

flowamasta said:

In my opinion That leaf curl is probably contributed by the mass of resin production!!! A scientific explanation most probably, I think pulling the freezing air in has resulted in even more potency by slightly stressing the plant carefully so she could ripen more magically :) subconsciously maybe the ganja gods allowed you to let this happen ;) Honestly man i haven't seen resin like that on the edge of FAN LEAVES!!!! To get that, the resin has got to be OVER-FLOWING and have nowhere to grow!! to end up on the leaves and stems!!?? The plant in my opinion had little toxicity or if it did, you have uncovered a resin production secret. I can't see a 3-2-1 ratio locking out any essential nutes... just my thoughts ;) You have such a splendid harvest in your srms, you must be overwhelmed with the most amazing aromas and energies. I REEEEEALY get into the aromas, like they lift your spirits and help ingest all of the spices

I try to shock my plants at close to harvest time by throwing bags of ice in the res during night times, i swear her vigor increases and her trichomes gleam with shininess!! I believe that climate plays more of a role with potency than any nutrient regime can :)

Awesome work nMeeks!! outstanding!!! I close my eyes and dreeeeeam of such magical variety!! My Lady calls you a 'Ganja God' :) and not many shock her when it comes to growing the erb.

Click to expand...

You would love the smells coming off one of my Alien Grapevine FM! Seriously, I could see myself living in a jar of this bud for a while! I can't wait until it is fully dried and cured so I can get the true taste from it! Right now it is all candy grape and other fruity berry aromas that make me wonder if an FPOG seed ended up in the grapevine pack!

I think the fan leaves being covered in trichomes is, at least in part, the genetics. I am happy to take credit for keeping the plants alive and happy enough to really show off those genetics. . . but I can't bring anything out of the plant that isn't already there to start with!

I know you have your own fert. recipe, but just incase other people are reading these posts, I wanted to clear up that the Jack's 3-2-1 ratio is not an N-P-K ratio of 3-2-1, but rather a ratio of 3g Jacks, for every 2g Calcium-Nitrate, for every 1g Epsom salt, which makes a very different N-P-K ratio.

Tell your lady that I appreciate her high praise, and of course, thank you for posting such kind words as always FM!


-Meeks

nMEEKS said:

Hey MrSM, the White leaner was probably the frostiest plant to ever grow in my garden! It has competition with a White leaning White Urkle I had, but this plant had so many trichomes it looked like soft fuzzy velvet when I was trimming it! For my BHO, I did blast straight onto parchment this time (although I will be doing a side by side comparison next time to see if there were any differences) and didn't notice any negatives in the final result, but the positives of not having to scrap were well worth the extra step to begin with IMO. I would recommend changing parchment after you finish with your hot water baths, because the edges of the parchment may get a few drops of water on them, which you wouldn't want to get into your oil. After that, I used the same piece of parchment throughout the vacuum purging process, although I did have to stop purging and consolidate the mass of oil about half way through the process, just to get residue off the sides and create a more even thickness for heating/vacuuming. Good luck, and remember to always be safe and never blast in an enclosed space or near any possible source of spark!

Click to expand...

Thanks for always answering my questions bro! Truly appreciate the information. I have a few more questions to fill in some gaps in the process. If you don't mind, can I private message you to ask you? Or if you don't mind I'll ask on here.

MrStonerMan said:

Thanks for always answering my questions bro! Truly appreciate the information. I have a few more questions to fill in some gaps in the process. If you don't mind, can I private message you to ask you? Or if you don't mind I'll ask on here.

Click to expand...

No problem MrSM, if the other questions are still on the subject of making BHO, let's do that via private message.

nMEEKS said:

You would love the smells coming off one of my Alien Grapevine FM! Seriously, I could see myself living in a jar of this bud for a while! I can't wait until it is fully dried and cured so I can get the true taste from it! Right now it is all candy grape and other fruity berry aromas that make me wonder if an FPOG seed ended up in the grapevine pack!

I think the fan leaves being covered in trichomes is, at least in part, the genetics. I am happy to take credit for keeping the plants alive and happy enough to really show off those genetics. . . but I can't bring anything out of the plant that isn't already there to start with!

