Boss's light test. LEDvsHIDvs Maybe Bad boy.

[LBZ Farmer]

Try twice as many chips run at half the intensity, so it looks like the same amount of light while producing WAY more heat. It's a cool optical illusion though, as you can only see what I'm talking about if you wear a pair of sunglasses and view them side by side with 1W LED's. Match those weaker outputs to a 120 degree lens that's 4x less intense, and Super Power is the last word you'd use to describe it. I mean the panels are black...that should speak volumes about the people who supposedly did the development work behind their panels, which are readily available on Alibaba...

Please Explain this a little....
For the most part 1 watt = 1 watt of heat
Color of the panel should be insignificant unless your LED lights are shining back on the panel. Are your lights shining back on the panel?

 

[Crysmatic]

great job on these comparison grows!

farmers who have bought LED luminaires off alibaba have had great results. so the consensus is: great for veg, not the biggest flowers, but tonnes of crystal.

maybe there's not one light that is best for all stages of flowering. can you use hps for big flowers, and switch to LED the last two weeks to pump up trichomes? how about you switch a couple plants under hps to led? then you still have two plants under hps to compare.

chameleon grow systems has light emitting plasma, 'equivalent' to a 1000w hps with only 434w. supposedly full spectrum, low heat, and cheaper than LED. next comparo? ;)

 

[BOSSMAN88188]

So as you can see in the pics I burned all of them.
I had the Led at 8 inches and it did a pretty good burn job. The HID was at 12 inches and burn them. And the Bad boy really shocked me. I had been running another brand of flower bulbs. Last weak my hydro store finally got me the Quantum flower bulbs. And I could totally see the difference in brightness. So I raised the lights from 10 to 12 inches. And it still burnt the hell out of them. Damn near dropped all its big leafs. I have been raising it a couple inches a day. It is at a bout 18 inches now. Next run I will have to start at 24 inches and work it down to hope fully 12 inches.

It can be hard to tell in the pics. But the Led girls look the healthiest. Though its nuggs are half the size of the Hid and the Bad boy.
I do think the training was a problem. So next run I do expect the Led will do much better.


Pics 1 through 4 LED.

Pics 5 through 8 HID.

Pics 9 through 12 Bad boy.

 

[motherlode]

hmmm nugs on the led are half the size of even a t5 fixture?

I would never in a million years have guessed that wood be the case! go figure...

 

[motherlode]

Size and density are two very different things. We have seen similar results in other LED vs HID side by side tests, and the LED plants while smaller tend to produce near equal weight due to their density. The HID also normally takes a quick lead in the beginning of flowering. The LED's tend to pack on the most weight during the last few weeks, and in many instances "catch back up" on size. Bossman will likely have slightly lower yields (10-15%) with his LED on this first round in comparison to HID, but normally our testers do better on the second round as they've learned a thing or two about growing with LED. There is a learning curve, albeit small, but once you get it down you will learn how to rock your garden with LED's and get equal or better yields to a HID that uses literally 300W more power. ;)

I been growing indoors since the early 80's and I still work with primarily MH, specifically agrosun warm deluxe bulbs because I never bought into the whole HPS is better argument.

It took me almost 20 years to even try HPS and the only reason I did really was because I bought some 600 watt systems where the only MH bulb you can get is a conversion.

a few grows ago I did a 4 x 8 with a mh over one side and a hps on the other - everything else about the table was the same: strain, nutes, medium and feeding schedule. The stuff under the mh smelled, tasted and looked better then the stuff under the hps - the difference in weight was minimal (544 grams MH and 561 grams hps) the plants in the middle that had the benefit of both lights had noticeably bigger buds and colas, but I had placed the biggest plants in the middle from the start anyhow.

My bottom line is quality smoke, not grams per watt and for me nothing beats MH light!

sorry bossman - didnt mean to hijack your thread. I enjoy your grow logs and have utmost respect for your skills!

 

[Snafu]

i am new around here but just dropped into thread and was wondering where i can pick up leds from ledgirl?

thanks for the info in this thread as well!

 

[MediMary]

i feel we need someone from quantum in here repping his badboy..lol
great test bossman

 

[BOSSMAN88188]

hmmm nugs on the led are half the size of even a t5 fixture?

