Ballin' On a Budget- THE RECIPE

[3 balls]

Epsom Salt/ Magnesium Sulfate

I'm not complaining because compared to the ankle grab bottled nutes I wasted money on for so many years Jack's is peanuts. I am curious about how much more $ it is for their magnesium sulfate is. As I'm sure most of you know you can get it cheaper. I'm confident they will all do the trick but does anybody know if there's an advantage in terms of consistency, QC, etc.?

 

[Observationist]

Epsom Salt/ Magnesium Sulfate

I'm not complaining because compared to the ankle grab bottled nutes I wasted money on for so many years Jack's is peanuts. I am curious about how much more $ it is for their magnesium sulfate is. As I'm sure most of you know you can get it cheaper. I'm confident they will all do the trick but does anybody know if there's an advantage in terms of consistency, QC, etc.?

Equate Pure Epsom Salt

cant go wrong.

 

[DoobieBro462]

I did not expect this post to blow up. OK, let's answer some questions:



This will work with soil and soilless like coco. Strong oxidizers like Hypochlorous acid aren't compatible with fulvic acid. In that case, you would use it as a foliar in veg/transition and flush with it in lieu of plain water.

Are you talking about the Hypochlorous acid in the tap water? Or is it in nutes also?

 

[Aqua Man]

Im just dropping in to reiterate how great this thread is and thanks again to @BillFarthing for selflessly sharing his information.

I knew this was a gem the second i seen it.

Thank you sir

 

[DoobieBro462]

Im just dropping in to reiterate how great this thread is and thanks again to @BillFarthing for selflessly sharing his information.

I knew this was a gem the second i seen it.

Thank you sir

Yea this information is great. Thank you Bill for making this and thanks Aquaman for pointing me in the right direction

 

[3 balls]

Im just dropping in to reiterate how great this thread is and thanks again to @BillFarthing for selflessly sharing his information.

I knew this was a gem the second i seen it.

Thank you sir

I couldn't agree more! Of the many fine threads on this site, many of which authored by you aquaman, I must have come back to reference this one a hundred times. I dont know what happened to @BillFarthing , I hope all is well. Hope to hear from you more.

 

[Aqua Man]

I couldn't agree more! Of the many fine threads on this site, many of which authored by you aquaman, I must have come back to reference this one a hundred times. I dont know what happened to @BillFarthing , I hope all is well. Hope to hear from you more.

Yeah hoping as most do… just a short break needed. Very kinda words brother

 

[CookiesLikeWhoa]

So hopefully this is the right place to put this.

I know this recipe and Jack's own one calls for 1gr/gallon of Epsom Salt, but I've also seen as high as 1Tbs/gallon which seems really high since that would be over 10gr/gallon. Is there a reason Jack's seems to be so light in comparison to some of the other recommendation I've seen out there?

I also read a comment Aqua made in another thread about looking at where your Cal/Mag is derived from. In my instance I have FF Cal-Mag which is Calcium Carbonate (PH buffer), Magnesium Sulfate (epsom salt yeah?) and a Soy Protein Hydrolysate (no clue what that is). So my question would be, if I use this Cal-Mag with this recipe, would I want to reduce my Epsom Salt in the other part of the recipe since it appears this cal-mag already has it in it?

 

[Aqua Man]

So hopefully this is the right place to put this.

I know this recipe and Jack's own one calls for 1gr/gallon of Epsom Salt, but I've also seen as high as 1Tbs/gallon which seems really high since that would be over 10gr/gallon. Is there a reason Jack's seems to be so light in comparison to some of the other recommendation I've seen out there?

I also read a comment Aqua made in another thread about looking at where your Cal/Mag is derived from. In my instance I have FF Cal-Mag which is Calcium Carbonate (PH buffer), Magnesium Sulfate (epsom salt yeah?) and a Soy Protein Hydrolysate (no clue what that is). So my question would be, if I use this Cal-Mag with this recipe, would I want to reduce my Epsom Salt in the other part of the recipe since it appears this cal-mag already has it in it?

This recipe i will assume someone as well versed as Bill would account only what in this recipe and any changes to products or additives would result in a change to the overall ratios intended.

Cal and mag ratios are imo more important in relation to each other as opposed to other nutrients (and this could be wrong but is my understanding with a lesser knowledge than bill on this)

So if adding cal mag they will be close to ideal ratios already and unless reducing calcium AS WELL AS magnesium you will be changing the ratios of this recipe if you only reduce the magnesium sulfate.

This also is highly dependent on the source water. But in short id say no… you would still want to add the mag sulfate as called for in his recipe to maintain ratios…

FYI ratios are the key to nutrients… when you change the ratios you change the availability of other nutrients they interact with… to get a basic idea in this look up mulders chart. Now other factors like Ph, temp. uptake pathways etc also need considered to truely understand all the interactions but that will Help show you how important ratios are….

And why this thread is such gold because @BillFarthing has done all this for you

 

[CookiesLikeWhoa]

This recipe i will assume someone as well versed as Bill would account only what in this recipe and any changes to products or additives would result in a change to the overall ratios intended.

Cal and mag ratios are imo more important in relation to each other as opposed to other nutrients (and this could be wrong but is my understanding with a lesser knowledge than bill on this)

So if adding cal mag they will be close to ideal ratios already and unless reducing calcium AS WELL AS magnesium you will be changing the ratios of this recipe if you only reduce the magnesium sulfate.

