Aquaman gets dirty

[Aqua Man]

I get sturdier plant growing 6 weeks under t-5 ho flourescents in veg than i did in 4 weeks to the same size with a 315 cmh.

I have not thought for a minute that speeding up the growth of the plants would be beneficial in any way except faster turnaround.

I feel the same about the bloom nutes excessive phosphorous “signaling” the plant to bloom faster.

I get noticably better quality in potency and flavor and smell not “signalling them and they tend to flower a couple extra weeks if i dont boost the P.

I plan to email dave the owner of dyna grow to dispute his comment that it increased quality so they recommend bloom nutes even though their tissue samples and tests say the plant doesnt use the high P.


I got pro mix to give an honest answer about the starter fertilizer that is not labeled on american bales so maybe dyna grow will come clean.

Would love to hear what he says bro. I'm kinda sold on the crop steering so being the stubborn ass I am I have to give it a fair shake with a few grows. But I'm always open to new info and findings.

 

[Aqua Man]

He is usually too busy watching a tub of bubbly water. ;-)

Lol yes and the plants actually grow too. oof low blow lol

 

[BurnzYzBudZz]

Looks like those nice compact healthy sturdy soil plants could take it.

Dont know about those stringy unsupported weak stem hydro plants though. ;-)

Hahaha

 

[Pondracer]

Chuggin along not much to see bud sites progressing.

Very pretty color. Nice and even. I like this period too. The way the genetics produce different shapes and colors is one of the more interesting things about the plant.

 

[Dr.Green55]

I get sturdier plant growing 6 weeks under t-5 ho flourescents in veg than i did in 4 weeks to the same size with a 315 cmh.

I have not thought for a minute that speeding up the growth of the plants would be beneficial in any way except faster turnaround.

I feel the same about the bloom nutes excessive phosphorous “signaling” the plant to bloom faster.

I get noticably better quality in potency and flavor and smell not “signalling them and they tend to flower a couple extra weeks if i dont boost the P.

I plan to email dave the owner of dyna grow to dispute his comment that it increased quality so they recommend bloom nutes even though their tissue samples and tests say the plant doesnt use the high P.


I got pro mix to give an honest answer about the starter fertilizer that is not labeled on american bales so maybe dyna grow will come clean.

I agree with what your saying looking at it from a nutrient point by adding P. like I said before I think its in combination with a few other things

First off cannabis plants are light hogs, and everything starts with light. They'll take all light you can give them IF everything else is in balance with the light given , and the exact same is true for lower light intensity grows, their is a balance of 9 different things that, that balance is all determined by the light

From my point of view what I gathered over the last 25+ years , what i was taught by others and even through lab testing , I think most of your points are by products of light intensity and balance

speed is a by product of the growing environment, the higher light = more nutes, water oxygen co2 etc etc. And in turn I believe due to the high light intensity, faster more vigorous growing plants will product bigger , more resinous , and more completed flavor's, aromas oil's etc.

Here is where I think the P thing gets tricky , I don't believe this whole P thing is a stand alone trick so to say , In my testing with lab tests, extra p alone in low intensity grows is kinds useless, combined with temp / light there maybe some benefit in triggering pre-flower.

However in high intensity grows tests have shown that their is minimal deference in P uptake etc. I'm talking like 30ppm max difference in my solution, then when I trigger my environmental changes, its clear that there is a difference. Like I said before the faster my plant switches, the faster I get buds growing, the farther ahead I am come weeks 456 in flower, which in my opinion produce's a much better product. my plants don't get done any earlier.

I'd like to see what Dave says to I don't think P alone is a driving factor

 

[Dirtbag]

Looks like those nice compact healthy sturdy soil plants could take it.

Dont know about those stringy unsupported weak stem hydro plants though. ;-)

Lol whatever man, it's kind of a bummer because I feel like you are directing a lot of shit at me lately and basing your comments about hydro vs soil and fast growth rates out of thin air because you havent actually grown in hydro, or coco. I was a long time soil/promix grower for a couple decades before switching, and my hydro/coco crops have blown the soil/promix crops out of the water in terms of flavour, effect, and yield. Its not even a fair comparison. My latest crop specifically is already the best tasting and yielding crop I've ever grown, without question. And I'm positive my hydro crop would have been too if I didnt have to flip early because of my to my trip to Mexico.

And the P and crop steering things again, I dont feel like you've played with them enough to be saying they work or they dont. And honestly neither do I, but initial results are freakish.