I would never in a million years have guessed that wood be the case! go figure...

I am really impressed with the T5 Bad boy.

Size and density are two very different things. We have seen similar results in other LED vs HID side by side tests, and the LED plants while smaller tend to produce near equal weight due to their density. The HID also normally takes a quick lead in the beginning of flowering. The LED's tend to pack on the most weight during the last few weeks, and in many instances "catch back up" on size. Bossman will likely have slightly lower yields (10-15%) with his LED on this first round in comparison to HID, but normally our testers do better on the second round as they've learned a thing or two about growing with LED. There is a learning curve, albeit small, but once you get it down you will learn how to rock your garden with LED's and get equal or better yields to a HID that uses literally 300W more power. ;)

I do beleive that with the second run it will be much closer a race.

I been growing indoors since the early 80's and I still work with primarily MH, specifically agrosun warm deluxe bulbs because I never bought into the whole HPS is better argument.

It took me almost 20 years to even try HPS and the only reason I did really was because I bought some 600 watt systems where the only MH bulb you can get is a conversion.

a few grows ago I did a 4 x 8 with a mh over one side and a hps on the other - everything else about the table was the same: strain, nutes, medium and feeding schedule. The stuff under the mh smelled, tasted and looked better then the stuff under the hps - the difference in weight was minimal (544 grams MH and 561 grams hps) the plants in the middle that had the benefit of both lights had noticeably bigger buds and colas, but I had placed the biggest plants in the middle from the start anyhow.

My bottom line is quality smoke, not grams per watt and for me nothing beats MH light!

sorry bossman - didnt mean to hijack your thread. I enjoy your grow logs and have utmost respect for your skills!

Cant agree more bro. Quality is the most important.

i am new around here but just dropped into thread and was wondering where i can pick up leds from ledgirl?

thanks for the info in this thread as well!

Hey bro,
IMO I would not use any Led other then Led girls.

i feel we need someone from quantum in here repping his badboy..lol
great test bossman

I think the light is doing pretty good repping itself.

http://www.hydrogrowled.com


Bossman, what are the dimensions of the LED Scrog?

It is not a prefect square. It is a 3x3.

 

[Tobor the 8th Man]

How many days/weeks you at now?

I am finding my buds under my LED to be extremely hard and dense. I haven't done the strain before so I don't know what the buds would look like under HID but they do seem smaller than expected. However they are much more dense than expected.

What are the smells of the buds like Bossman? Are the ones under LED giving off the same odors as the others?

You are doing a good job keeping this going. Your scrog canopy need some improvement next time but otherwise you are doing good Bossman.

 

[Night Howl]

Hey Boss, excellent work on the test, very informative. Reading this thread is what made me join this forum. The strength of the Bad Boy convinced me to buy it. Picked up the 8 bulb model for veg. I've been using MH for veg, but from what I've seen fluoros give much tighter internode spacing. Being a Sativa junky, that will be a big help!

 

[Lost]

Ledgrl - How many panels would you need to hit the same coverage as the 400? I thinking 2 panels which would make it a watt for watt grow..30x30 is smaller than what a 400 hps can cover. Not to mention 400's are the worst HPS comparison because the 400's are terribly inefficient. A 600 would have been a better comparison, but again, i think your looking at the least a watt to watt thing in flower.

I just think people should know :)

 

[motherlode]

^^^
you are such a good rep for your product :rofl

 

[greenthumbdanny]

relax and smoke a bowl LEDGirl

:passingjoint:

gtd

 

[Lost]

400W HPS in a 3x3 area = 44.44 watts per square foot. Anyone thinking it can do bigger than that while still producing decent buds is either a complete amateur, or just doesn't understand the 50W per square foot rule with HID. But thanks again Lost for trying to exaggerate the capabilities of HID, we all know what they CAN'T do (except you of course).

As for a watt to watt comparison, 2x205W lights would still pull over 100W less power than a 400W HID without any ventilation or A/C, so try try again. They would also cover a larger area...ouch.