I know you have your own fert. recipe, but just incase other people are reading these posts, I wanted to clear up that the Jack's 3-2-1 ratio is not an N-P-K ratio of 3-2-1, but rather a ratio of 3g Jacks, for every 2g Calcium-Nitrate, for every 1g Epsom salt, which makes a very different N-P-K ratio.

Tell your lady that I appreciate her high praise, and of course, thank you for posting such kind words as always FM!


-Meeks

Click to expand...

Thanx for clearing that up, i'm sure you did earlier :)

anything berry smell is delicious in my mind!! i love raspberries and blueberries so the mind races!!!

Damn i need to get some pure genetics!!! The amsterdam gold i started is growing ever so slow! nothing compared to Jack. Not even fair to compare.... you have upped my confidence, and will be looking into some seed banks, maybe someone on here has some insight as to the safest company to ship to Australia?? it does leave less to the imagination when growing the same strain a few times, but i guess it does help to understand their characteristics, so in a way i have learnt more about climate conditioning than anything about crazy genetics, but this is a must to look into definitely! I need a Heat tolerant medium yielding eye popping nMeeks style candy frosted Alien Fairy bush!!! I know there must be alot of 'rubbish' out there i'm sure..... I would be after pure femonized so i can clone right? if i'm going for yield in my 3 months time given i mean... If i was to grow from seed i would need to have a nice head-start atleast 2-3 weeks right? Is cloning a pure Genetic strain changing the outcome at all in your opinion? It seems seed grown plants have a slightly different structure and larger fan leaves... am i far off??

sorry for the questions!, researching is one thing, but i love to hear ones opinion and experiences.

My Other half thanx you for your reply, and for the both of us wishes we lived in a more relaxed state with open marijuana laws or atleast given some kind of leeway. There is now even Marijuana saliva testes that the police routinely do now! same repercussions as drink driving!!! Line the police up and test them i say...

sorry bit of a rant, highly baked on the most amazing brownies!! followed by still a burning hint of chili on my lips from the corn chip covered snack i just had.... 3 jars didn't last very long

flowamasta said:

Thanx for clearing that up, i'm sure you did earlier :)

anything berry smell is delicious in my mind!! i love raspberries and blueberries so the mind races!!!

Damn i need to get some pure genetics!!! The amsterdam gold i started is growing ever so slow! nothing compared to Jack. Not even fair to compare.... you have upped my confidence, and will be looking into some seed banks, maybe someone on here has some insight as to the safest company to ship to Australia?? it does leave less to the imagination when growing the same strain a few times, but i guess it does help to understand their characteristics, so in a way i have learnt more about climate conditioning than anything about crazy genetics, but this is a must to look into definitely! I need a Heat tolerant medium yielding eye popping nMeeks style candy frosted Alien Fairy bush!!! I know there must be alot of 'rubbish' out there i'm sure..... I would be after pure femonized so i can clone right? if i'm going for yield in my 3 months time given i mean... If i was to grow from seed i would need to have a nice head-start atleast 2-3 weeks right? Is cloning a pure Genetic strain changing the outcome at all in your opinion? It seems seed grown plants have a slightly different structure and larger fan leaves... am i far off??

sorry for the questions!, researching is one thing, but i love to hear ones opinion and experiences.

My Other half thanx you for your reply, and for the both of us wishes we lived in a more relaxed state with open marijuana laws or atleast given some kind of leeway. There is now even Marijuana saliva testes that the police routinely do now! same repercussions as drink driving!!! Line the police up and test them i say...

sorry bit of a rant, highly baked on the most amazing brownies!! followed by still a burning hint of chili on my lips from the corn chip covered snack i just had.... 3 jars didn't last very long

Click to expand...

Hey FlowaMasta, sorry for the delayed reply, exams are keeping me busy. Have you looked into ordering seeds from here on The Farm? I have ordered from Logic on a couple occasions and had very speedy service (2 weeks from when I sent cash to when I received beans)! I don't know how international he is with shipping, but might be worth finding out.

I am sure working with the same strain multiple times in a row has really helped you get a grasp on the environmental effects on a plants growth! I was lucky enough to do the same for my first few grows and it helped me understand the importance of quality equipment for solid environment control!

I don't think you necessarily need feminized seeds, but if you want to stick to your single plant grows, it would definitely make it easy to pop just 1 bean and know you are getting a female. You certainly don't need feminized seeds to be able to clone, a cutting can be taken off any plant (male or female from feminized or regular beans).