This also is highly dependent on the source water. But in short id say no… you would still want to add the mag sulfate as called for in his recipe

Thanks for the info, appreciate it!

I've started growing in coco (cana), and didn't buffer my coco, so some of the girls are paying for it now. Just didn't want to overload them on Sulfur or Magnesium, but I see it's more about balance.

Will say, this recipe has given me the best results I've ever had in my short growing career. It's amazing how these plants can take off when given the right conditions.

 

[Aqua Man]

Thanks for the info, appreciate it!

I've started growing in coco (cana), and didn't buffer my coco, so some of the girls are paying for it now. Just didn't want to overload them on Sulfur or Magnesium, but I see it's more about balance.

Will say, this recipe has given me the best results I've ever had in my short growing career. It's amazing how these plants can take off when given the right conditions.

No need to buffer coco look here. The CEC (cation exchange capacity) is far different that soil. So you buffer the nutrient solution not the media. Tgis is how you keep a stable media in coco

HOW TO WATER COCO FOR BEST RESULTS.

Ok writing this cause i see this issue often and rather have a thread to link than explain this each time. This is not my work but a collection of info from many members here and I have put into practice myself. So first off COCO is NOT soil. For best results we want to keep it saturated...

www.thcfarmer.com

 

[10piotr74]

my Jacks has 20-20-20 NPK in vegetation, should I continue to use 3,2,1 or should I change something, thank you

 

[10piotr74]

I already have a good Jacks for flowering

 

[Aqua Man]

Good is subjective… this recipe is start to finish. It addresses exactly the problem you bring up. The real issue is the bullshit the fertilizer industry spews thats full of falshood and exaggeration.

I already have a good Jacks for floweringView attachment 1249979

Can you explain to me why this is good for flowering?

 

[Anthem]

This recipe i will assume someone as well versed as Bill would account only what in this recipe and any changes to products or additives would result in a change to the overall ratios intended.

Cal and mag ratios are imo more important in relation to each other as opposed to other nutrients (and this could be wrong but is my understanding with a lesser knowledge than bill on this)

So if adding cal mag they will be close to ideal ratios already and unless reducing calcium AS WELL AS magnesium you will be changing the ratios of this recipe if you only reduce the magnesium sulfate.

This also is highly dependent on the source water. But in short id say no… you would still want to add the mag sulfate as called for in his recipe to maintain ratios…

FYI ratios are the key to nutrients… when you change the ratios you change the availability of other nutrients they interact with… to get a basic idea in this look up mulders chart. Now other factors like Ph, temp. uptake pathways etc also need considered to truely understand all the interactions but that will Help show you how important ratios are….

And why this thread is such gold because @BillFarthing has done all this for you

First of all, Jacks is just the recommended base fertilizer if you read thru this enough times. With that being said, Aqua Man is 100 percent spot on about the ratio of Calcium to Magnesium. Jacks is designed to be ran presently at 3.79 grams of base, 2.52 grams of Calcium Nitrate and .99 grams per gallon of Magnesium sulfate. This is with RO water and the 5-12-26 formula. That being said, if you start to change the ratio of Calcium Nitrate and Magnesium Sulfate you are messing with something that is going to directly effect the quality and yield of your plants. Calcium has an antagonistic relationship with both Magnesium and P. You have to be careful with changing these ratios because what you are doing by changing these ratios is creating a situation were one nutrient will lock out the other because of the antagonistic relationship between them. Once you create this sort of a problem it takes weeks to fix and the yield and quality go way down. The one take away I will add is that in certain situations, High PPFD LED's along with injecting CO2 can cause the plant to require additional Calcium. Chased this for a long time and the best way to deal with this is to replace the Calcium Nitrate with Pure Cal. but Pure Cal is hard to find and you really need a good understanding of when and how much of it to use. Again this is only required under high PPFD and Co2 injection. Along with these the environment must also be in check. If you just read and follow what Bill has outlined in this thread and has posted on several other forums you will be successful and at a much lower cost than any liquid fertilizer you can buy. It is simple and effective, just follow at outlined. If the results are not the best you have ever had it is because you messed something up.
Here is a tip, Jacks is mixed not in the 3-2-1 order but 3-1-2 order. Always silica first, Jacks part A, epsom salt and than Calcium nitrate.

 

[10piotr74]

Good is subjective… this recipe is start to finish. It addresses exactly the problem you bring up. The real issue is the bullshit the fertilizer industry spews thats full of falshood and exaggeration.


Can you explain to me why this is good for flowering?

NPK 10-30-20

 

[Aqua Man]

NPK 10-30-20

Now why is that good for flower?

Just getting you to think about what we think we know

 

[10piotr74]

Now why is that good for flower?

Just getting you to think about what we think we know

as flowering does not require high nitrogen concentration, phosphorus and potassium are more important

 

[Anthem]

as flowering does not require high nitrogen concentration, phosphorus and potassium are more important

That is completely untrue. That is someone telling you something that is not true. The plant needs nitrogen, if it did not Jacks would have a separate formula for flower. You can use the same formula from start to finish.

 

[Aqua Man]

That is completely untrue. That is someone telling you something that is not true. The plant needs nitrogen, if it did not Jacks would have a separate formula for flower. You can use the same formula from start to finish.

Exactly this ^^^ we are told by ppl who have interest in profits that that’s the case but it is untrue