 

[MIMedGrower]

I agree with what your saying looking at it from a nutrient point by adding P. like I said before I think its in combination with a few other things

First off cannabis plants are light hogs, and everything starts with light. They'll take all light you can give them IF everything else is in balance with the light given , and the exact same is true for lower light intensity grows, their is a balance of 9 different things that, that balance is all determined by the light

From my point of view what I gathered over the last 25+ years , what i was taught by others and even through lab testing , I think most of your points are by products of light intensity and balance

speed is a by product of the growing environment, the higher light = more nutes, water oxygen co2 etc etc. And in turn I believe due to the high light intensity, faster more vigorous growing plants will product bigger , more resinous , and more completed flavor's, aromas oil's etc.

Here is where I think the P thing gets tricky , I don't believe this whole P thing is a stand alone trick so to say , In my testing with lab tests, extra p alone in low intensity grows is kinds useless, combined with temp / light there maybe some benefit in triggering pre-flower.

However in high intensity grows tests have shown that their is minimal deference in P uptake etc. I'm talking like 30ppm max difference in my solution, then when I trigger my environmental changes, its clear that there is a difference. Like I said before the faster my plant switches, the faster I get buds growing, the farther ahead I am come weeks 456 in flower, which in my opinion produce's a much better product. my plants don't get done any earlier.

I'd like to see what Dave says to I don't think P alone is a driving factor

Here is the original response i posted in my thread recently in case you didnt see.





When growing outdoors, bloom is not necessary. The gradual shortening of day length forces flowering. When growing indoors under lights where photo period is reduced to force flowering, bloom (high phosphorus) chemically reinforces the message of shorter days to accelerate the switch from vegetative growth to reproductive growth (flowering). Technically, it is not essential nutritionally but serves as a chemical messenger.

Dave Neal, CEO
Dyna-Gro Nutrition Solutions
2775 Giant Rd
Richmond, CA 94806
p: 800.396.2476
f: 510.233.0198
[email protected]
www.dyna-gro.com



I am saying that in my test grows with multiple runs of known cuts i used to keep for testing that the flowers fertilized with the kind trio bloom and base in 12/12 finished up to 2 weeks earlier but with less yield and less full head and body potency, flavor and smell (perceived by is and multiple patients) than the same plant grown with the grow and base bottles. Which finished up to 2 weeks later and with 15% average more yield.

We repeated this test and then did it with the pure blend pro grow and bloom soil.


I feel that this shows what dyna grow is saying and the higher phosphorous sparked earlier and faster bloom. But that this is only good for profit and not quality. If i felt the quality was higher i would choose that over yield.


And for lighting i use 2 600hps in deep direct down lighting reflectors in a 3.5’x7’ space. Medium high light by modern standards. No co2

 

[MIMedGrower]

Lol whatever man, it's kind of a bummer because I feel like you are directing a lot of shit at me lately and basing your comments about hydro vs soil and fast growth rates out of thin air because you havent actually grown in hydro, or coco. I was a long time soil/promix grower for a couple decades before switching, and my hydro/coco crops have blown the soil/promix crops out of the water in terms of flavour, effect, and yield. Its not even a fair comparison. My latest crop specifically is already the best tasting and yielding crop I've ever grown, without question. And I'm positive my hydro crop would have been too if I didnt have to flip early because of my to my trip to Mexico.

And the P and crop steering things again, I dont feel like you've played with them enough to be saying they work or they dont. And honestly neither do I, but initial results are freakish.

Dude i was just joking. And i have never said i have determined anything about coco or hydro except it was recomended to me from a long experienced breeder not to mix in more than 30% or it will affect flavor. His words not mine.


I have nothing but respect for your experience and results. I call to you personally for advice. I never meant to offend and am very sorry if i have.

Im a jersey boy. We take shots at those we love. Or at least we ended up doing that in defense of others doing it to us. I believe in canada or at least on sit coms it is called chirping. :-)


As far as using P to steer crops. I didnt know thats what i was doing at the time. I ran an average of 3 clones each for 3 runs each when i tested using bloom nutes or only grow nutes. Cause i tried 50/50 too.

Grow nutes always took longer but everyone noticed the quality difference even in blind testing.

The forums and guides said to avoid nitrogen in flower but that is exactly what i needed more of.



Thats my experience. I did it with hps vs mh and cmh and combos too. And of course flushing and not flushing. Lol.

 

[Dr.Green55]

Here is the original response i posted in my thread recently in case you didnt see.





When growing outdoors, bloom is not necessary. The gradual shortening of day length forces flowering. When growing indoors under lights where photo period is reduced to force flowering, bloom (high phosphorus) chemically reinforces the message of shorter days to accelerate the switch from vegetative growth to reproductive growth (flowering). Technically, it is not essential nutritionally but serves as a chemical messenger.

Dave Neal, CEO
Dyna-Gro Nutrition Solutions
2775 Giant Rd
Richmond, CA 94806
p: 800.396.2476
f: 510.233.0198
[email protected]
www.dyna-gro.com



I am saying that in my test grows with multiple runs of known cuts i used to keep for testing that the flowers fertilized with the kind trio bloom and base in 12/12 finished up to 2 weeks earlier but with less yield and less full head and body potency, flavor and smell (perceived by is and multiple patients) than the same plant grown with the grow and base bottles. Which finished up to 2 weeks later and with 15% average more yield.