Seeds will take a little bit longer to get going than you are used to from starting with a rooted clone. Check out my other grow thread for photos that correspond to a normal schedule for seedlings. I think you are right on with the 2-3 week estimate of what it takes to get a seed up to the growth rate and size of a rooted clone.

I don't really know what you are taking about when you say a "pure genetic strain" . . . but no there is going to be no change to the genetics when you take cuttings from a seed grown plant for clones. . . hence the name 'clone'. What you may notice is that most clones do not have the opposite leaf growth that seedlings have, but instead they have alternate leaves. This is because when a cannabis plant switches from vegetative growth to floral growth it switches from opposite leaf arrangement to alternate. Most clones have at some point been accidentally triggered by photo period, stress, or just maturity to switch from vegetative growth structure to floral growth structure. . . and once they make the switch, they rarely switch back, even when they continue to grow vegetatively afterwards.

I hope all this helps clear some things up for you. I encourage you and any grower to give seed growing a try at least once. . . it is hard to understand where/how the plant is starting its life without witnessing it first hand!

-Meeks

nMEEKS said:

Hey FlowaMasta, sorry for the delayed reply, exams are keeping me busy. Have you looked into ordering seeds from here on The Farm? I have ordered from Logic on a couple occasions and had very speedy service (2 weeks from when I sent cash to when I received beans)! I don't know how international he is with shipping, but might be worth finding out.

I am sure working with the same strain multiple times in a row has really helped you get a grasp on the environmental effects on a plants growth! I was lucky enough to do the same for my first few grows and it helped me understand the importance of quality equipment for solid environment control!

I don't think you necessarily need feminized seeds, but if you want to stick to your single plant grows, it would definitely make it easy to pop just 1 bean and know you are getting a female. You certainly don't need feminized seeds to be able to clone, a cutting can be taken off any plant (male or female from feminized or regular beans).

Seeds will take a little bit longer to get going than you are used to from starting with a rooted clone. Check out my other grow thread for photos that correspond to a normal schedule for seedlings. I think you are right on with the 2-3 week estimate of what it takes to get a seed up to the growth rate and size of a rooted clone.

I don't really know what you are taking about when you say a "pure genetic strain" . . . but no there is going to be no change to the genetics when you take cuttings from a seed grown plant for clones. . . hence the name 'clone'. What you may notice is that most clones do not have the opposite leaf growth that seedlings have, but instead they have alternate leaves. This is because when a cannabis plant switches from vegetative growth to floral growth it switches from opposite leaf arrangement to alternate. Most clones have at some point been accidentally triggered by photo period, stress, or just maturity to switch from vegetative growth structure to floral growth structure. . . and once they make the switch, they rarely switch back, even when they continue to grow vegetatively afterwards.

I hope all this helps clear some things up for you. I encourage you and any grower to give seed growing a try at least once. . . it is hard to understand where/how the plant is starting its life without witnessing it first hand!

-Meeks

Click to expand...

WOW!!! Thanx again Meeks :) another awesome detailed response!!
1 more question... ;) will a seed grown plant show any sex before a photo-period change? or you must have to change to a flower cycle...? If i was to use regular seeds i would have to make sure i'm growing a female or i imagine i could waste alot more time again flipping to see sex, and then flip back again.... unless i can get a seed grown plant to show sex at an early stage by flipping lights... I'd cry if i grew a monster size plant for 4-7 weeks veg and then flip to see a mass of balls on an indoor tree!! that wouldn't be the easiest thing to 'dispose' of not to mention electricity and time wasted/needed.
I have seen that when a plant gets so big the leaf arrangement does change into that floral arrangement and creating longer stretched out arms on big plants... very interesting.

Thanx Meeks, legendary response!!

Plants usually show sex around the fourth to sixth internode and you can tell without flipping the lights - but still need to put in a good 4 weeks or so to even get an idea and sometimes you are wrong and don't find out until flipping for a week to ten days. You will need a 30x magnify lens or jewelers loupe with a light 30-60x ... So imho your style and situation is best to use fem seeds/clones until you have the freedom and the space to try reg beans , I have neither but that does not stop me. Now lets see if I have learned anything from Meeks in these few months when he responds .....good questions as the alternating leaves sights I noticed from seed to clone but never knew why to know ........peace soser