And as far as your "400's are terribly inefficient" post that highlights your ignorance, click here:

400W HPS = 55,000 lumens (137.5 lumens per watt)
600W HPS = 88,000 lumens (146.7 lumens per watt)
1000W HPS = 145,000 lumens (145 lumens per watt)

So is Lost going to start telling all the 1000W guys that they're lights are inefficient now too? Or how about CFL guys? All because they aren't as high in lumens per watt as a 600W HPS? Or how about the fact that the difference in lumens per watt vs the 400W and 600W is only 6.3%??? Or that the difference between the 400W and 1000W in lumens per watt is only 5.2%??? Or how about the fact that lumens have nothing to do with plant growth? So now in Lost's world, terribly inefficient means about 5% less lumens per watt. If anyone else can match his level of ignorance mixed with arrogance, jump on board!

Did I forget to mention that full spectrum (white) LED's have already surpassed 160 lumens per watt? That makes them more efficient yet than any form of HID! I guess Lost is just poorly educated on lighting.

Yea, im poorly educated. :)


You don't understand its all about intensity huh?

Its ok, i know you have a product to sell. But please don't put words into my mouth. Your the one that said he needed to go 30 inches by 30 inches. Thats the footprint you said.

Im not going to muddy bossmann's thread, but if you would like to start a new thread in another forum, i'd be more than happy to tell you how awesome you leds are.

Im not going to lower myself to your level and start name calling. Have a nice day :evilgrin0013:

 

[Lost]

You right, I don't grow myself.. (seriously? you called me out on not being a grower? Really?? hahah Serious?)

I could care less about some university. The proof is in the pudding hun.. Your in California now.. Why don't you check out how the big boys grow? In a billion dollar industry you don't think that smarter people than you have worked on this problem and they still use HPS? Oh, thats right, I don't grow, and If I do, I must have no idea what im doing. Right?



Keep grasping at straws.

edit:Mods, can you pull out ledgrl's and I's post and make a thread Lost VS Ledgrl, The Death Match!

 

[Night Howl]

......Clip

You right, I don't grow myself.. (seriously?...
edit:Mods, can you pull out ledgrl's and I's post and make a thread Lost VS Ledgrl, The Death Match!

Hey Lost, be looking for a PM from me once I can send them...

Is this gonna be a no holds barred, falls anywhere, cage, tables ladders & chairs, or just plain old last man standing match?? :evilgrin0013:

 

[l0g1c4l]

I'm just excited to see the end results! Awesome thread so far bossman!

 

[MediMary]

yeah bossman I agree the badboy is repping itself, I am stoked for your test, but having one person constantly repping their product, putting others down, I think it would nice to have a equal advertising campaign going on in here, as it is now, kinda one sided from the marketing standpoint.

 

[Night Howl]

Agreed Mary, let the product stand on it's own merit. A rep should answer ?'s and rise above the bickering. These pissing matches only serve to turn a potential customer against even wanting to try the 'next big thing'.

Now, back on topic. Bossman, my BadBoy has buttons that allow me to run 4 or 8 lights. Does yours have this feature? I may email Quantum about the setup. Currently, I can switch on or off one side or the other. I believe being able to run the middle 4 bulbs or all 8 makes more sense. This way you can spread out the light output as your plants grow. With the current setup, you would have to move your plants when going from 4 to 8 bulbs.

Does anyone else feel this would be a better configuration?

 

[Pandaman]

Coverage

Since I'm growing in a 4x4 tent, coverage doesn't seem to be an issue even though my LED doesn't cover 4x4. I used to be hung up about how many plants I could put under the light because my grow area is fixed at 4x4.

If I was growing in a 10x10 room and I knew that I could get more LED's and add them to the grow without affecting the overall temps very much and at the same time greatly increase my production... Great!

I guess my point is, if we had the opportunity to add another 1000w HID and see great results... We would :). Same applies to LED. With the added benefit of low heat, we have more potential to get the most out the plants in a similar sized grow area, imo.

Not hatin on HID or the awesome vert grows. Props to the vert growers! I love reading the vert grows and wishing I had the space to do it (I'm in an apt... sigh). Got two 1000w's waiting in storage for the day when I can use them again.

Great work Bossman!

Peace