We repeated this test and then did it with the pure blend pro grow and bloom soil.


I feel that this shows what dyna grow is saying and the higher phosphorous sparked earlier and faster bloom. But that this is only good for profit and not quality. If i felt the quality was higher i would choose that over yield.


And for lighting i use 2 600hps in deep direct down lighting reflectors in a 3.5’x7’ space. Medium high light by modern standards. No co2

I can't comment on your testing because I have no Idea of your setup or anything, I will say though if your test finished 2 week early you had more issues then P ,

I think dyno grow is right about P , if used properly it will without question do what was mentioned, what I'm saying is to see the full benefit and get the most out of it it should to be combined with a couple other things, you can manipulate pre flower with temps, alone , light alone, and P alone under high light , now put the 3 together a get a bigger impact.

but ones interpretation of things is different as well , what you use for grow lighting I use for cloning and starting my little ones , so my interpretation of high intensity light is different then your.

 

[MIMedGrower]

I can't comment on your testing because I have no Idea of your setup or anything, I will say though if your test finished 2 week early you had more issues then P ,

I think dyno grow is right about P , if used properly it will without question do what was mentioned, what I'm saying is to see the full benefit and get the most out of it it should to be combined with a couple other things, you can manipulate pre flower with temps, alone , light alone, and P alone under high light , now put the 3 together a get a bigger impact.

but ones interpretation of things is different as well , what you use for grow lighting I use for cloning and starting my little ones , so my interpretation of high intensity light is different then your.

Its the lack of nitrogen that made the big difference when switching to the bloom bottles. They stay healthier longer with proper nitrogen in flower.


And in a ventilated room with no co2 the plants cant use much more light than im giving them. I want to see your successful cloning and seedlings under 2 600w hps in sun system blockbusters at 18” from the tops.

 

[Dr.Green55]

Thinking back though when I did hydro then coco I think P alone had a bigger impact in them ,then in soil.

 

[MIMedGrower]

Thinking back though when I did hydro then coco I think P alone had a bigger impact in them ,then in soil.

That makes sense because of the CEC. Alrhough you could flush and re fertilize with high p.

 

[Aqua Man]

Yeah I'm all aboard the crop steering. The more I dig into it the more everything seems to click, in my brain atleast. Definitely giving it multiple runs. I think hydro is part of the key. We can all change environment quickly but CEC and rootzone ratios not so much in soil.

 

[Dr.Green55]

[/QUOTE]

Yeah I'm all aboard the crop steering. The more I dig into it the more everything seems to click, in my brain atleast. Definitely giving it multiple runs. I think hydro is part of the key. We can all change environment quickly but CEC and rootzone ratios not so much in soil

quiker then you may think, I try to feed what my plants eat, so usually just a water the morning before let the pots dry good , then flower mix next day , for me I'm really just adding P and some K so no big change in my soil

 

[Aqua Man]

[/QUOTE]
That's a good point I could have just added a pk feed instead of a water and enzyme only.

 

[Aqua Man]

Off to bed though catch up in the AM

 

[Dr.Green55]

Its the lack of nitrogen that made the big difference when switching to the bloom bottles. They stay healthier longer with proper nitrogen in flower.


And in a ventilated room with no co2 the plants cant use much more light than im giving them. I want to see your successful cloning and seedlings under 2 600w hps in sun system blockbusters at 18” from the tops.

yeah you should do some research into it you maybe surprised ,just because you can't or don't , don't think others can't , I through my clones in my veg room under 3 times that light all 1000w commercial grade HPS DE even in my clone room I run 1000w hps

 

[MIMedGrower]

yeah you should do some research into it you maybe surprised ,just because you can't or don't , don't think others can't , I through my clones in my veg room under 3 times that light all 1000w commercial grade HPS DE even in my clone room I run 1000w hps

I have started them many times under the 600’s. But a height of 3-4 feet over.

Do you have pics of your grow to share?

 

[PlumberSoCal2]

Soil = quest work, unless you've got a lab. Hydro and coco you know what and how much and can adjust in a heartbeat if needed.

And there's no light like sunshine.

This advertisement has been brought to you by Plumber's Coco Coir the coco coir you can grow with.

 

[MIMedGrower]

Soil = quest work, unless you've got a lab. Hydro and coco you know what and how much and can adjust in a heartbeat if needed.

And there's no light like sunshine.

This advertisement has been brought to you by Plumber's Coco Coir the coco coir you can grow with.

Coco has almost half the CEC of peat. That means it is holding on to nutrients regardless of runoff.

Better hire that lab to avoid your guess work. ;-)